Can a bad review kill a course?

[Dale_McCallon]

I read once that two thumbs up from Siskel and Ebert was worth millions of dollars to a movie.  Same can be said for a favorable restaurant review.  Likewise, poor reviews could doom any new venture.

But what about golf courses?  If Whitten, Klein, etc really ripped a new course would it be destined to fail?  I really don't pay much attention to these reviews (I'm more in the Huckaby camp that if it's golf, it worth playing), but someone must read them or magazines wouldn't publish them.  I know people on this site often reference the Doak 0's, but besides us geeks, how many people have read the CG?

I wonder what would have happened if Bandon Dunes did not get the massive positive publicity it got upon opening.  Would people really have gone way out of there way to play there if Golf Digest panned it?

Has it ever happened?  Has a critic so harshly ripped a new course publicly that it couldn't overcome it?

[Jeff_Brauer]

Interesting point, but Ron and Brad will tell you few readers are interested enough in golf design to have signifigant impact.  They may be wrong though.  Certainly, getting a good review, such as a "Best New" designation, helps business, so maybe the reverse is true.

Local papers might have an impact if they did a bad review, but few do that.  I think word of mouth and first play go the longest to determining sucess.

[Garland Bayley]

I have no data, but I think a good review is crucial. It seems to me that some of the course developments are spending, and therefore pricing, at a level that requires a good review and ranking to succeed. Part of this is getting the right architect and paying him a lot in an attemt to secure the ranking and the good reviews.

I don't follow the examples closely, but I am sure there are people on this site that can name the courses that have gone under once or twice before being sold at a price that the new owner could sustain the course under.

[rjsimper]

Depends on the arena.  If we rip a course on this site, nobody cares.  Negative reviews are often unseen.

GD or GW does not have an article or column for "Worst New"

How many "poor" reviews have you ever seen and where have you seen them?

My guess is that they are in VERY VERY VERY narrowly-focused arenas.  If you hear of a course through anything other than word of mouth or a forum-setting, chances are it's because it's generally liked for one or more reasons.

Would the golfing world at large know about Tierra Rejada or Eagle Glen?  Doubt it.  Those are two poor courses in the LA area that charge near 100 bucks a round.  Likewise, I haven't heard of any poor courses in the East anywhere but on this site or through word of mouth.

I do, however, hear about the small modest clubs that get national recognition in the travel pages of GD, or  in the Best New or Top 100 Affordable rankings.

Seems to me that reviews are only seen on a transcendent level when they are positive, or at least espouse a virtue of the course.  If the course sucks, it doesn't make it to print.

Yes, a bad review would murder a course.  Thing is, there just aren't bad reviews that are visible enough to matter.  At a local level, negative word of mouth is the worst review you can get.

[Dale_McCallon]

Depends on the arena.  If we rip a course on this site, nobody cares.  Negative reviews are often unseen.

GD or GW does not have an article or column for "Worst New"

How many "poor" reviews have you ever seen and where have you seen them?

My guess is that they are in VERY VERY VERY narrowly-focused arenas.  If you hear of a course through anything other than word of mouth or a forum-setting, chances are it's because it's generally liked for one or more reasons.

Would the golfing world at large know about Tierra Rejada or Eagle Glen?  Doubt it.  Those are two poor courses in the LA area that charge near 100 bucks a round.  Likewise, I haven't heard of any poor courses in the East anywhere but on this site or through word of mouth.

I do, however, hear about the small modest clubs that get national recognition in the travel pages of GD, or  in the Best New or Top 100 Affordable rankings.

Seems to me that reviews are only seen on a transcendent level when they are positive, or at least espouse a virtue of the course.  If the course sucks, it doesn't make it to print.

Yes, a bad review would murder a course.  Thing is, there just aren't bad reviews that are visible enough to matter.  At a local level, negative word of mouth is the worst review you can get.

So are you saying that there are no negative reviews ever written.  If this is the case, then are they really reviews or just travel brochures?

[rjsimper]

Yes, in national publications, I think very few to no poor reviews are published.

Is it a review if it doesn't point out the negative? Sure it is, just not a very critical one.  My reviews tend to accentuate the positive while still addressing the negative.  I assume the best and deduct from there, while a more critical eye than mine might assume the worst, and add points for all done right.

It is in this area where the parallel to movies does not hold, as there are TONS of movies that are critically panned every day.  

I will stand corrected if there are counter-examples, but I cannot think of a national publication that has run a negative review on a course.  

The only exceptions I can see that beg for a negative feature to be written are high-profile designs like Trump West and Wynn...other than that, you don't hear much about the "Gigli", "Glitter", and "Godfather 3"s of the golf world.

[ChasLawler]

So are you saying that there are no negative reviews ever written.  If this is the case, then are they really reviews or just travel brochures?

I'd say yes.

What owner/club in his right mind would give free golf/access to someone who might write a negative review on his golf course?

Shoot...even the Morrissetts shy away from writing negative reviews in their course profiles. Beyond lack of time, there's probably a reason why every notable golf course they have played isn’t profiled on this website.

[Dale_McCallon]

So are you saying that there are no negative reviews ever written.  If this is the case, then are they really reviews or just travel brochures?

I'd say yes.

What owner/club in his right mind would give free golf/access to someone who might write a negative review on his golf course?

Shoot...even the Morrissetts shy away from writing negative reviews in their course profiles. Beyond lack of time, there's probably a reason why every notable golf course they have played isn’t profiled on this website.

Do course owners set up all of their reviews?  If so, of course no one would want a potentially bad write-up.

But, if my understanding of food critics is right,  no one knows when the food critic is at his/her restaurant.  I always thought they were just regular paying customers.

If this is the case, why couldn't a critic, just walk into a public course, play it and judge it objectively.  I'm sure it is a different case when trying to gain access to a private.

[ChasLawler]

But, if my understanding of food critics is right,  no one knows when the food critic is at his/her restaurant.  I always thought they were just regular paying customers.

If this is the case, why couldn't a critic, just walk into a public course, play it and judge it objectively.  I'm sure it is a different case when trying to gain access to a private.

The big magazines aren't going to waste their money paying their writers greens fees and travel expense. If they start publishing negative reviews, who's going to comp them, and more importantly who's going to advertise in their magazine.

Like Ryan said, there are genuine reviews out there, but it's generally chat room and blog-like in nature.

[rgkeller]

>>Likewise, poor reviews could doom any new venture.<<

That is why new golf resorts buy ads.

[Steve Lapper]

No....but an endorsement from Matt Ward might just work

[Mike Vegis @ Kiawah]

We had the editor of one of the major golf publications do a story on Golf in the Charleston, SC area and, while we got generally glowing reviews, a few of the other courses in the area go hammered.  One in particular was a daily-fee course which I'm sure took a financial hit.

We also had the travel editor of one of the major publications (who was writing for their smaller weekly magazine) take a good swipe at our former Inn (the Kiawah Island Inn which was closed after The Sanctaury at Kiawah Island Golf Resort opened up).  

While from the general public's standpoint, they may seem like softball travel pieces, they do often show the warts and it can have an impact on the courses/resorts/accommodations they review.

[rjsimper]

Mike -
I definitely think that it needs to be made clear that there is a distinction between golf course and golf resort reviews - the latter of which can often be MORE scathing because the price is always factored in.  If considering Pebble Beach a golf resort, one reviewer is in a 500/night basic room at the Del Monte Lodge and finds roaches and cobwebs, then I fully expect him to write a brutal condemnation of the accomodations.  Just like the situation at your inn...

But you won't find negative reviews of Temecula Creek Inn in golf publications - or far less often will you find something where the resort and lodging is praised and the golf course is afterthought.  Any time the course is the primary focus, I believe the review will be a generally positive review.

Bring other factors in play, and look out.

[Rick Shefchik]

When I was writing golf reviews for my newspaper, I'd occasionally write a negative review. I can think of at least four off the top of my head that were mostly negative; others would certainly mention features I didn't like, even if the overall tone of the review was positive.

I never told the courses I was coming to play them. Often I received very nice -- and surprised -- notes from the owners if I wrote a positive reviews. I tended to hear from players who liked the courses I panned, not the management.

I have no idea how much influence those reviews had, but my guess would be they got a few extra tee times the week a positive review ran, and maybe they lost a few if the review was negative. After a week or so, the direct impact was over. Still, any review becomes part of the word of mouth that begins to circulate about a course, and ultimately affects its business.

My hunch is that a course that does proper market research isn't going to be affected too much by reviews, positive or negative. If there's a need or pent-up desire for the course, it's going to survive unless it's truly putrid -- in which case, a negative review isn't going to matter.

[archie_struthers]

Good reviews are critical to almost any project. Why do so many builder/developers, real estate moguls insist on a "name" architect. It sells!!!!!

[Jonathan Cummings]

My sense is no.  

I'm sure not on the same scale as a Doak/Whitten/Klein.  But of the many mid-atlantic reviews I've written for, for a number of regional magazines, I've heard precious few - "I'm going to play there because of the Cummings review" or, "I'm not going to get anywhere near the place because of the Cummings review".

Golfers seem to make there own choice driven, more likely, on where their pals want to play.

JC

[Tom_Doak]

There are no reviews of golf courses which are seen and respected by enough readers to make much of an impact.

Of the dozen courses which I gave the dreaded "zero" in The Confidential Guide, one (Cypress GC) no longer exists, and at least two others have had complete makeovers.  But I doubt the review had much to do with it at all ... my guess is the quality of the architecture reaped its own reward in the marketplace.

Word of mouth is far more important than reviews.  If it gets around town that a course is in poor condition, it's toast.  That's one of the reasons it bothered me that Apache Stronghold's condition got headlines even though the GOLFWEEK panelists were still rating it highly.

[rjsimper]

Tom - I assume you mean there are no "negative" reviews that are seen and respected enough...right?

Cypress GC - as in Los Alamitos, CA?  Or another Cypress...