Who has played Kirtland and Pasatiempo?

[Jason Thurman]

And which course has the better back nine?

[John Cowden]

No offense intended, but,...

[Ronald Montesano]

I might be able to offer an answer in a few weeks. Ironically, it's Kirtland (3 hours from me) that I have yet to play.

RM

[mark chalfant]

Both are unforgettable. Kirtland's short par fours(13,16) scenic and very sporty. The dramatic downhill 10th and the long uphill 15th are superb. The walk in the woods routing is an exceptional Alison work of art.


Pasatiempo's  par threes are shorter but have more variety and require finesse. I found the bunkering and green contours much more interesting at Pasatimepo.  11,14 and 16 are all superb par fours.  Pasa has superb ground movement and well integrated ravines.


I slightly prefer Pasatiempo.

[DFarron]

Have played both a lot.....Pasatiempo best by a lot and I love Kirtland. The only blemish at Pasa is the 17th hole...the 11th is maybe one of the most underrated holes in the world.
Actually I prefer the back 9 at Canterbury to Kirtland......

[Ian Andrew]

I have ...


Kirtland is played over one of the most dramatic pieces of terrain I have seen.
There are some really impressive holes.


Pasatiempo is architecturally brilliant.


I have a preference, but I don't get the point in picking between two every enthusiast should go and see.
Both are worth a special trip

[Ryan Hillenbrand]

Jason, just curious. Why do you ask? Different architects, climate, etc. I've played neither, but this is one of the more odd comparison requests.

[Kevin_Reilly]

Both courses have well-regarded back nines.

[Robert Mercer Deruntz]

This post does not make sense to me, because they are by different architects on significantly different types of property.  And is Pasatiempo's front nine considered inferior to the back? I have never felt that, and for that matter I found the front at Kirland to have wonderful well laid out holes, just nothing dramatic like the drop off the tenth tee down to the river. 

[Jason Thurman]

I've always heard amazing things about the back 9 at Pasatiempo. I haven't played it. Kirtland might have the best back 9 I've played. I'd have to think about it, but Bill Schulz's recent mention of it reminded me of how much I enjoyed it. Most of the best courses I've played seem like they have a weaker back side, for whatever reason.

[Ian Andrew]

I prefer the back nine at courses such The Old Course, Shinnecock Hills, Merion (East) quite a bit more than I like front nines just to pick through some of the very best. I agree there are more great front nines, but I don’t think it’s that imbalanced

[Evan Fleisher]

Both are unforgettable. Kirtland's short par fours(13,16) scenic and very sporty. The dramatic downhill 10th and the long uphill 15th are superb. The walk in the woods routing is an exceptional Alison work of art.


Pasatiempo's  par threes are shorter but have more variety and require finesse. I found the bunkering and green contours much more interesting at Pasatiempo.  11,14 and 16 are all superb par fours.  Pasa has superb ground movement and well integrated ravines.


I slightly prefer Pasatiempo.

I've played both, and I think Mark nailed it with his comments here.