Most starting points for 18 holes?

[Paul_Turner]

Bill McBride commented that Cuscowilla has 4 loops.

Any course with even more?

I can only think of one old course in the UK that has 4 starting points close to the clubhouse, although I wouldn't really call them all loops:  Moseley GC with 1-7,8-9,10-15,16-18

[TEPaul]

For all intents and purposes Sunnehanna has five;
1-2
3-6
7-9
10-16
17-18

[mark chalfant]

Paul, I think Rolling Green has four : 1,3, 10,15.

[TEPaul]

Mark:

Correct. Flynn does it again. Obviously it's much easier to do this type of thing if an architect is able to surround the clubhouse with golf holes---eg put the clubhouse somewhere in the center of things but some architects, such as Ross, thought placing the clubhouse in one corner of the property was more efficient and functional for other things such as access and egress onto the property (without running road and such across golf holes) and for parking and service related things.

[wsmorrison]

The Kittansett Club of Marion, MA is basically a counter-clockwise out and back routing.  The tee on the 9th hole is as far from the clubhouse as it gets.  Yet a golfer can play various courses within a course routings depending upon the number of holes time allows and whether you park at the clubhouse or at the maintenance buildings.

From the clubhouse:

1-18 (18 holes)
1 and 18 (2 holes)
1,2,17,18 (4 holes)
1-5, 15-18 (9 holes)

From the maintenance facility

10-12 (3 holes)
10,8,9  (3 holes)
13-17, 2-9 (13 holes)
13-17, 2-12 (16 holes)
13-18, 1-9 (15 holes)
13-18, 1-12 (18 holes)

[Bill_McBride]

On the other hand there are lots of courses with but one starting point: Pebble Beach, Cypress Point, The Old Course, North Berwick.  Hmmm, there's a pattern here!

[wsmorrison]

"10-16, 3-14, 11-12, 8-9, 17-18 (or 19)"

While those are some interesting progression of holes, the walk from 16 green to 3 tee is over 100 yards, 12 green to 8 tee is nearly 190 yards, and 9 green to 17 tee is about 150 yards.

Likewise, "...last week I played 16, 3-7, 13-15, 10, 11, 12, 8, 9, 17, 2, 19, 1,18 in that order"

The walk from the clubhouse to 16 tee is about 175 yards, 7 green to 13 tee about 150 yards, 12 green to 8 tee about 190 yards, and 9 green to 17 tee 150 yards.

Clearly, some of Flynn's routing at Lehigh works well as sets of holes within the 18/19.  But the above two routing iterations are a bit disjointed.

By the way, Bill, who designed and/or built the 19th hole and when?

[mark chalfant]

Paul, Canterbury (Herbert Strong) near Cleveland also has four possibilties.They are:
1-3
4-9
10-15
16-18

The neat thing about these "clusters" is that holes 1,4,10,and
16 are among the most challenging on the course.1 and 4 are
strong driving holes. 10 is a feisty short par four. 16 is a gorgeous long hole that ascends and tumbles for nearly 600 yards.

[lesueur]

On an international note, Riffa Golf Club in Bahrain has 5:

http://www.riffagolfclub.com/pages/map.htm

1-2
3-5
6-9
10-11
12-18

It works well here because in the extreme heat of the Middle East it's sometimes only possible to play a couple of holes before collapsing with heat exhaustion! The course is now floodlit so members can go out and play a few holes either before or after work in relative comfort.

[Chris_Clouser]

I remember a post about this a couple of years ago.  Blackwolf Run may have been used as an example by someone.  I'm sure someone has done a routing with 6 loops of three.

But like Flynn, Perry Maxwell did this on most of his courses.  Twin Hills in Oklahoma City is probably the best example with five holes returning to the clubhouse.  The loops were
1-3
4-7
8-9
10-13
14-18

This was his primary routing technique running off of a central elevation feature (usually the highest point on the site) and running many holes from and into that spot.  Southern Hills is a prime example of this technique as well.  Definately six holes and one could argue seven holes feed off of that main hill.  At Muskogee he did this as well very effectively.  At most courses though he only had three or four mini-loops.  

[Philippe Binette]

Royal Melbourne West has 5 wthin a short walk from the house

1st
3rd
7th
8th
10th

[TEPaul]

How would some of you like to see a golf course that could  virtually be "courses" within a single course? Doing something like that well would seem to be the ultimate test of golf design particularly if it was done in such a way that a golfer really wouldn't notice another course when he was playing any one. From differing vantage points it would be something like a Rorschach Test!  

[Dave_Miller]

Bill McBride commented that Cuscowilla has 4 loops.

Any course with even more?

I can only think of one old course in the UK that has 4 starting points close to the clubhouse, although I wouldn't really call them all loops:  Moseley GC with 1-7,8-9,10-15,16-18

Does this have to be only one course?  Pinehurst has five courses ,one through five, that start at the main club house.
Best,
Dave

[Brian_Gracely]

Warren Course at Notre Dame has like 4 holes that start near the clubhouse...I think it's 1, 7, 10, 16.  Somewhat similar to Cuscowilla....wonder where the designers got the idea?