[Paul Rudovsky]

I am not sure about this, but I would bet that no one has played the complete GOLF Magazine 2021 World Top 100.  I know of several people who have played 98 of 100, but no one who has played 99 or 100 of 100. Can't recall when that was true about any reputable World 100 list.


And if the lockdowns come back due to the new variant, it will be some time before this changes.


There certainly are more important things going on in the world as a whole as well as just the golf world...but the above is still interesting if true.

[jeffwarne]

I am not sure about this, but I would bet that no one has played the complete GOLF Magazine 2021 World Top 100.  I know of several people who have played 98 of 100, but no one who has played 99 or 100 of 100. Can't recall when that was true about any reputable World 100 list.


And if the lockdowns come back due to the new variant, it will be some time before this changes.


There certainly are more important things going on in the world as a whole as well as just the golf world...but the above is still interesting if true.

I played with a very nice gentleman last week at Augusta CC who told me he had played 99 out of GOLF's 100 and was only missing "the course next door"
A couple of holes later he asked what the Camels on my hat were for...
so 98 out of 100... [size=78%] [/size]

[Paul Rudovsky]

There are a good number of folks who had played 99 of 100 and were missing ANGC.  But since the new list was published about a week ago...there are now the following courses that few have had a chance to get to:


Les Bordes (New)
Ardfin
St Patrick's


The other four "new" ones are:


Baltusrol--Lower
Yeamans Hall
Oak Hill--East
Old Town Club


The first three of these are not "new"...they are returning to the last.  And OTC has been climbing in the charts (as the disc jockeys used to say) for a good five years

[Tom_Doak]

I believe Ran has played all three of the new additions.


Not sure if there were any from the old list that he's missed.  Ellerston maybe?  I don't think he rated it for The Confidential Guide.




There are a few I haven't played, but the only ones I haven't seen are the two new ones that aren't mine, plus Ellerston and Nine Bridges.  I don't have a burning desire to see any of those, to be honest.

[Mark_Fine]

Not even close for me.  Did a quick scan of the new list and I think 78 for me.  With Covid the last thing I want is to get stranded in some foreign country quarantined for 14 days like my son did in Vietnam.  No fun. But he did play a few really good ones while there that I haven’t played.   I have enough trouble keeping up with the Top 100 US lists but I will travel internationally again once things quiet down.  First trip is Ireland again (one that was canceled last year) hopefully this coming summer.  Had a Canada trip canceled as well that needs rescheduling. 

[Niall C]

Apart from raters, has anyone else ever played Ardfin ? 


Niall

[Steve Lapper]

Apart from raters, has anyone else ever played Ardfin ? 


Niall

Several friends of mine (mostly investment guys) have played it. One friend in particular is a 2hcp and lost 10 balls there on a windy afternoon. Still, he raved about the course

FWIW: I don't understand "list chasers." For me, it's about playing interesting courses, or at least courses in interesting locations. For example, I played Ellerston in late 2002 simply because it was noted to be a highly interesting site in NSW, Australia, not because it made some magazine list.

The notion that one dedicates themselves to chasing the prospect that a course made some sort of list or category created by others seems inane. Who cares if the PGA was played somewhere in the 1920s, or if it made a magazine's list one year?

[Mark_Fine]

Steve,
Are there courses on the GM list that are not interesting?  Most who have played a lot of these have played an awful lot in addition.  If you for example fly all the way to Australia and have access to those courses “on the list”, are you going to pass playing them?  Just curious. 

[Jonathan Cummings]

94 for me Paul.  Will have all but Ellerston by next summer.

[Steve Lapper]

Steve,
Are there courses on the GM list that are not interesting?  Most who have played a lot of these have played an awful lot in addition.  If you for example fly all the way to Australia and have access to those courses “on the list”, are you going to pass playing them?  Just curious.

Mark,


  Splitting hairs, there are 1-2 courses on our list that have little or interest IMO. Nowhere did I say I would  affirmatively go out of my way to pass up a course just because it's on some arcane list. Instead, I stated that a course's appearance on a list does zero to drive me to play it.


  A perfect example of this approach might exist in Ohio, where a handful of lesser-name courses are  considerably more interesting and attractive for me than a number of big-name (and on every list) places. The architectural excellence of many of those unheralded sites has proven far more compelling in most cases. 

[JESII]

I'm with Steve!


That said, acknowledging the lists exist and there is effort put into them and thought/conversation generated by them (both undeniable!), then completing the list has to be accepted and expected.


I will call BS on the notion that you happened to hear Ellerston was on an interesting piece of of land and so booked a game...haha

[John Kavanaugh]

Now that I’m older I prefer to play courses not on your lists like Spanish Bay and smile as the clown show passes them by.

[Steve Lapper]

I'm with Steve!


That said, acknowledging the lists exist and there is effort put into them and thought/conversation generated by them (both undeniable!), then completing the list has to be accepted and expected.


I will call BS on the notion that you happened to hear Ellerston was on an interesting piece of of land and so booked a game...haha

Jim,


   One of my college buddies was the lead investment banker for the Kerry Packer at the time. He had toured Ellerston with him in 2001 and raved about how "cool" and "unique" it was. Those words equalled "interesting." He was able to secure us a tee time a year later and off we went. 

[JESII]

Just breaking balls

[Mark_Fine]

Steve,
I respect your opinion but will challenge most who say that lists don’t matter.  Our society is driven by lists whether it be grocery lists, bucket lists, favorite songs or movies lists, best local restaurant lists, top mutual funds lists, wedding guest lists, best college football team lists,…and the “lists” go on.  If someone or some group you respect came out with a Top 100 Most Interesting Courses list would you look at it for ideas?  Ran has his 148 most influential course list.  They are all just lists and while some aren’t worth much, some do give golfers for example who are traveling to some foreign place or new state some ideas where to play.  If someone has the time, inspiration and access to play them all, good for them. It is one thing to just check boxes to say been there done that.  It is another to go and really take in and enjoy checking that box.  Rarely do I play a course on these lists that I say what a waste of time.  There is always something to see and learn on most any course plus it’s golf

[Thomas Dai]

Some of the quite new courses mentioned above are now closed until March/April so less opportunity for a few months to ‘top-up’ to the 100.
Atb

[Steve Lapper]

Steve,
I respect your opinion but will challenge most who say that lists don’t matter.  Our society is driven by lists whether it be grocery lists, bucket lists, favorite songs or movies lists, best local restaurant lists, top mutual funds lists, wedding guest lists, best college football team lists,…and the “lists” go on.  If someone or some group you respect came out with a Top 100 Most Interesting Courses list would you look at it for ideas?  Ran has his 148 most influential course list.  They are all just lists and while some aren’t worth much, some do give golfers for example who are traveling to some foreign place or new state some ideas where to play.  If someone has the time, inspiration and access to play them all, good for them. It is one thing to just check boxes to say been there done that.  It is another to go and really take in and enjoy checking that box.  Rarely do I play a course on these lists that I say what a waste of time.  There is always something to see and learn on most any course plus it’s golf

Mark,


  I don't disagree with you and definitely respect your opinion. Lists are indeed worthy guidelines. No question I look at them as useful for helping guide certain travels. For example, I'd dare not look at Zagat's Best Chinese list when visiting a new city! 

  The specific point I was making was that CHASING lists, or making them the primary reason you seek to visit is idiotic. I am aware of the # of GM World Top 100 courses I've played, and eager to see most of those remaining, but I am more eager to go to see a Loften Links or Seven Mile Beach than I am to get to Nine Bridges or Naruo.  A few rater friends think their journey to chase a certain list is some form of accomplishment....and no doubt it is. They either abhor or relish the fact that it's only a single point-in-time measurement of what others think, ultimately changing quite regularly, yet they devote large portions of their life chasing it. Certainly their right to such a pursuit, but it just seems inane and contrary to what the game, the golf courses and their architecture represent.

  After all, look at Barney's enjoyment of Spanish Bay. Not my cup-of-tea, but if that's what he likes then it makes sense.
One man's opinion for sure.

Jim,
  I know that....just wanted to example how and why.

[jeffwarne]

There are a good number of folks who had played 99 of 100 and were missing ANGC.  But since the new list was published about a week ago...there are now the following courses that few have had a chance to get to:


Les Bordes (New)
Ardfin
St Patrick's


The other four "new" ones are:


Baltusrol--Lower
Yeamans Hall
Oak Hill--East
Old Town Club

So if one played Baltusrol while it was OFF the list before the work du jour that put it back ON the list  do you count it?
Asking for a friend...


Hard to believe someone who had 99 of 100 of am old list wouldnt have Baltusrol and Yeaman's already unless they were solely into Top 100 lists

[Rob Marshall]

I've been drooling over Yeamans for years. My sister is friends with the pro but I've never been there at the right time. My son lives in Charleston now so I'm hoping for a Yeamans, Muni, CC Charleston, and Bulls Bay trip this summer. Maybe a drive to Aiken. I played the Muni right before the renovation so I'm interested in seeing the changes. I would assume access gets a little easier in the heat. See how that goes.

[Paul Rudovsky]

Jeff—


No one has appointed me the “judge “ of these matters but my answers to your questions would be:


1.  Yes…playing Baltie last year when it was not on the then current GM World List would count as having played it.  Reality is it is hard to draw a line as to when a “restoration/renovation”is considered to be that as opposed to regular maintenance…so my criteria is having played any course that sat essentially on the same footprint.  So for example…playing today’s Fresh Meadow CC on LI does not mean (at least to me) that that person has played the original Fresh Meadow which was located in Queens off of what is now the LI Espressway (and where Sazazen won the US Open).  But in my mind having played both the Upper and Lower at Baltie means you have played the course used for Batltie’s early (pre 1924) (since it sat on the same land that Upper and Lowere now occuppies.


2.  On your second point…yes I think anyone who is “close” has played Balt-Lower, Yeamans (and OTC and Oak Hill-East)…BUT there are several guys who have played 98 or 97 and are missing 2 or 3  of Ardfin, St Pat’s, and Les Borses-Hanse






 

[jeffwarne]

Jeff—


No one has appointed me the “judge “ of these matters but my answers to your questions would be:


1.  Yes…playing Baltie last year when it was not on the then current GM World List would count as having played it.  Reality is it is hard to draw a line as to when a “restoration/renovation”is considered to be that as opposed to regular maintenance…so my criteria is having played any course that sat essentially on the same footprint.  So for example…playing today’s Fresh Meadow CC on LI does not mean (at least to me) that that person has played the original Fresh Meadow which was located in Queens off of what is now the LI Espressway (and where Sazazen won the US Open).  But in my mind having played both the Upper and Lower at Baltie means you have played the course used for Batltie’s early (pre 1924) (since it sat on the same land that Upper and Lowere now occuppies.


2.  On your second point…yes I think anyone who is “close” has played Balt-Lower, Yeamans (and OTC and Oak Hill-East)…BUT there are several guys who have played 98 or 97 and are missing 2 or 3  of Ardfin, St Pat’s, and Les Borses-Hanse

Makes sense esp #3

[John Kavanaugh]

If you want to con a course into letting you play what is a good number of courses to tell them you have played? Is 70 enough, 95 too many? I know it changes with each course.


A good rule of thumb might be the inverse of the courses ranking plus one. For example, if you want to play the 15th ranked course you say that you have played 86 of the top 100. What do most of you guys do?

[John Kavanaugh]

My personal favorite is when someone specifically is playing the top 100 from an obscure year. I want to play the top 100 as published in my birth year 1960. All classics baby!!!

[Jonathan Cummings]

John - you need to be a year older.  Golfweek's twin lists cut the classics off at 1959.  Moderns start in 1960 :-)

[John Kavanaugh]

John - you need to be a year older.  Golfweek's twin lists cut the classics off at 1959.  Moderns start in 1960 :-)

I was alive during Eisenhower administration. Just made the cut off.

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