Daley/Scaletti Feature Interview is posted

[Ran Morrissett]

Considering how famous the sandbelt courses are outside of Melbourne, one would imagine that there would be any number of coffee table books on the subject. Alas, until the recent publication of The Sandbelt - Melbournes's Golfing Heaven by Paul Daley and photographer David Scaletti, there were none.

Mercifully, that has now changed. Combining excellent full page photography with text from many of the most knowledgeable golfers in Australia, The Sandbelt appeals to a wide audience. While it serves as an excellent guide to anyone considering a trip down under, even if you never go, you will gain a far better appreciation of what makes these courses so special and unique in the world of golf.

Paul and David have established a publishing infrastructure to do more such topic specific golf books and we wish them the very best, as they are providing the game a genuine service.

Cheers,

[Tim_Weiman]

Ran:

Pretty awesome.  I should probably spend less time on the DG and more time on the rest of the site.  Thanks for highlighting what Paul and David have done.

One other thought: among other things, I found your first question (and the response) very interesting.  As consumers, we are delighted that folks like Paul and David made the effort they did.

Which got me to thinking about another candidate for a feature interview: Brian Lewis.  It might seem like an odd choice, but is there anyone who has done more to support the renaissance in golf architecture books over the last five years or so?

[WoodironAndy]

     Great interview!! Maybe I missed it on previous GCA Posts but any information on where I could purchase this book would be greatly appreciated.

                      Thanks,
                                  Andy Silis

[Tim_Weiman]

Andy:

Paul Daley can be reached at fswing@bigpond.net.au

[Jeff Mingay]

Paul,

Love the new book, as you know.

I continually get the impression that nearly all of the courses in The Sandbelt -- with the exception of Royal Melbourne -- have undergone many, many changes to their original layouts over the years.

Are there a new legion of Melbourne golfers, within the various clubs, interested in the design history of these courses today? More than, say, even a decade ago, for the sake of comparison.

Curious,  

[Paul Daley]

Thankyou Ran, Tim, Andy, and Jeff for your comments.
 

Jeff:
Your impression that many of the Sandbelt clubs have changed from their origianal layouts is accurate. Even RMGC is not immune, having relocated from East Malvern to Sandringham, then to Black Rock. However, once the club was finally settled at Black Rock (1931), they have had little cause to change/tamper with the layouts. Naturally, minor changes have taken place, almost imperceptively.

By comparision, Kingston Heath has undertaken more structural change: significant mounding on the 2nd, 6th green reconstruction, new dip in front of 7th green, 11th hole - huge controversy over installation of bunker in middle of fairway/tea-trea removal/tee location, 12th hole new back tee and clearance of left-hand tea-tree, which ultimately led to the discovery of some original bunkers (buried over time) and now reinstituted, 13th hole bunkering and green work, 14th green, plus 18th hole fortification. In my opinion, the KH changes have been excellent and usually forward thinking, without sacrificing the character of the course.

In 1925 KH was a bogey 82, then 80, then 78, then 76, 75 ... and so on. It explains why some people are mystified about KH's uphill 17th hole - "what an odd par 4" ... some say. Well, it was a par 5 for most of its life! With the passage of time, ten par 5s have been reduced to par 4s.

The incidence of design and history buffs within the Sandbelt clubs has risen slightly over the past ten years, but only just! Like most golfers around the globe, Melburnians generally tap into golf for aesthetics, a bit of exercise, and to give the ball a jolly good belting.

However, at committees and board level, there is a strong movement to form foundations, history committes and so on. Nevertheless, this doesn't seem to be rubbing off on the general club membership.

[Mike Claytont]

Jeff

It's true the SB has changed much for many reasons
1/ boundary problems forced several changes - nearly all detrimental eg 3,12 Yarra Yarra, 2,3 and 17 at Victoria,14 and 15 at Huntingdale 10 at Commonwealth ,10 East RM and the origional back 9 at Metro was lost to a school.

2 / overplanting of trees and worse 99% non-indigenous trees

3 / rounding off of bunkers for 'neatness' and /or maintainance

4 /committees not understanding what precious and fragile and subtle things they were dealing with.

5 /The Golf Union having this mystical 'Australian Open Rating' system all clubs are desperate to maintain. Commonwealth changed it's great opener because they were told it was too short -270 yds- to use for a tournament.
Rubbish in my opinion.
6 -arrogant architects who thought themselves equals of Mackenzie,Morcom Soutar and Rusell.

Very few care much about architectual history/heritage and the wealthy yuppies who have taken up the game in the past decade havn't helped because they generally revere 'perfect condition' over design -which they don't understand anyway.

 Nor does it help when people of influence suggest the courses of the SB are too short for championships.

It seems to me hard,fast greens great bunkering wonderful design and ever present wind will keep most honest.

[Mike Duffy]

Michael,

Unfortunately you are correct. The "yuppies" you refer to are in some instances now in positions of power as club captains and presidents. Their knowledge of the traditions and history of the sandbelt for the most part, is abysmal.

I fear, that with the present generation of people in charge of Melbourne's sandbelt clubs, we will begin to witness shortly many changes to the courses, most of the for the worse. Everything will determined by appearance and comfort.

The original first at Commonwealth was indeed a "fun" opener.

I worked at the 1972 Victorian Open Championship which was held there, and I recollect just as many fives, or maybe more, then threes on that opener. In fact, I think it was the explosive Billy Dunk who ran up a seven there on one of the days.

Unless the present trend can be halted,  you can expect to see more of  destructive work at Commonwealth enacted elsewhere, all in the name of progress and in the cause of "betterment".

I truly despair.

[Tim_Weiman]

Mike Clayton/Mike Duffy:

I was hoping Australia would remain free of the influence you describe.  It seems nothing is safe.

[Paul Daley]

Thankyou Ran, Tim, Andy, and Jeff for your comments.
 

Jeff:
Your impression that many of the Sandbelt clubs have changed from their origianal layouts is accurate. Even RMGC is not immune, having relocated from East Malvern to Sandringham, then to Black Rock. However, once the club was finally settled at Black Rock (1931), they have had little cause to change/tamper with the layouts. Naturally, minor changes have taken place, almost imperceptively.

By comparision, Kingston Heath has undertaken more structural change: significant mounding on the 2nd, 6th green reconstruction, new dip in front of 7th green, 11th hole - huge controversy over installation of bunker in middle of fairway/tea-trea removal/tee location, 12th hole new back tee and clearance of left-hand tea-tree, which ultimately led to the discovery of some original bunkers (buried over time) and now reinstituted, 13th hole bunkering and green work, 14th green, plus 18th hole fortification. In my opinion, the KH changes have been excellent and usually forward thinking, without sacrificing the character of the course.

In 1925 KH was a bogey 82, then 80, then 78, then 76, 75 ... and so on. It explains why some people are mystified about KH's uphill 17th hole - "what an odd par 4" ... some say. Well, it was a par 5 for most of its life! With the passage of time, ten par 5s have been reduced to par 4s.

The incidence of design and history buffs within the Sandbelt clubs has risen slightly over the past ten years, but only just! Like most golfers around the globe, Melburnians generally tap into golf for aesthetics, a bit of exercise, and to give the ball a jolly good belting.

However, at committees and board level, there is a strong movement to form foundations, history committes and so on. Nevertheless, this doesn't seem to be rubbing off on the general club membership.

[Shane Gurnett]

Paul Daley

Love the book and find your comments in the interview quite interesting. I would however take serious issue with your comment:

"From 1986 onwards, Commonwealth commenced its ‘modernising’ program. Most significantly, this saw the elimination of its classic opening hole – a driveable par-4. In time, the wonderful par-3 7th went as well. These two holes aside, the impact of architect, Kevin Hartley lies somewhere between neutral-and-positive. The course has been lengthened, and I do like the new 8th hole fairway bunkering, and mounding."

This is a bit like saying "we've cut off one of Elle McPhersons legs and one of her breasts, but shes been given a new haircut which we think looks positive".

Make no mistake, Hartley slaughtered CGC in the pursuit of length, with no regard given to how the course changes would fit in with the remaining holes. The new 7th hole is a very ordinary effort compared to what was previosuly there, and belongs on the Gold Coast, not the sand belt. Not one of the new Hartley bunkers fits in with the rest of the course.

As I've said before, this sort of business is like drawing a moustache on the Mona Lisa. When will they learn?

[Chris Kane]

Although I'm a Commonwealth member, I was too young when the changes took place to know anything about them.  What I know about the old layout is only what I'm told during my rounds there.

[Shane Gurnett]

Chris Kane

I'm looking forward to our game shortly, so I can take you through the various course changes and what you've missed out on at Commonwealth. Its nothing short of a tragedy.

Its true, to some degree, what you say about the members accepting the change, but its only valid for those who have joined post Hartley and therefore know no better. Dig a little deeper and you'll find that virtually without exception, there is an acknowldegement by the elders of the club of what a disaster they presided over. Hopefully there's a lesson here for all clubs to make sure that the first perogative of members is to maintain the integrity of the course in the face of passing fashions. Think of the next generation, and what you will be leaving behind for them.

Mike Claytons comments in respect of the sand belt, and Commonwealth in particular could not be more spot on. Where the layouts of the sand belt have been touched during the last fifty years, only those which have focussed on restoration as opposed to redesign have been successful. Royal and the 'Heath are the best examples of how it should be done.

[Paul Daley]

Shane:

Thanks for your thoughts, although it does appear you have misinterpreted what I said about Commonwealth. I never said Hartley did a good job, I said that "these two holes aside his influence was somewhere between neutral and positve". And so, we are both on the same wavelength. Actually, I feel so strongly about what C'wealth did to the 1st and 7th holes, that you may recollect that I named one vignette in the book: "A minutes Silence Please" in honour of those two departed holes. I can't make myself much clearer than that!

[WoodironAndy]

Paul!

          Could you post info regarding purchasing of your book here. I tried to e-mail you at fswing@bigpond.net.au (the e-mail address for you that Tim posted) but it was returned as undeliverable. Is that your correct e-mail address? Thanks, as I'm anxiously awaiting acquisition of your book!
                             Regards,
                                         Andy Silis

[Paul Daley]

Andy:

Much obliged for your interest in obtaining a copy of the Sandbelt book. My email address is:

fswing@bigpond.net.au

Surprised to hear that it came back undeliverable, try again, I'm sure it will be fixed. Please post your email address under this one.

Cheers

[Shane Gurnett]

Thanks Paul. Well said. The minutes silence is a fitting tribute to two "deaths" in the family.

Shane

[Greg Ramsay]

Like in David Scaletti’s photography, it is Paul Daley’s attention to detail that really leaves an impression on me.  This is particularly the case in his choice of subject matter, which adds a real ‘human’ element, or at least a real ‘golfer’ element.  In between the wonderful analysis of the golf holes, the discussion of the strategic bunkering, and the contributions from others; it is the commentary on the member’s pet one-legged magpie, the great social matches, and the celebrity stories which really give the reader a closer appreciation of the golfing community which enjoys the sandbelt.  Just as in Paul’s selection of ‘outside the square’ topics for his book ‘Links Golf- The Inside Story’ (the formation of dunes, the shots required for links golf, the B&B’s) the reader is somehow brought closer to the subject through the variety of issues discussed in such an entertaining way.  

As for David.  Well I have sat out on a dune at 5am in the morning with him, in a howling breeze after a very hectic night drinking all sorts of concoctions, so I know all about his attention to detail and determination to get the perfect picture!  Lets just say that David is not one of those everyday photographers who takes rolls and rolls of film, hoping one of the shots will come out- David makes sure he is at the right place, at the right time to take that 1 opportunity for exactly the pic he wants!  Go to www.sportscapes.com and see for yourself.

I have devoured this first instalment, and eagerly await their next publication

Greg Ramsay
www.barnbougledunes.com

[Tom MacWood (Guest)]

Paul
Did you discover any lost Sandbelt courses?

[Jeff_Lewis]

What an amazing piece of information on RM East. I remember being very skeptical that 6 Russell holes would rate inclusion over any 6 AM holes, but felt compelled to admit that the composite was better than either course. What a relief to find that AM was on the case!

[Paul Daley]

TOM:

Saldly unlike in Daniel Wexler's great book - Missing Links - I did not find any missing "sandie's". That said, we did manage to cast the spotlight onto a number of high class courses, that for one reason or another: class, politics, religion, misconception, scared cow, widespread personal bias, plus convention thinking, have not been popularly mentioned as being "on the sandbelt". A travesty of justice has been allowed to take place - all for the wrong reasons. And so, this book was an opportunity to even the ledger, not play politics, and record for posterity our take on the sandbelt region. In doing so, we brought courses such as Long Island, Spring Valley, Southern, Kingswood, and Woodlands into the fold.

[Paul Daley]

Jeff:

You bet, it is quite startling, so much so, I don't beleive the ramifications of it have fully set in!