[A.G._Crockett]

I was at Pawleys Island this week for back-to-back Carolinas Golf Association senior four balls at True Blue and Caledonia.  I had not been to True Blue in a couple of years, and when we got there for a practice round on Monday, I realized that they had reversed the tees/yardages on the scorecard to list the shortest tees first.

I found this to be really interesting and really creative, and it was the first time I'd ever seen it done.  I've contended for years that the key to enjoying a Strantz course is to play the correct tees, whether by yardage or, even better, by slope; of all of his courses that I've played this is perhaps the most important at True Blue, and a lot of players who routinely go to the tips or the second set of tees like they do at home or at other courses just don't enjoy it very much.

Have any of you seen this done anywhere else?  (And please, no rants about multiple tees, ok?  There are plenty of "Grumpy Old Men/Good Old Days/Flat Earth Society threads on here already!)

[Ira Fishman]

I have never seen that approach which is cool idea.  I did appreciate at Streamsong that there are no Blue or Red tees which removed some of the stereotypes about tee choices.  And by making the Blacks not the longest tees, it may have made people more comfortable selecting them even though they were not the back tees.


Ira

[Tim Martin]

I was at Pawleys Island this week for back-to-back Carolinas Golf Association senior four balls at True Blue and Caledonia.  I had not been to True Blue in a couple of years, and when we got there for a practice round on Monday, I realized that they had reversed the tees/yardages on the scorecard to list the shortest tees first.

I found this to be really interesting and really creative, and it was the first time I'd ever seen it done.  I've contended for years that the key to enjoying a Strantz course is to play the correct tees, whether by yardage or, even better, by slope; of all of his courses that I've played this is perhaps the most important at True Blue, and a lot of players who routinely go to the tips or the second set of tees like they do at home or at other courses just don't enjoy it very much.

Have any of you seen this done anywhere else?  (And please, no rants about multiple tees, ok?  There are plenty of "Grumpy Old Men/Good Old Days/Flat Earth Society threads on here already!)

A.G.-I haven’t seen this done anywhere else. I think you can apply your contention “that the key to enjoying a Strantz course is to play the correct tees” to any architect. Many lament that there are too many sets of tees at certain courses but still pick the wrong ones to enjoy the experience. I had a guy recently tell me that he hated Lake of Isles North course at the Foxwoods Casino which was designed by Reese Jones. When I asked him why he told me that he couldn’t drive his ball far enough to get to the landing areas. Upon further cross examination I learned that he is 67 years old with a 23 handicap yet played the gold tees with a card yardage of 6718 which is one set up from the tips. Finally he advised that his crew usually plays one set up wherever they go. Although I’ve seen Reese Jones blamed for global warming, the Mideast peace conflict and a myriad of other societal woes I’m giving him a pass on this one.

[Matt_Cohn]

On a related topic:


Why PGA President Suzy Whaley wants to change your scorecard’s design

[Tom_Doak]

On a related topic:


Why PGA President Suzy Whaley wants to change your scorecard’s design

Yes, I suspect this is why it was done.

[Kalen Braley]

I just figured they did it so the handicap rankings per hole would be easy to figure out and not confusing.

But maybe there is something else going on with the top/bottom thing...

[A.G._Crockett]

At the risk of repeating myself, I think enjoyment of True Blue, more than ANY other course I've ever played, is dependent on playing the correct tees, and that absolutely means a shorter yardage than "normal", even for very good players.  I think that visitors playing TB for the first time tend to go to the tees that they play at home, either by yardage or just counting from the back, and the course is just too difficult and not nearly as much fun as it should be.

Since I've never seen this anywhere else, I'm guessing this is something that the TB management did based on reviews of the course, and/or discussions with course raters and the like.  Typically, the management of Caledonia and TB don't miss much in terms of ways to make the experience better for the public.

[Peter Pallotta]

AG - that's interesting to me.
I know you like Strantz courses, and I assume that for you it's a compliment (or at least, not a negative) to say that playing the correct tees is more important there at True Blue than at any other course you know.
But I have a hard time wrapping my head around that.
The fact that playing the correct set of tees is that important suggests something to me about the nature & quality of the architecture/design.
Now, I don't know and can't put my finger on exactly *what* it suggests to me -- but it's not something I've ever heard said about, say, The Old Course, or Sand Hills, of Pebble Beach, or Pacific Dunes, or Mid Pines/Pine Needles or countless other good courses.
I guess my question/confusion is: if at so many many very good courses one can 'get away' with playing a set of tees further back, is not being able to get away with it at True Blue actually a positive, i.e. a testament to good design?

[A.G._Crockett]

AG - that's interesting to me.
I know you like Strantz courses, and I assume that for you it's a compliment (or at least, not a negative) to say that playing the correct tees is more important there at True Blue than at any other course you know.
But I have a hard time wrapping my head around that.
The fact that playing the correct set of tees is that important suggests something to me about the nature & quality of the architecture/design.
Now, I don't know and can't put my finger on exactly *what* it suggests to me -- but it's not something I've ever heard said about, say, The Old Course, or Sand Hills, of Pebble Beach, or Pacific Dunes, or Mid Pines/Pine Needles or countless other good courses.
I guess my question/confusion is: if at so many many very good courses one can 'get away' with playing a set of tees further back, is not being able to get away with it at True Blue actually a positive, i.e. a testament to good design?

Pete,

This is 100% personal opinion, but I think the thing at True Blue is that the greens are both difficult to hit AND, in many cases do not hold approach shots hit with clubs that are too long.  From the tips, True Blue is nearly 7200, and it's a little over 6800 from the second set; the greens tend to be narrow if they are deep, and shallow if they are wide, and recovery from the waste areas around the greens (there are NO bunkers, but LOTS of sand!) is problematic at best. 


By contrast, Caledonia, Tobacco Road, and Tot Hill are all in the 6500 range from the tips, and 6300 or less from the second set.  These are not insignificant differences.  So if a player automatically goes to the tips of the second set at True Blue, as per other courses, there is a higher probability that he/she just won't have a lot of fun.

As I said, all personal opinion based on anecdotal "evidence" from my limited circle of friends.  But that's why I suspect TB has flipped the scorecard yardages, while the other courses haven't.

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