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Jeremy Broom

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Walter J. Travis - Cherry Hill Club
« on: March 25, 2016, 12:09:32 PM »
GCAers,

Cherry Hill Club in Ridgeway, Ontario has been fortunate to have recently obtained of what appears to be original drawings/blueprints.  These photos are one, and the biggest, of the documents.  It appears to be linen and is 48"x60".  Some of the other documents include blueprints for part of the Clubhouse, it has a date stamp on it, 1924.  Ed Homsey was kind enough to spend some time with me and the documents, I will let him speak about our time together but he was very optimistic of what we had.  The Club does have the original Travis drawings; the new found documents are very similar to these drawings but are not exact.  I am hoping to gain some clarity on what the Club has obtained.  A thought is that these were working drawings that Harries used during construction/drainage installation.  It should be noted that Travis' name does not appear on any of the documents.  The Club is preparing to restore and preserve the documents.  If possible, I would appreciate comments from those who have seen similar drawings, specifically Travis and Harries documents.  Thanks in advance, it is an exciting time for Cherry Hill.

Kindest Regards,

Jeremy Broom
Executive Professional
Cherry Hill Club










Joe Hancock

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Re: Walter J. Travis - Cherry Hill Club
« Reply #1 on: March 25, 2016, 02:14:09 PM »
Nothing of historical significance in my comment, but way cool that your club has these documents and that they are going to preserve them!
" What the hell is the point of architecture and excellence in design if a "clever" set up trumps it all?" Peter Pallotta, June 21, 2016

"People aren't picking a side of the fairway off a tee because of a randomly internally contoured green ."  jeffwarne, February 24, 2017

John Connolly

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Re: Walter J. Travis - Cherry Hill Club
« Reply #2 on: March 25, 2016, 03:06:57 PM »
When I first looked at the images of the routing, I thought "Cool, a William Flynn course." Travis and Flynn either used the same drafting techniques, had the same printing company or used the same design software  ;D .
"And yet - and yet, this New Road will some day be the Old Road, too."

                                                      Neil Munroe (1863-1930)

Ed Homsey

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Re: Walter J. Travis - Cherry Hill Club
« Reply #3 on: March 25, 2016, 04:03:41 PM »
It was a real treat to spend some time with Jeremy and the Harries drawings that Cherry Hill Club recently acquired.  We were aware that Harries--a charter member of Cherry Hill Club--was in charge of the construction of the course, but were not aware of the detailed drawings that he, and his firm, created.  I wish that I had examined each hole in detail, and compared each hole of the Harries drawings with the original Travis hole maps that CHC displays in their men's locker room and included in their history book.  On two of the holes that I examined in detail, I was struck by the precision with which the Harries drawings matched the Travis drawings, including the fairway contours.  On two of the par three holes, the only difference I saw was the eliminatjion of forward hazards, on both holes.  It also occurred to me, later, that the Harries drawings reversed the 9s.  The Harries drawings were done in 1924.  Travis did his design work at CHC in 1922. 

A wonderful set of drawings.  I've seen blueprints from that era, but never blackprints!

Re the similarity to Flynn.  If you're speaking of William Flynn, it should be noted that he did the construction work for at least two Travis courses, that we know of.  Westchester CC (1919) and Onondaga Golf and Country Club (1919).  So, he would have had some familiarity with Travis's course drawings.

Ian Andrew

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Re: Walter J. Travis - Cherry Hill Club
« Reply #4 on: March 25, 2016, 06:43:49 PM »
That is a linen original.
William Harries was also an active architect and builder in the area.

He would have traced Travis's linen original to produce the base and then added the drain lines.
It's a plan to drain low points that weren't addressed during construction.
With every golf development bubble, the end was unexpected and brutal....

Jeff_Mingay

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Re: Walter J. Travis - Cherry Hill Club
« Reply #5 on: March 25, 2016, 09:44:05 PM »
Super cool, Jeremy.


For those of you unfamiliar with the club/course, Cherry Hill Club is a very cool place with some great Travis greens/features. It's definitely one of the most under-rated places for golf in Canada.


I was thinking the same, Ian: Those drawings look like they were done by Travis' hand.
jeffmingay.com

Ronald Montesano

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Re: Walter J. Travis - Cherry Hill Club
« Reply #6 on: March 25, 2016, 11:29:39 PM »
Everything breaks toward Buffalo. Trust me.
Coming in 2024
~Elmira Country Club
~Soaring Eagles
~Bonavista
~Indian Hills
~Maybe some more!!

Ian Andrew

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Re: Walter J. Travis - Cherry Hill Club
« Reply #7 on: March 26, 2016, 12:12:58 AM »
Everything breaks toward Buffalo. Trust me.

Except the NHL draft lottery!

hayoooo ... is this mike on?
I'm in Southern Ontario all week ... try the veal
With every golf development bubble, the end was unexpected and brutal....

Jeremy Broom

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: Walter J. Travis - Cherry Hill Club
« Reply #8 on: March 26, 2016, 08:59:17 AM »
That is a linen original.
William Harries was also an active architect and builder in the area.

He would have traced Travis's linen original to produce the base and then added the drain lines.
It's a plan to drain low points that weren't addressed during construction.

Thanks Ian, knew you would be able to provide some insight.  Look forward to sharing the documents with you when we can make our schedules align this spring.

JB

Jeremy Broom

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Re: Walter J. Travis - Cherry Hill Club
« Reply #9 on: March 26, 2016, 09:01:35 AM »
Everything breaks toward Buffalo. Trust me.

 ;) Very true.....unless it is uphill to Buffalo......

JB

Jeremy Broom

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Re: Walter J. Travis - Cherry Hill Club
« Reply #10 on: March 26, 2016, 09:10:28 AM »
Super cool, Jeremy.


For those of you unfamiliar with the club/course, Cherry Hill Club is a very cool place with some great Travis greens/features. It's definitely one of the most under-rated places for golf in Canada.


I was thinking the same, Ian: Those drawings look like they were done by Travis' hand.

Thanks for your kind words Jeff.  Yes, we do have a pretty special spot.  Next time you get down our way I would be happy to host, I think it has been a while since you have been to the Club.  John Gall and his team have been busy, improving turf conditions with tree removal has been a priority, you'll love it.

JB

Ed Homsey

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Re: Walter J. Travis - Cherry Hill Club
« Reply #11 on: March 26, 2016, 01:36:27 PM »
I would bet that, at CHC, Travis followed his usual practice of selecting and working closely with the builders of his course.  In a Feb. 1924 letter to James C. Willson, then President of the Louisville Country club, accompanying "plans and specifications for remodeled holes",Travis closed the letter with the following: "To secure the best, and most economical results it is abvolutely essential to have the construction work done by a man thoroughly experienced in this line.  It means the difference between success and failure.  My sole interest in such a man is to be ensured that my plans will be carried out.  Men of the highest attainments in this line are few and far between, but their technical knowledge and experience are such that the economies they are enabled to effect more than offset their expense---I can recommend such an expert in  George Davies, 201 First Ave., Asbury Park, N.J.....".

Thus, I think that it is pretty certain that Harries not only had access to Travis's plans, but that the two of them may have talked about the course plans, and its construction.  The CHC history book reports on a Feb. 6, 1923 organizational meeting at which it was noted that Travis "had been retained....to design the golf course." and that the Harries firm had already begun to "clear the land", in 1922, "well before Cherry Hill was incorporated". The history book continues, Harries "reviewed Walter Travis' plans and specifications and reported....He felt he could reduce this figure somewhat by eliminating the practice hole and some bunkers.  His proposed changes were sent to Travis for approval but there is no record of any response from the designer."


Thinking about the sequence of events, I am wondering whom we should credit for those wonderful greens at CHC?  Did Travis draw green contour maps, as he did for many of his projects.  If so, I'm certain that Ian Andrew has seen them and would be able to judge whether they match the greens as constructed. Ian?




Jeff_Mingay

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Re: Walter J. Travis - Cherry Hill Club
« Reply #12 on: March 27, 2016, 01:52:21 PM »
Thanks Jeremy. I'm going to take you up on your offer .. in fact, with clubs in tow, I should probably pick Ian up on the way.


Architects vs. Broom/Gall sounds like fun  :)
jeffmingay.com

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