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Stewart Abramson

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Another Epic Ireland trip
« on: July 10, 2016, 10:26:05 PM »
I didn’t want to Jack J Winick’s thread and I’m not sure the discussion group can bear another Ireland trip thread, but for what it’s worth here are some random thoughts on my trip.

I visited the Dublin area, Northern Ireland, Co Donegal, Co Sligo and Co Mayo (for Carne). I played 17 rounds in 12 days which was a bit over-ambitious. Getting it down to 17 was a challenge and I had to skip some courses  that I would have liked to have seen such as The European Club, Portstewart, Murvagh and , Strandhill. If I was to do it over, I’d probably limit it to 10 rounds in nine days, with a day off in the middle just to be a tourist. The problem would be determining which courses to skip as there was not a course on my itinerary that I didn’t like… and none that I regret playing. There were just different degrees of fun and value.  I’ve been to Scotland and England for golf trips several times each, but this was my first visit to Ireland… and won’t be my last. I really enjoy planning my trips. They are like putting together a puzzle, piecing together the tee times, accommodations, driving distances etc. The planning for this one started almost a year in advance. It was amazing to me that even that far in advance certain hotels were fully booked and courses were not available on specific days due to competitions and other events. As a result, the itinerary isn’t exactly what I would have wanted, but reflects the most efficient way I could get in these 17 courses.

Day 1: The Island
Day 2: Portmarnock
Day 3: Ballyliffin Old and Glashedy
Day 4: Portsalon
Day 5: Rosapenna OTM and Sandy Hills
Day 6: Cruit Island and Narin & Portnoo
Day 7: Enniscrone
Day 8: Carne
Day 9: Rosses Point
Day 10: Portrush Dunluce and Valley
Day 11: RCD
Day 12: Baltray and Portmarnock Hotel

None of my friends were fanatic enough to join me for 12 days (we are all in our 60’s), so I had two American friends for the first six days and had planned to have two friends from England join me for the last six days. We landed in Dublin and on Day six the second two guys were to fly into Donegal to meet me for the second leg and the first two guys departed from Donegal airport back to Dublin to meet there wives for a couple of non-golf weeks. It was a great plan, and the flight between Dublin and Donegal is less than 80 Euro. There were only two snags. (i) one of the guys from England went into (the) hospital with an emergency two days prior to the day he was supposed to join me and had to cancel, and (ii) I had planned to have one of them added to my car rental contract so I didn’t have to do all of the driving. Unfortunately there is only one car rental company at Donegal airport (Enterprise if I recall correctly) and it wasn’t the one I used, so I ended up as the only driver for the entire trip, which added to my exhaustion (1,100 miles). That was the only flaw in my plan.

Charles (Chuck) Lund joined us for our days at Ballyliffin, where he is a member, Rosapenna and Portrush. Chuck is a machine off the tee with a gentle draw that puts him in the middle of almost every fairway.

RCD, Portmarnock and Portrush were the three very expensive green fees, although Portrush is relatively a better value if you average the cost of two rounds by also playing the Valley course, which is a “no-brainer”. Rosapenna was a great value with a package that included two rounds and hotel. I had read some complaints about the hotel being in need of a refresh. I think they must have put some money into the place as it was very nice in all respects.

The courses that most exceeded my expectations were Portsalon and Narin & Portnoo. They represent everything I like in a course. I like to smaller scale and remote locations. The welcome was fantastic and there were no mobs of touring golfers. I loved RCD, Dunluce and Portmarnock, but I didn’t like the tour buses filled with visiting golfers and the longer rounds that resulted at those courses. It was interesting that Dunluce was mobbed during our morning round, while for the afternoon round on the Valley we basically had the course to ourselves.

I also loved Rosses Point. It’s a great piece of land and standing on the fifth tee looking out over the course was like golfing heaven. It was similar to how I felt the first time I was on the 4th tee at Ballyneal. I don’t know how to accurately include the feel of a place when evaluating a golf course, but Rosses Point, Portsalon, Narin & Portnoo and the Island all had those “goose bump” moments.
During the trip I came to realize that I liked a lot of holes that have blind shots. At the end of each day when I replayed the rounds in my head and thought about my favorite holes, often times they were holes with blind shots. Some examples: #5 at the Island, #9 & 10 at Narin & Portnoo, #12 & 13 at Enniscrone #17 and #18 at Rosses Point and  5 or 6 holes at RCD. That being the case, I should have loved Cruit Island, but I thought it was just okay. It’s a fun memory (getting there is half the fun), but if I had to whittle down my itinerary, it would probably not make the cut, although it was the least expensive round of the trip.

I was disappointed at Carne that the new (Kilmore) 9 was closed. The woman in the pro shop indicated that it has been closed for many months but that they plan to re-open it soon. After our round on the original (Hackett) 18, our caddy took us on a quick tour by buggy around the Kilmore 9. It was sad to see the condition it was in. It was completely dormant with many bunkers overgrown with grass and weeds. I hope it is back to normal in time for BUDA.

Ballyliffin and Rosapenna reminded me of one another, each having one old school course and one more modern, brawnier course built into the higher dunes. I would have been okay playing just one or the other, but hard to decide which I would cut.  I was not as turned off by the par 3 7th at Glashedy as Ran was (see Confi Guide). I think for many visitors the long drop shot is one they like and the view is pretty nice too. We had a lot of fun in the Ballyliffin club house. They made us feel like we were members, especially two brothers from Belfast who go by the nick-names Bruno and Pedro. I was glad I only had to drive a couple hundred yards to the B&B that night.

Weather: We were extremely lucky as every day of the trip there was a prediction of 70% chance of rain, but it only rained while we were playing on three occasions and each of those was for 30 minutes or so. The worst of those was on the Old Tom Morris course at Rosapenna. The sky opened up and we played #6 and #7 in a deluge. There were actually streams of water flowing down #7 green and standing water in many places on the course for the remainder of the round. My LLBean rain pants were fantastic, the full length zippers let me get them on in about 5 seconds so I remained perfectly dry. As to the umbrella debate, there was very little wind so the umbrella was helpful. I was actually disappointed that we had so little wind throughout the trip. I’ll post a link to photos below, and as you will see, the flags were limp on more than half of our rounds and there was rarely even a full club wind. The most wind I had was on the last day where there was a two or 3 club wind at Baltray. Temps were in the 60’s every day with a couple of days getting into the 70’s . Very comfortable for walking 36. We even wore shorts a couple for days. Most days were very overcast with thick clouds and morning fog. We had two sunny days at Narin & Portnoo and Carne.
Lodging: We stayed in B&B’s and small hotels trying to stay away from the tourists in the big hotels. There were a few standouts that I would highly recommend:

In swords (a few minutes North of Dublin airport and very convenient to Portmarnock and the Island, we stayed at Evergreen B&B. Mary and Jimmy Canavan made us feel like family and the breakfasts were great. This B&B is next to two parkland courses that we didn’t play, but we had some good food at the Roganstown Golf Club.

In Newcastle just a few minutes from RCD, the Briers, a beautiful place in a beautiful location

In Enniscrone, just a few minutes from Enniscrone Golf Club, Waterfront House is a very nice small hotel, with huge well-appointed rooms, a great restaurant and fantastic breakfasts.

Also in Enniscrone, not as nice as Waterfront House, but just outside the entrance to Enniscrone Golf Club is Eagle Heights B&B is a bargain alternative. We stayed here one night because Waterfront house had no rooms available.

Near Donegal Airport and Cruit Island Caiselain Oir Hotel is a great place to stay to participate in the Craic. One night they had an all-night poker tournament, the next night live traditional Irish music, a great pub and a nice restaurant in the lobby. Not fancy but the real deal and quite inexpensive.

In Ballyliffin, we stayed at Doherty’s Country House, which is at the end of the driveway of Ballyliffin golf club. It wasn’t fancy, but it was clean and very convenient  when we stayed at the club house until closing time.

As mentioned above, Rosapenna Hotel was very nice .

Refunds: As I mentioned above, One of my friends had to go to hospital and miss the trip. It left me having to scramble in the middle of the trip to make calls and send e-mails to amend our reservations and see if I could get refunds for him. Every hotel, B&B and golf course gave him a 100% refund except Royal County Down. Even though I notified them a week before our tee time, RCD only refunded 25% which meant he lost 150 pounds. When we spoke to them after our round all they would say was that is our terms and conditions and you agreed to them… In any event, glad to say that he is now home and will soon be playing golf again sans 150 GBP.

Caddies: I used a caddy at Carne, Dunluce and RCD as my back and shoulders were getting tired by that point of the trip. So many rounds pulling trolleys and so much driving had taken a toll. My caddy at Dunluce was great. The one at RCD not so much (although the caddy for a guy we got paired with there was excellent.) At Carne, my caddy was a young man of 14 years called Cormac. He was a great kid and decent caddy. The best part was just hearing his perspective on life in Belmullet, golf and caddying.

Water: I note that there was some discussion on the other thread about lack of water on the courses. I had a water bottle that I filled each morning and many of the courses had a place on the course where you could re-fill and some of the courses returned to the clubhouse after 9 where you could refill. All of the pro shops sold water so you could pick up a bottle or two before you started if you didn’t already have one. For me it was a non-issue.

Photos: If anyone is interested in viewing photos, they can be found here: [size=78%]https://www.flickr.com/photos/golfcoursepix/collections/72157669255656750/[/size]  I've only posted 10 of the courses so far, but will do the rest next weekend.


edited to insert space between paragrpahs
« Last Edit: July 10, 2016, 10:42:33 PM by Stewart Abramson »

David_Tepper

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Re: Another Epic Ireland trip
« Reply #1 on: July 10, 2016, 10:48:03 PM »
Stewart -

Thanks for your comprehensive and informative post. Sounds like a great trip.

I played Narin & Portnoo very much by chance in 1994. I thought it was a true "hidden gem," as I had never heard of it before showing up to play there. I enjoyed it very much. I think the course has been altered a bit since then.

I agree with your take on the Valley Course at Portrush. Very much worth playing.

DT 
« Last Edit: July 10, 2016, 10:51:51 PM by David_Tepper »

Tony_Muldoon

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Re: Another Epic Ireland trip
« Reply #2 on: July 11, 2016, 01:41:58 AM »
Stewart this is beyond nuts.  Well done.
 
A couple of questions.
 
How much golf do you play?  My feet  have developed blisters and my back aches just reading this itinery
What do you play off and  did your game hold up to the end?
 
 
 
Let's make GCA grate again!

Charles Lund

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Re: Another Epic Ireland trip
« Reply #3 on: July 11, 2016, 01:43:31 AM »
Nice post, Stewart.  It was fun meeting up with you.

I posted some musings about our day at Royal Portrush.  I think I will make a point of trying to get back there on future trips to Ballyliffin and County Donegal. 

I think the lodging summaries would be helpful to many people. 

Your trip was complex and came together nicely.  I admire your spirit of adventure and the way you embraced the challenges of the trip.  You got a good balance of golf and craic.

I'll be back at Ballyliffin and County Donegal from late August to around Seotember 9th.  I enjoyed our meetups and am encouraged to do so again with othrr GCA members.

Charles Lund

JWinick

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Re: Another Epic Ireland trip
« Reply #4 on: July 11, 2016, 03:26:30 AM »
Stewart,


Great post, and thank you for adding to the discussion.   I really think these travelogues add a lot and give people ideas on how to plan their trips.    After all, we are not simply interested in pontificating about golf course architecture!   What was your breakdown of hotels for the trip?   It seems like you confined more golf to a smaller area than we did.   Did you stay at the same hotel for five straight days, etc.?


Best,
Jon

Thomas Dai

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Re: Another Epic Ireland trip
« Reply #5 on: July 11, 2016, 05:50:54 AM »
Super report Stewart and thanks for the link to your photos.


I've been fortunate enough to have played almost all of those you mention and loved every minute of the golf, the travel and the craic.


The usual bigger suspects are indeed pretty nice but the lessor named courses and those off the beaten track have something unique and special about them and visiting and playing them really enhances the experience of an Irish trip.


The planning can be arduous initially, but the more thought that is put in in advance will prove beneficial. And then there's that other great aspect....the anticipation. And afterwards comes the memories.


Atb
 

Stewart Abramson

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Re: Another Epic Ireland trip
« Reply #6 on: July 11, 2016, 07:44:43 AM »
Stewart this is beyond nuts.  Well done.
 
A couple of questions.
 
How much golf do you play?  My feet  have developed blisters and my back aches just reading this itinery
What do you play off and  did your game hold up to the end?

Tony,  I play Saturday mornings when I am at home and I often take my clubs with me when I travel for business and add a couple of vacation days to those trips for golf. I play about 25 rounds a year that way.

My index is 13. I had been playing well (for me, which means scores in the high 80s) in the weeks leading up to the trip and my confidence was high. I shot 87 at the Island and 89 at Portmanock after a triple on the first hole. It was downhill from there. At Ballyliffin we were playing three six hole matches so we would be paired with each player for 6 holes. I carried my partner in the first match, In the next match my former partner (now my oponent) "changed the rules " to win a hole. When I questioned him on it he got angry at me saying that I was making much ado about nothing since the stakes were small. I was quite upset a d didn't hit another good shot that day, and didn't  got back in the groove for a couple of rounds.
By the time I got to Sligo, I was hitting it better, but inconsistently part of which I attribute to fatigue.    There were no blisters. I had two very comfortable pairs of golf shoes that I rotated. Pulling trolleys and driving the back roads did take a toll, but I did hit it well the last day. As I said in my original post 10 rounds would have been better than 17.

Stewart Abramson

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Re: Another Epic Ireland trip
« Reply #7 on: July 11, 2016, 08:29:46 AM »
Stewart,

  What was your breakdown of hotels for the trip?   It seems like you confined more golf to a smaller area than we did.   Did you stay at the same hotel for five straight days, etc.?

Best,
Jon

JW,

My goal was to minimize the number of days that we had long car drives. That wasn't always possible and we had three rather long diving days. Portmarnock to Ballyliffin; Portnoo to Enniscrone; and Rosses Point to Portrush, each were at least a couple of hours.

Ballyliffin to Portsalon to Rosapenna to Caselian Oir to Cruit Island to Portnoo were all relatively short and easy legs and Donegal is very pretty countryside to drive through.

In Co Sligo, we stayed in Enniscrone for three nights and made that a hub form which we played Ennicrone GC the first day, Carne the next and Rosses Point the third. Playing Rosses Point on departure day put us 45 minutes closer to Portrush which was our next destination.

We stayed 2 nights at Doherty's in Ballyliffin; the night we arrived after the long drive from Portmarnock and the night after we played 36 at Ballyliffin GC since it was just a short drive the next morning to Portsalon and then anoyher short drive from Portslaon to Rosapenna after the round at Portsalon.

We stayed at Evergreen  B&B in Swords the first night and the last 2 nights as it was convenient to the airport, Portmarnock, the Island and  only about 35 minutes to Baltray

There were a couple of places  we stayed only one night. As I mentioned above the Briers in Newcastele close to RCD was great as was Caseleian Oir (which also broke up the driving into smaller legs.)  I would not recommend the B&B we stayed at in Portrush.

Stewart Abramson

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Re: Another Epic Ireland trip
« Reply #8 on: July 11, 2016, 08:42:21 AM »
... the lessor named courses and those off the beaten track have something unique and special about them and visiting and playing them really enhances the experience of an Irish trip.

The planning can be arduous initially, but the more thought that is put in in advance will prove beneficial. And then there's that other great aspect....the anticipation. And afterwards comes the memories.

Atb

Thomas, I couldn't agree more. The lesser known courses and going off the beaten track are for me what makes golf travel the most fun. I love meeting new people in the club houses and on the course. That more often happens at the smaller places. Some of the lesser known places were un-crowded and we felt like we had the course to ourselves. I hope they all get enough play to keep them going.

I enjoy the planning part. For each trip I do, I keep a loose leaf binder that serves as my "bible" to track costs, tees times, driving directions, confirmation dates, payment due dates etc. As you indicate, both the anticipation and the memories are great aspects of a trip.

Brad Wilbur

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Re: Another Epic Ireland trip
« Reply #9 on: July 11, 2016, 09:38:14 AM »
Stewart,


Thanks for the report!  I am planning a two week trip for my wife and myself for next May/June, and am starting to line up the itinerary.  How was your experience at The Island?  The dunes are supposed to be the highest in Ireland, and that will win points with my wife.  Also, how did you manage Saturday's?  From what I understand, getting a tee time on Saturday can be problematic at more metropolitan country clubs, like The Island or Portmarnock.

Stewart Abramson

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Re: Another Epic Ireland trip
« Reply #10 on: July 11, 2016, 10:20:32 AM »
Stewart,
How was your experience at The Island?  The dunes are supposed to be the highest in Ireland, and that will win points with my wife.  Also, how did you manage Saturday's?  From what I understand, getting a tee time on Saturday can be problematic at more metropolitan country clubs, like The Island or Portmarnock.

Saturdays can be a challenge. That's why I only had one Saturday on this trip (Day 6) . We played Cruit Island early in the morning before a members' competition and Narin & Portnoo late in the afternoon since the morning was reserved for members. The great thing about June is that it stays light until 10:30 pm. We saw people teeing off at 7 pm at several courses. You could play 54 holes d ay easily.

The Island was fantastic. The Dunes at the Island are large, in stark contrast to nearby Portmarnock which has none. At the Island the Dunes only come into play on a few holes (#5 for example) where you play straight over a large Dune. On most holes, the dunes primarily frame the fairways or are the backdrop behind the green.

I can't say whether the largest dunes are at the Island, but there is certainly a dichotomy among the courses as between those where you play through large dunes such as the Island, Carne, Enniscrone,  RCD, Sandy Hills and several holes at Portnoo, vs courses like Portmarnock and Baltray where you are mostly playing in the lower linksland. At Carne and Enniscrone the dunes are a greater factor on playing the holes (and difficulty) than they are at the Island.


The Island #5 tee shot over mounds 554



Enniscrone #12 from tee 226

Stewart Abramson

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Re: Another Epic Ireland trip
« Reply #11 on: July 13, 2016, 10:28:43 PM »
Photos of the original 18 holes at Carne have now been uploaded. Link is below... Photos of 17 holes that  I liked and #12  ;)


https://www.flickr.com/photos/golfcoursepix/albums/72157670940498366



Carne Hackett #1 from tee




Carne Hackett #18 approach





Ally Mcintosh

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Re: Another Epic Ireland trip
« Reply #12 on: July 14, 2016, 08:16:23 AM »
Hi Stewart,

Sounds like a fantastic trip. Regards Carne, I will refrain on commenting on the Kilmore 9 until after my next visit in 4 weeks.

But I am intrigued about what exactly you disliked about Hackett 12 (other than the fairway which is in rag order)?

Stewart Abramson

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Re: Another Epic Ireland trip
« Reply #13 on: July 14, 2016, 09:56:40 PM »
Ally - I'll try to re-post. I've tried to post a reply with photos 3 times but it is not posting correctly


4th try without photos:

Despite the brown fairway, the turf played okay, so that wasn’t an issue for me. On the 12th tee I really had no idea what I was being asked to do or what my options were. Was it a hole where I had a choice to “bite off as much as I could chew” by going as far right As I dare if I wanted to take a risk or go left to be safe, Or was there a “proper” line? Could I go for the brown area on the left, the brown area in the middle or the green area on the right? I had no idea where the fairway was or where the green was. I know that I could have gotten a par saver or had a better conversation with my caddie so this issue is really my fault. As I indicated in my initial post, I generally like blind shots, but they usually have a flag, a stake or a colored stone to give you an idea of where to play. I know the saying that “a shot is only blind the first time you play it”, but on #12 I’m still not sure what the best line of play from the tee is for me. Is it possible that the teeing area was not in the normal/correct place this day?

From the line shown in the second photo one might guess that the green fairway ahead would lead to the green, but you’d be wrong. The green is actually behind the large dune on the left so the hole plays as a sharp dogleg beginning at the brown area just to the left of what looks like a green fairway.
The third photo is where I finally realized where I was supposed to go

The last two photos show the extremely demanding approach shot for a mid or high handicapper. The ski slope approach is pretty narrow, doesn’t provide a lot of options and was pretty penal. To me it felt like the green was placed there as a connector to the next hole rather than because it was the best place for it to be.


I don’t know if any of these thoughts hold water. I really liked the course, but didn’t like this hole. It was the one hole where I felt lost. That can happen when you only play a course once. Maybe if I played it all the time I’d learn to appreciate it. I was very disappointed that the new 9 was closed. I had intended to play all 27 and hope to get back to play them all.
« Last Edit: July 14, 2016, 10:17:33 PM by Stewart Abramson »


Charles Lund

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Re: Another Epic Ireland trip
« Reply #15 on: July 14, 2016, 10:41:45 PM »
I had the strokesaver.  Liked #11 and 12.

Charles Lund

Mike_Trenham

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Re: Another Epic Ireland trip
« Reply #16 on: July 14, 2016, 11:01:23 PM »
I had the strokesaver.  Liked #11 and 12.

Charles Lund


Love those two holes, need to be able to work your ball both ways to play them well.
Proud member of a Doak 3.

Ally Mcintosh

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Re: Another Epic Ireland trip
« Reply #17 on: July 15, 2016, 03:33:26 AM »
Hi Stewart,

Thanks for the explanation and I think that is understandable.

The 12th hole was reworked over the last few years but fairway lines haven't been fully established yet. Hence that "brown area to the left" is the old fairway through the valley and will be allowed to grow in. It also appears you played after a particularly dry period when the low, water retaining green area of the fairway looked in stark contrast to the rest. On a normal day, all those areas would pretty much appear the same in colour.

The green site was actually lowered almost 8 or 9 feet and extended from 19 yards to 36 yards long. The backstop was then removed. It was always a little bit of an unnatural looking green site and still is to a degree.

Once fully grown in, I think the lines and challenge will be very clear. And with a softened dogleg, the choices also become more numerous.