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Paul Richards

What's new in Denver golf?
« on: March 21, 2004, 06:59:17 AM »
During my last visit to Denver, I played the Homestead at Murphy's Creek, which I enjoyed tremendously, and wrote, at some length about, here on GCA as it was an excellent course for a very reasonable green fee.

Am wondering what, if anything, is 'new' in Denver golf?

What's worth seeing?

I have already played the 'big' names - Cherry Hills, Castle Pines, Sanctuary - and am looking for another architecturally interesting place to play.

Thanks in advance.

"Something has to change, otherwise the never-ending arms race that benefits only a few manufacturers will continue to lead to longer courses, narrower fairways, smaller greens, more rough, more expensive rounds, and other mechanisms that will leave golf's future in doubt." -  TFOG

A_Clay_Man

Re:What's new in Denver golf?
« Reply #1 on: March 21, 2004, 08:12:25 AM »
Paul- Going on the third year of less than stellar water conditions, there's not too much new, to talk about, that I'm aware of. Assuming you'll be there before July, Antler Creek won't be open yet, and I believe there is enough architecture there to keep you busy. (8100 yds.) ;D Honestly though, from my tour, (with the archie) I felt Rick used the natural features well within the holes and there were a couple of instances where the vistas were not housing and quite breath taking. Some surrounds looked like Sand Hills, and then when the course turns west, Pikes Peak looms large, being east of Colorado Springs.

Riverdale dunes is one you did not mention. As someone who is familiar with BWR, Riverdale is an interesting study because it was built before the original course in Kohler. There are a couple instances where you can feel the learning curve. Which does imply, it ain't no river course, but, If for no other reason, the muni make-up and corresponding GREAT conditioning, should be a model for affordable quality golf. I really hope it's as succesful, subtexturally, as it appears on the surface.
« Last Edit: March 21, 2004, 08:13:23 AM by Adam Clayman »

Paul Richards

Re:What's new in Denver golf?
« Reply #2 on: March 21, 2004, 10:57:26 AM »
Adam:

Thanks for the info.  Actually, I'll be there the first week or so of April, so I understand the weather can be shakey...
"Something has to change, otherwise the never-ending arms race that benefits only a few manufacturers will continue to lead to longer courses, narrower fairways, smaller greens, more rough, more expensive rounds, and other mechanisms that will leave golf's future in doubt." -  TFOG

Brad Swanson

Re:What's new in Denver golf?
« Reply #3 on: March 21, 2004, 10:59:07 AM »
New?  Not much, but here's one.  http://www.fossiltrace.com
http://www.golfclubatlas.com/forums2/index.php?board=1;action=display;threadid=12483

Architecturally interesting?  Riverdale Dunes, as Adam mentioned,  Green Valley Ranch Golf Course (http://www.gvrgolf.com) is decent.  I like the Ridge at Castle Pines North for a more upscale public course.  

Cheers,
Brad Swanson

Paul Richards

Re:What's new in Denver golf?
« Reply #4 on: March 21, 2004, 08:52:29 PM »
Adam and Brad and anyone else:

Someone sent me the public list of Denver courses that I haven't seen, but said they were in no particular order.

Can you each put them in order for me?

 ;)



Ridge at Castle Pines North
Red Hawk Ridge
Green Valley Ranch

"Something has to change, otherwise the never-ending arms race that benefits only a few manufacturers will continue to lead to longer courses, narrower fairways, smaller greens, more rough, more expensive rounds, and other mechanisms that will leave golf's future in doubt." -  TFOG

Matt_Ward

Re:What's new in Denver golf?
« Reply #5 on: March 22, 2004, 11:14:38 AM »
Paul:

Just a couple of others worth noting ...

Play Bear Dance -- just south of Castle Pines. The course comes from an original Rick Phelps design that was tweaked by the new management team. I liked the layout but others have been less glowing.

You also have the new Fossil Trace GC in Golden by Jim Engh. I liked the course with one or two exceptions and given the tight land available it was well done.

You can't beat Riverdale Dunes as other have opined.

Tom Ferrell

Re:What's new in Denver golf?
« Reply #6 on: March 22, 2004, 12:08:45 PM »
I played Green Valley Ranch this past Friday.  It was in horrible shape - construction going on everywhere, greens pock-marked and bare in places, service crappy.  The 600-yard 18th is being played as a 170-yard par-3.  Oh, AND they were charging mid-season rates - $60 ($45 to walk).  Ridiculous.  While the layout is good, and there are several very interesting holes, it's not yet ready for prime time in 2004.  They had better get on it - the course is going to host the Colorado Open in July.

In addition to Riverdale Dunes (definitely a worthwhile play), I like Hurdzan-Fry's Heritage at Westmoor.  Good width, good strategic design.  A couple of funky holes, but a value-laden track, for sure.  Jay Morrish's Vista Ridge in Erie is also a nice play.


Brad Swanson

Re:What's new in Denver golf?
« Reply #7 on: March 22, 2004, 01:46:16 PM »
   I concur with TomF about the Heritage at Westmoor.  You never hear anything about Hurzdan/Fry designs here, and this one is good, but not spectacular.
   Its unfortunate to hear Green Valley Ranch is in disrepair.  I really like the design and have a soft spot in my heart for it (might be due to the 1st name on the Club Champion plaque in the clubhouse ;))

Cheers,
Brad Swanson

Tom Ferrell

Re:What's new in Denver golf?
« Reply #8 on: March 23, 2004, 09:37:51 AM »
Redanman -

I love the back nine at Heritage.  The par-5 you cite - the 13th - is the hole I highlight when explaining my interest in golf course architecture to people.

560 yards, uphill.  From the tee, a strategic bunker to the left side of the fairway guards the route that would give the most direct line to the player going for the green in two.  A series of bunkers splits the fairway in two at the lay-up zone.  A left lay-up again leaves the best angle but requires an uphill pitch over a bunker and a steep false front.  The lone fronting bunker also plays havoc with the player going for the green in two - do you play around it, with a hooking approach or attempt to fly a ball up there and stop it on a shallow green?

Great hole, lots and lots of options.  I've tried every one, and I still have no idea when I step to the tee what I'll do on that specific day.

The 14th is a downhill one-shotter of less than 140 yards to a skyline green that falls steeply away on the left.  It's one of the most challenging shots in the round, IMO.  A classic short hole.

Other holes of note include 2, 3, 4, 11 (a driveable par-4), 12 and 17.  

All in all, a good day.  Colorado's architecture enthusiasts also should keep an eye out for the opening of Highland Meadows in Windsor later this spring.  Art Schaupeter designed the course (he also did Buffalo Run in Commerce City).  It's a wide, rolling affair with many strategic decisions.  The 16th hole features a six-foot deep sod-walled bunker fronting a kidney-shaped green, and the 17th is a full-on redan, complete with a true redan bunker and the requisite angled, fall-away green.  Should be fun.

Doug Wright

Re:What's new in Denver golf?
« Reply #9 on: March 23, 2004, 04:04:30 PM »
TomF/Redanman,

Good call regarding Heritage's back 9--I'm not a fan of the start (10/11) or 18 but there is some really good stuff in between such as the long par 4 12 and 13-14 that you describe. Also the 2d hole with the bunker in the middle of the fairway. I thought the front 9 was well routed too though the holes aren't up to the back 9.

Overall I'd rate it a hair below Riverdale Dunes but still a solid effort. Hurdzan/Fry don't get much press here on GCA, do they?

PS, TomF check your email.

Best,
Twitter: @Deneuchre

Art_Schaupeter

Re:What's new in Denver golf?
« Reply #10 on: March 26, 2004, 01:31:32 AM »
Thanks TomF.  Is this the TomF that played the course back in October during grow-in?  If so I'd like to talk with you.

I think that Highland Meadows will have a lot of interest for the architecture buffs, and it will hopefully just be flat out fun for everyone else.  It isn't in the Denver metro area though (about 45 minutes north of the airport).  I think Highland Meadows has a lot to offer in terms of fun, strategic, thought-provoking golf on a fairly minimalistic site.  At this time I expect the course to open sometime around Memorial Day.  If I can figure out the process, I will try to post a few pictures I took last fall during grow in.

Art

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