Any Kiwi (or non-Kiwi) with an opinion on the latest New Zealand Top 40 list?

[Jim McCann]

I know, I know, yet ANOTHER damned golf course ranking list to peruse:

http://www.top100golfcourses.co.uk/htmlsite/story.asp?id=354

Would anybody with knowledge of golf in that particular part of the world
care to comment on Matt Richardson's article?

Thanks.

[Tom_Doak]

Well, I like their new #1.    And, in general, I like the list of courses which moved up the scale a bit [Paraparaumu and Arrowtown].  I have not seen Jack's Point or The Hills, though I spent some time with John Darby a couple of months ago and am interested to see his work now.

Most of all, I'm pleased that they are coming around to the idea of links courses, since it looks like we are going to be working on a links project on the North Island ... perhaps soon.

[Ash Towe]

All lists are subjective, so there are areas we can comment on and disagree with.  With that in mind, I think that Paraparaumu should swop places with Kauri Cliffs.  Titirangi and Wairakei should be 5 and 6 pushing Jacks Point and The Hills down 2 spots.  I would also place Auckland above Millbrook and Gulf Harbour though I have not played the new nine at Millbrook.

It is good to see Arrowtown move up 6 places and it could go even higher.

The biggest and best news was in Tom Doak's post that he could be building a new links course in the North Island.  It will be interesting to see where the site is and whether it will be a members club or a fee paying course similar to the other new courses built recently.

[Dane Hawker]

Sorry for the bump but I have just joined up.

Very good list, except it’s missing my course The North Shore Golf Club

Changes I would make.

The Cape and Kauri are a coin toss for me. Both are stunning. I prefer the natural browntop of The Cape over the ryegrass at Kauri. I was lucky enough to see Kauri Cliffs at different stages of construction from farm land to a masterpiece. If it was life and death I think I would make Kauri as number one as I’m born down the road at Kerikeri.
I have yet to play Paraparaumu. When Tiger played there during the NZ Open I watched it on TV and didn’t think much of it. I have seen recent photographs and Course Manager and ex Superintendent Leo Barber has made some huge improvements. I can’t wait to play it.

I would have Jacks Point ahead of Kinlock. Jacks Point has the best quality turf of any course in the country and its views at the top of the course are fantastic. It would be interesting to play the course in 20 years to see how it is with all the houses around it developed. I fear they will ruin the site.

 The Kinlock is very good and maybe the hardest course in the country. I would rate it higher but I had a slight dislike for the 6th and 8th holes. It has some very strong par threes when the wind is up. The 18th coming home is a little strange with the lake but it’s fun to have a go at the green in two.

The Hills is good. I really liked the hole between the cliffs with the waterfall into the bunker. It has lots of potential and most likely to be home of PGA for years to come.

I would place Wairakei above Titirangi if it had USGA greens and pure browntop fairways. It’s been my favourite course to play for a long time. It is fun to play off the white tees, yet it’s totally different off the back. Upgrade the greens and fairways, get some more fescue areas and it will jump up the list.

The rest of the list is pretty fair. Carrington could be higher and I'm sure it will be when some of the extreme green mounds are sorted.  Best Kikuyu fairways in the country. Royal Wellington may jump up the list next time if the upgrades are finished. It's looking really good from the photos I have seen.

Im also excited to see from another post Tom Doak is in the country soon to look at designing a new course. A links course in the North Island? Browntop greens and fairways please!!

Dane Hawker

[Kevin Pallier]

Dane

Welcome aboard

Jim

I look forward to seeing a lot of courses on the list next month and working out if I agree with same.

[Grant Saunders]

Hey Dane, good to see another Kiwi on board.

Hows the summer been treating you Auckland guys?

Curly question for you:

As super at a course with poa greens in a region where green speed is almost the sole criteria for golfers when judging a courses quality, how do you sell the move for courses to go back to browntop and the slower speeds associated with it? I ask because I feel that a lot of clubs are digging themselves a pretty deep hole by embracing speed at huge costs.

As for the list, I havent played enough of the courses to form a solid opinion. Of the ones I have played, there is no way that Terrace downs, Gulf Harbour and Clearwater should be ranked above Arrowtown. I would place Titirangi (have played) above the Hills (havent played but walked several times). Agree with the comments about Jacks Point's turf quality. Its probably unsurpassed in NZ in that area.

Im looking forward to playing Paraparaumu in a few weeks for the first time. Might have to hit the practice fairway between now and then though.

[Dane Hawker]

Hey Grant!

Been a very wet summer. Dark in the mornings now so I guess we missed this one.

I wouldnt say browntop is that much slower. Poa is a resource hog! Yes we can have great surfaces but its at a price. I am slowly introducing browntop at renovations. Greens speeds will always be debated. I myself prefer playing speeds around 10 1/2 feet but I enjoy running tournaments at 12ft to sort the men out from the boys

In a few years when more and more chemicals are banned we will no doubt be on browntop greens. Its not if but when. I am trying to get there before I am forced. Why keep on growing a grass that needs lots of water, fertiliser and fungicides.

Why not redo your putting green and sow it in browntop. Show them the surface that can be had.