[paul cowley]

Marc....where is the green in the photo?  to the left or below the left bay of the clubhouse ?

[Marc Haring]

Paul

The green is actually way left of the clubhouse. The seven bunkers in a row extend up the right side of the hole and the two greenside bunkers protect the right side pin placement. The left edge of the green is at the far left side of the picture.

[Marc Haring]

Mr Johnson.

Thanks very much for your response. I too have read the chapter you are referring to so thanks for reminding me of the pertinent details. Michael Hurdzan goes a long way in explaining the intangible aspects that go to make up the golfing experience. For example, as you mentioned before the understated entrance to Pine Valley, is that actually part of the charm. Is it a case of the club being able to say ‘we are about golf and not all the peripheral benefits that are taken for granted at lesser clubs’.

Look hard and play easy is a very good observation by Hurdzan and that’s the sort of thing I need to explore. One other thing though and that’s the importance of getting the price right. I think Hurdzan mentions this in his chapter; so much of whether a golf experience is ultimately a positive or negative one is down to the cost of the game. It’s the price that has the main influence on expectation and therefore the price will dictate whether or not the course lives up to those expectations.

[Sean Walsh]

Take out 4 bunkers on the right.  Not the preferred side to come in from anyway.

Place one bunker approx 200-220yds carry on the left.  Two reasons.  

Challenge the better player to make a decision re the preferred line of play.  Take the bunker on or choose a safer less advantageous line.

Gives the poorer player a chance of salvation as his wayward ball heads towards the OB. I can see him now yelling at his ball to "Get in the bunker" and being happy when it does.

Re the golfing experience.  OB on the last not a very nice way for the hacker to remember his day.  Give him the choice between poor line of play and OB.  He'll choose poor line take his bogey and walk off reasonably happy.

[Marc Haring]

Sean.

I would agree with you if the hole was about 440 yards but being 350 off the tips, taking out those bunkers will mean everyone  just blasts it up the right and leaves themselves a flick in with a wedge which would be an easy shot even from the semi. Though we could take those bunkers out and then do something with the greenside bunker to make it a real factor but as you know, any half decent player with a wedge in their hand won't even see the bunker.

[Sean Walsh]

2nd attempt

Leave 3rd bunker from right.  What's that about 260yds carry
Add bunker 200-220 on left
Add bunker 220-240 yds centre left of fairway.

Still provides the same options for the hacker and challenges the better golfer even more.  

[Marc Haring]

Yeah I like attempt number 2 alot. We could even extend that 3rd bunker on the right into the fairway a little just to give them the full 3 options: go for the carry, lay up short or thread it through the gap.

[Marc Haring]

Although it is a little off the subject, I was so impressed with Sean’s suggestions that I carried them out.

Here’s the original


And here’s the changed version. An improvement?

[Mike_Trenham]

This may get me kicked off this site but...

Focus on the people, get some people around there with some personality and let them have fun, this includes the staff.  On here we over empahsize the importance of the architecture and maintenance meld etc.   Create some life around the place.  A month ago we had a 10 man roll for drinks one night, we are still laughing about poor Lou who's wife probably saw the bill last week.   We have waiter/caddie at our club that is a riot and a great guy he would not last a day at a TGI Fridays or a resort course.  

[Sean Walsh]

Marc,

By the way.  I like the look of the clubhouse

[paul cowley]

Its looking alot better from here guys....maybe add another bunker short left to shore up the side and help frame the landing area for the shorter hitters.....straightening out the wavy cut lines on a very slight diagonal would help also.

Marc , if you were able to achieve these changes in-house ,I think you would be well within budjet.

....Merry Xmas to all [and why aren't my kids up yet? ].

[paul cowley]

....kids still not up.....I'm resisting an urge to move the entire fairway to the right of the rightside bunker [so you are aiming at the clubhouse] ,and let shots feed down past it ,tieing into the farthest fairway, creating more of a dogleg ...and letting the old fairway become gnarly rough.......but exploratory surgery from a photo without  benifit of a topo or seeing the site constraints [if there is room for it and safety concerns ], is very risky indeed.

[TEPaul]

Paul:

I like your ideas. I say if you have ground where the ball will really move off the line it's hit---use that ground! Is it better to use ground where the ball will stay on its line once it hits the ground or the opposite? To me, the answer is obvious. The latter is more to think about and that's the name of the game!

This, I think, is a technique Tom Doak has used in various situations (particularly Stonewall) and to really good effect---but of course I don't mean to imply he's the only one!   This is a feature that frankly makes the truly world class #5 Merion everything it is---both on the drive but particularly on the approach shot!!

[ForkaB]

I'm with Mike T. regarding the importance of people.

The more everybody working for the club/course knows and loves golf the better.  Ideally all staff should be members, or have full playing privileges.  They should know and be able to  call as many members as possible by their first name.  It's hard to have an optimum golfing experience when your green staff are mostly illegal aliens and your bar staff don't know the difference between a bogey and a birdie, and neither cares who you are or what you scored today.

So, Marc, I'd start by getting that Board of yours to start learning the game of golf.  If they don't know what a "golfing experience" is in th efirst place, how are they going to know when and if it has improved?

[TEPaul]

Mike Trenham:

That guy at your club sounds like Mike the bartender at my course. I don't believe we've had a serious word in 30 years. The last time I was there I told him I just came over to the course to harrass him and he told me in that case if I wanted something to drink I could damn well get it myself!

[Tony Ristola]

Doug:  Your post on page 1 is a howler...

Marc:  What is the history of the property? The region?  Is there a stry to tell?  Is there anything you can use to create a theme which runs through the golf course, clubhouse, staff?  Anything which pull everything together into a singular identity?

[Sean Walsh]

My third option was going to be:

Make fairway out of the hillside.  Leave the four bunkers.  Move the green 20-30yds right.  Behind the fourth bunker.  Keep fairway both left and right of the bunkers.

The reason I didn't post this was that I figured moving the green would incur more than the stated budget.  

Congrats to Paul for beating me to it.  

[Tags:]

Tags:

[Tags:]

Tags:

Call to undefined function theme_linktree()