How could Porthcawl host an Open?

[Ed Tilley]

On the Turnberry thread there has been a bit of discussion as to what course could replace it on the rota. Royal Porthcawl has often been talked about as a contender. This is, I believe, something that the R&A would be keen on, and the Welsh Government desperate for. It has obviously hosted a successful Senior Open but the Open is a whole different league. There are a number of space issues but what could be practically done to get around these. Logistically, I can't see any major issues - being 10 minutes off the M4 it is more accessible than a number of courses on the current rota.

I suggested 3 new holes along the shore to the north west of the current 3rd. Tented village etc. on the field to the north of the current 5th, which would be the new finishing hole. Lose the current 6,7, and 8 with the 8th green becoming the practice putting green. Current 9th would be the 1st.

Is this practical or is this all just a pipe dream and it is never going to happen?

[Adam Lawrence]

I don't know Porthcawl well but I have to conclude that the crossover of 1 and 18 is a significant problem. I don't know how you would get enough grandstands round 18 given the constraints of the boundary, the first and the sea. The proximity to the M4 is a good thing but what about accommodation?

[Thomas Dai]

I don't know Porthcawl well but I have to conclude that the crossover of 1 and 18 is a significant problem.

Turn the current 1st into a long par-3 (or a shorter length par-4 that could be semi-drivable into the prevailing wind)?


See also this thread from a year or so ago - http://www.golfclubatlas.com/forum/index.php/topic,56752.0.html


atb

[Adrian_Stiff]

I have looked at this for fun myself and have come up with blanks.


The main problem is at lots of holes there is not enough room for the stands and at quite a lot of hole spectator movements are very restricted.


Previously they did not have such good access into the course from the North and everyone would have had to come in the current way via the town, I think thats been sorted. Any scheme would have to start with the 18th as the current 1st hole and finish on current 17. If they have new land left of 4/5 then thats a possible.


I think if they could have made this work they would have found the solution by now, but other than destroying the present course by probably 9 holes I don't think it can work for the 18 as they are.


As a solution to having enough space around greens with that new land if it was enough and used for 5 new holes then you could go;
1. present 18 (4)
2. present 1 (4)
3. present 2 (4)
4. present 3 (4)
5. new hole along coast 480 yards (4)
6. new par 3 along coast 180 yards (3)
7. new hole along coast 350 yards (4)
8. new hole 100 yards inland 620 yards (5)
9. new hole 100 yards inland back towards curr 4 tee 490 yards(4)
10. present 4 (3)
11. present 5 (5)
12. present 6 (4)
13. present 7 (3)
14. present 8 (4)
15. present 9 (4)
16. present 10 (4)
17. present 17 (bit longer) (4)
18. present 18 (green shorter to acc stands) (4)


Other holes not used 12/13/14/15/16

[Brad Treadwell]

Agreed that 17 would need to be 18, and 18 would need to be 1.  The crossover tee shot at 1 (which would be 2) is doable.  Didn't they prove this at the Senior Open Championship?  They've made these types of shots work at other Opens/Courses.  It would be the only one.  Porthcawl deserves the Open.  Each time I play it I continue to understand what a fantastic course it is. 

[Ben Stephens]

I have looked at this for fun myself and have come up with blanks.


The main problem is at lots of holes there is not enough room for the stands and at quite a lot of hole spectator movements are very restricted.


Previously they did not have such good access into the course from the North and everyone would have had to come in the current way via the town, I think thats been sorted. Any scheme would have to start with the 18th as the current 1st hole and finish on current 17. If they have new land left of 4/5 then thats a possible.


I think if they could have made this work they would have found the solution by now, but other than destroying the present course by probably 9 holes I don't think it can work for the 18 as they are.


As a solution to having enough space around greens with that new land if it was enough and used for 5 new holes then you could go;
1. present 18 (4)
2. present 1 (4)
3. present 2 (4)
4. present 3 (4)
5. new hole along coast 480 yards (4)
6. new par 3 along coast 180 yards (3)
7. new hole along coast 350 yards (4)
8. new hole 100 yards inland 620 yards (5)
9. new hole 100 yards inland back towards curr 4 tee 490 yards(4)
10. present 4 (3)
11. present 5 (5)
12. present 6 (4)
13. present 7 (3)
14. present 8 (4)
15. present 9 (4)
16. present 10 (4)
17. present 17 (bit longer) (4)
18. present 18 (green shorter to acc stands) (4)


Other holes not used 12/13/14/15/16

Adrian - Your layout removes some of the best holes on the course - 13,14,15 and 16??!! your proposed new holes is on pretty mundane land not very links like and I also question what sub soil is there

GCA - The Senior Open started off the 18th tee as the 1st and the 2nd (actual 1st hole) was played off the beach tee to avoid the crossover. Langer took the course apart which makes me feel that it needs to be toughened up maybe by building a few tees outside the boundary.

If Wales wanted a Open in this area - I would suggest Pyle and Kenfig by building a 18 hole course in the current back nine area which has 5 extra holes used in the winter of for members to practise on in summer. The land there is absolutely stunning and perfect for links golf and spectator mounding - it would have been Wales' version of Birkdale. The current front nine would have been used as a tented village and practice area. However it is in a SSSI area which means that planning permission is much harder to achieve.

[Kevin Markham]

Adrian - Your layout removes some of the best holes on the course - 13,14,15 and 16??!!

Have to agree with that. Those are cracking holes. Here are photos of Royal Porthcawl...

If Wales wanted a Open in this area - I would suggest Pyle and Kenfig by building a 18 hole course in the current back nine area which has 5 extra holes used in the winter of for members to practise on in summer. The land there is absolutely stunning and perfect for links golf and spectator mounding - it would have been Wales' version of Birkdale. The current front nine would have been used as a tented village and practice area. However it is in a SSSI area which means that planning permission is much harder to achieve.

The land beyond the back nine on P&K is stunning alright. PK 14 views to Port Talbot KEV_7488-11 by Kevin  Markham, on Flickr]Here's a shot of it, although it's taken from the 14th tee so it's not particularly illuminating.

[Adrian_Stiff]

It is those central holes that cause the most headache for the stands and spectators.


It is not a case of they are the best holes for golf, they are the ruiners for the logistics of it.

[Richard Fisher]

Not in any way wishing to dampen the collective GCA enthusiasm for a Welsh Open, but we (the members of Porthcawl) were told last year that a Porthcawl Open Championship was not on the R&A agenda at present, for all of the reasons often rehearsed in this thread and on this site. The Amateur (next year), The Seniors Open (coming back in 2017) and maybe a return one day of the Walker Cup, Curtis Cup, and/or Ladies Open remain the major tournament priorities for the club, I hope and think it's fair to say. Which is a terrific bunch of events.

[Thomas Dai]

The R&A announced a few weeks ago that the 2018 Seniors Amateur will be held at Royal Porthcawl whilst the 2018 British Amateur will be held at Royal Aberdeen.
Atb

[Ryan Coles]

What are the stumbling blocks for Royal Aberdeen hosting?

[Thomas Dai]

What are the stumbling blocks for Royal Aberdeen hosting?

Can't be many.


British Seniors in 2005
Walker Cup in 2011
Scottish Open in 2014
British Amateur in 2018
.......


Atb

[Mark Chaplin]

Royal Porthcawl gets more than its fair share of big events being the only course in Wales worthy of them and the national rotations. I doubt they'd have hosted 1/3 of the events if the club was on the other side of the Bristol Channel.

Likewise Royal Aberdeen is the north east Scotland biggie.

[Thomas Dai]

Likewise Royal Aberdeen is the north east Scotland biggie.

....unless that is your name is D....d T...p


As to Royal Porthcawl, I heard it mentioned recently that land west of the 4th-5th holes has been purchased by the club. Any confirmation?


Atb

[James Boon]

There are people talking about a lot of possible changes to the course because of the congestion in the middle. However, could things be sorted by moving the 13th green to the right, meaning to the right of the 14th hole? Thus opening up more room around the 16th green and 17th tee??? (probably still need to make 17 the 18th and 18th the first but Hoylake sets the precedent for hole numbering changes to host an Open)

Thomas,


Aberdeen and the surrounding area is generally perceived as the north east of Scotland while Inverness, Dornoch etc is generally perceived as the north. Confusing for those places on the eastern side of the north I know but such is life... 


Cheers,


James