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Kalen Braley

  • Total Karma: -3
Re: Random Thoughts after a Hiatus
« Reply #25 on: July 12, 2020, 02:59:00 PM »
Once again, they only need one change, a Tour Approved Ball. If they want to roll it back 10%? fine. 20%? fine.  And using the same logic, its only .00001% of golfers, so it'll be virtually zero impact to anyone, and no one will care right?

And the mini tours can either adapt it or develop their own specs.

Simple...

Erik J. Barzeski

  • Total Karma: -2
Re: Random Thoughts after a Hiatus
« Reply #26 on: July 12, 2020, 03:39:44 PM »
Once again, they only need one change, a Tour Approved Ball. If they want to roll it back 10%? fine. 20%? fine.  And using the same logic, its only .00001% of golfers, so it'll be virtually zero impact to anyone, and no one will care right?
No, the same logic doesn't apply. Many times the number of Tour players would be affected. Bifurcation remains a non-starter IMO and in the opinions of many.
Erik J. Barzeski @iacas
Author, Lowest Score Wins, Instructor/Coach, and Lifetime Student of the Game.

I generally ignore Rob, Tim, Garland, and Chris.

John Kavanaugh

  • Total Karma: 9
Re: Random Thoughts after a Hiatus
« Reply #27 on: July 12, 2020, 07:59:30 PM »
Kalen,


Who would benefit from bifurcation?

John Kavanaugh

  • Total Karma: 9
Re: Random Thoughts after a Hiatus
« Reply #28 on: July 12, 2020, 08:19:10 PM »
The thought of our corporate elite enjoying their private enclaves as they were originally designed warms my heart.

Kalen Braley

  • Total Karma: -3
Re: Random Thoughts after a Hiatus
« Reply #29 on: July 12, 2020, 10:57:02 PM »
Erik,

This topic has been hashed and rehashed countless times on this site, but it keeps coming up again and again.  But when even Titleist is posting vids about how much dimpling effects ball flight and distance, I think even they know what is eventually coming down the pipe.


The Pro Game is in fact already bifurcated in many ways, and this would just be one more to add to this list. 




Erik J. Barzeski

  • Total Karma: -2
Re: Random Thoughts after a Hiatus
« Reply #30 on: July 12, 2020, 11:13:51 PM »
The Pro Game is in fact already bifurcated in many ways, and this would just be one more to add to this list. 
We disagree on that. It's not bifurcated by rule.

And yes, it has. And 20% is as ridiculous now as it was when it was first mentioned, whenever that was.
Erik J. Barzeski @iacas
Author, Lowest Score Wins, Instructor/Coach, and Lifetime Student of the Game.

I generally ignore Rob, Tim, Garland, and Chris.

Peter Pallotta

Re: Random Thoughts after a Hiatus
« Reply #31 on: July 12, 2020, 11:38:20 PM »

But when even Titleist is posting vids about how much dimpling effects ball flight and distance, I think even they know what is eventually coming down the pipe.

That's interesting, Kalen, because I saw that video completely differently -- not so much a promise as a threat. Saw it linked via Shack's site, and was confused that the message he seemed to be taking from it was so at odds with the one I was getting, i.e. that without their technology (in this case, the dimple patterns) we'd be very unhappy golfers indeed. In other words, Titleist seemed to be sending out a warning, i.e. "don't let the egg heads fool you with their measured talk about limiting/changing technology, especially when it comes to golf balls -- they are playing with fire, and you average golfers are the ones who'll get burned".

Kalen Braley

  • Total Karma: -3
Re: Random Thoughts after a Hiatus
« Reply #32 on: July 12, 2020, 11:56:31 PM »
Peter,

You can believe that, but i'm not buying it. Titleist is certainly not the only manufacturer who knows how to make balls fly far, and the PGA Tour mandating a specific dimpling pattern (or a specified ball) to be used for tournament play will not impact the other 99.99% of golfers who can still play current balls.  Or do you think golfers will think "Phil/Tiger/Sergio, etc.. uses a sweet ball, I think i'll give up 15-20% to use the ball he uses"?

I don't see basketball gear companies throwing a fit because the NBA uses a indoor only leather ball. They still sell boat loads of indoor/outdoor composite balls for the masses.  And yes incoming players must adjust to the NBA ball as lower levels thru college use much stickier and lighter composite balls.  Why wouldn't something similar work for golf?

Duncan Cheslett

  • Total Karma: 0
Re: Random Thoughts after a Hiatus
« Reply #33 on: July 13, 2020, 02:11:57 AM »
I only know one tour pro. George Bloor is a Cavendish lad just starting out at the low levels. He's doing well and hopefully is a name to watch.

George tells me that generally the longest club he ever has to use for his second shot into a par 4 hole on any of the courses he plays on tour is a 9-iron.

With everyone consistently hitting 300 yard drives down the middle, pro golf is reduced to a game of pitch and putt.

They might as well play par 3 courses.


« Last Edit: July 13, 2020, 02:18:47 AM by Duncan Cheslett »

Sean_A

  • Total Karma: 0
Re: Random Thoughts after a Hiatus
« Reply #34 on: July 13, 2020, 02:42:37 AM »

But when even Titleist is posting vids about how much dimpling effects ball flight and distance, I think even they know what is eventually coming down the pipe.

That's interesting, Kalen, because I saw that video completely differently -- not so much a promise as a threat. Saw it linked via Shack's site, and was confused that the message he seemed to be taking from it was so at odds with the one I was getting, i.e. that without their technology (in this case, the dimple patterns) we'd be very unhappy golfers indeed. In other words, Titleist seemed to be sending out a warning, i.e. "don't let the egg heads fool you with their measured talk about limiting/changing technology, especially when it comes to golf balls -- they are playing with fire, and you average golfers are the ones who'll get burned".

That was my take. Tech is good for golf and golfers.

Ciao
New plays planned for 2025: Machrihanish Dunes, Dunaverty and Carradale

Jim Sherma

  • Total Karma: 0
Re: Random Thoughts after a Hiatus
« Reply #35 on: July 13, 2020, 09:29:06 AM »
Last year I found an older Top-Flite with the small dimples and the original small-dimples in what looked to be very good condition for the age. I believe this had the octohedral dimple pattern that was common in the 1940's through the 70's (not the XL more modern dimple pattern). I played 9 holes hitting both it and a modern Titleist NXT Tour. The amount of flat surface area on the old Top Flite seemed huge compared to the Titleist's modern pattern. The primary difference in the two balls was the sharpness with which the Top-Flite moved due to side-spin. Also, it appeared that the Top-Flite would drop from the sky a little more readily at the end of the flight although that is more speculation. Distance wise there was very little difference. I think the main difference was that swings that were less centered in the club face ended up marginally worse with the Top Flite due to more right to left dispersion.


Doesn't prove anything but I found it a fun and interesting way to spend a couple of hours.




Peter Flory

  • Total Karma: 0
Re: Random Thoughts after a Hiatus
« Reply #36 on: July 13, 2020, 02:18:02 PM »
The danger with the technology creep is that the sport turns into men's tennis.  i.e. the dynamics slowly change until it becomes less varied and fans lose interest on the margin.  All around skills fade away and it's more of a power game with fewer upsets.  If it wasn't for all the course difficulty inflation, I'd argue that we'd be fully in that realm already.  Instead we're just mostly there. 

In tennis, one major unintended consequence of the tech (besides the serving dominance) is that passing shots, even when off balance are easy now compared to the past.  Going to the net became a fool's errand and a generation of players learned to play almost exclusively from the baseline in response.  Winners from the baseline require power.  i.e. tech changed the dynamics of the sport itself in a way that nobody anticipated or desired.

Despite technology advances, racquet sales have plummeted by over 50% in the last 15 years.  And the fastest growing sport in the US is now pickleball- an artful tennis variant that rewards placement and strategy over power. 

I don't dislike playing modern golf with modern equipment, but I have increasingly been finding the pro game to be boring, just like tennis.  I grew up playing tennis and loved to watch it.  But I'd rather watch a game of curling than men's tennis at this point. 




















« Last Edit: July 13, 2020, 02:21:39 PM by Peter Flory »