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Jim_Kennedy

  • Karma: +0/-0
who's the architect?
« on: December 27, 2001, 10:20:36 AM »
This one is probably too easy for this group to figure out:
He got a degree - even though there wasn't officially a program in it - in landscape architecture with the intent of becoming a golf course designer. This was during the boom of golf course design in the 1920s. He joined a well respected east coast firm and worked on courses in Massachusetts, Florida and Georgia before starting his own practice.

To those who know this architect:
The photos are of remodeling work done on one of his courses by an architect who does not always receive positive feedback on this site. I am not familiar with the original architect's style but is the work pictured here faithful to it?
I like what I see.    

  



« Last Edit: December 31, 1969, 07:00:00 PM by 1056376800 »
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"I never beat a well man in my life" - Harry Vardon

SPDB

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: who's the architect?
« Reply #1 on: December 27, 2001, 10:51:38 AM »
Cornish?

That second pic is giving me a case of vertigo - i assume the camera was tilted, and the land is not that severe?
« Last Edit: December 31, 1969, 07:00:00 PM by 1056376800 »
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A Clay Man

Re: who's the architect?
« Reply #2 on: December 27, 2001, 11:10:08 AM »
From what little restoration work I've seen this appears to be incomplete. The green looks as though it should've been brought out even further nearer the bunkers. Just my HO but it looks like the standard cookie cutter collar.

 ;)
« Last Edit: December 31, 1969, 07:00:00 PM by 1056376800 »
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Doug Wright

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: who's the architect?
« Reply #3 on: December 27, 2001, 11:15:11 AM »
Jim,

Is this a seaside links  ??? Looks like a whale spouting in that second picture... :o

happy Holidays,
« Last Edit: December 31, 1969, 07:00:00 PM by 1056376800 »
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Twitter: @Deneuchre

RJ_Daley

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: who's the architect?
« Reply #4 on: December 27, 2001, 12:57:49 PM »
Although I have not seen a 'Steamshovel' Banks or Barton's work, I assume the style of green and surrounds depicted specially in the second picture is of the Macdonald and Raynor school or genre.  I heard from Bruce Hepner that Leonard MacCumber also did some surveying work for Raynor.  But, none of their biographies are in synch with your description, Jim.  The only other archie I know who did green designs of squarish dimensions and steep sloped turf faced engulfing bunkers to flatish sand like your second pic, was Langford.  The second picture looks quite a bit like the 3rd at CC of Charleston, although I am sure it is not.  Of course that was Raynor.  

If you are saying the first picture is of the result of a remodelling of the course from where the second pic was taken, I'd say that the bunker openings have been given that "upholstered" look that was so objectionalble when we had the big "Merion" discussion.  The first also has some resemblance to Yeamans Hall, but YH is more rustic and Doak and crew gave the bunkers a more sharp edged outer lip.  Besides, the first pic looks too lush to be YH.  

I'm anxious for you to tell us who and where the course you have posted is...
« Last Edit: December 31, 1969, 07:00:00 PM by 1056376800 »
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Jim_Kennedy

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: who's the architect?
« Reply #5 on: December 27, 2001, 01:21:15 PM »
SPDB,
It isn't Cornish. Alfred Hitchcock would definitely admire the photographer who took the second photo though :)

Aclayman,
The green in the second pic seems pretty close to the edge of its pad, doesn't it?

RJ,
Sorry if the photos misled you. They are entirely different greens.
« Last Edit: December 31, 1969, 07:00:00 PM by 1056376800 »
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"I never beat a well man in my life" - Harry Vardon

Ed_Baker

Re: who's the architect?
« Reply #6 on: December 27, 2001, 01:26:09 PM »
Brian Silva?
« Last Edit: December 31, 1969, 07:00:00 PM by 1056376800 »
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ian andrew (Guest)

Re: who's the architect?
« Reply #7 on: December 27, 2001, 01:34:12 PM »
art hills
« Last Edit: December 31, 1969, 07:00:00 PM by 1056376800 »
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RJ_Daley

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: who's the architect?
« Reply #8 on: December 27, 2001, 01:34:48 PM »
Jim, honestly - even I can see that  ;D  8)  I was guessing that the first pic might be on the same course though - and an example of the remodelling of the harder edge that is depicted in the second picture...  Is the second picture a bit of trickery in that it is a zoomed in view with the foreground bunkers being fairway bunkers of a completely different hole than the green in background.  I am going to look again at my personal pictures, as that could be something at CC of C after all.  Boy, would my face ever be red... :-[
« Last Edit: December 31, 1969, 07:00:00 PM by 1056376800 »
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RJ_Daley

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: who's the architect?
« Reply #9 on: December 27, 2001, 01:40:56 PM »
Ed Baker, I could easily believe it is Brian Silva's homage to Raynor at Black Creek, (although I never have seen it personally).  But, Jim's biography info in the first post is eliminating that possibility.  
« Last Edit: December 31, 1969, 07:00:00 PM by 1056376800 »
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Ed_Baker

Re: who's the architect?
« Reply #10 on: December 27, 2001, 01:55:05 PM »
Dick,

I missed the "1920's" in the bio. At least we agree on the "style".

Thanks,
Ed
« Last Edit: December 31, 1969, 07:00:00 PM by 1056376800 »
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Tom MacWood (Guest)

Re: who's the architect?
« Reply #11 on: December 27, 2001, 02:15:31 PM »
Is it the former partner of your last 'who's the architect'? Wayne Stiles.

If it is Stiles, I'm not an expert on his work, I know it has been described as being influenced by Ross.  This remodeling looks to be very Ross-like, but I'm not sure if that is entirely accurate. Gary Sherman is the Wayne Stiles expert, perhaps he is lurking.
« Last Edit: December 31, 1969, 07:00:00 PM by 1056376800 »
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TEPaul

Re: who's the architect?
« Reply #12 on: December 27, 2001, 02:27:43 PM »
Judging from the brief bio it looks like John R. Van Kleek again (Stiles's partner).
« Last Edit: December 31, 1969, 07:00:00 PM by 1056376800 »
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Jim_Kennedy

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: who's the architect?
« Reply #13 on: December 27, 2001, 03:05:51 PM »
Ian, Tom Mac, TEPaul,
I knew you guys were too good.
It's an Art Hills restoration{1992} of Forest Akers, the course at Michigan State Univ.
The subject architect is the late Bruce Matthews and the course was built in 1958. Matthews was employed by Stiles and Van Kleek in 1925 or so. I wondered why the school didn't ask the other Matthews to work the course over but saw that Hills is an alumnus of the school.
« Last Edit: December 31, 1969, 07:00:00 PM by 1056376800 »
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"I never beat a well man in my life" - Harry Vardon

TEPaul

Re: who's the architect?
« Reply #14 on: December 27, 2001, 03:42:04 PM »
JimK:

I'm not good at all, matter of fact all I did is just check Van Kleek's bio and it seemed to sort of fit. But I sure did learn something from this because I knew exactly zero about any of the Matthews family before this particular thread. But now I do and there does seem to be an amazing style going on here with some very interesting and identifiable "roots"! That looks to me like a real throw-back style green for a 1958 course!

Very good job on your part!
« Last Edit: December 31, 1969, 07:00:00 PM by 1056376800 »
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