Lost Dunes: Computerized Pin Placement??

[Mike Demetriou]

I had the pleasure to play Lost Dunes on a gorgeous Saturday morning this weekend.  I loved the course, and am excited to get back out there promptly.  I had a relatively veteran Caddie named Chris, who told me that a lot of guys complain about the pin placements, given that the green complexes are relatively wild. I say relatively because I played Ballyneal the week prior (July has been a GREAT month for me) and comparitively, the greens at LD are kind of tame.  Regardless, he said some of the members and guests alike complain about tough pin placements which are the result of the course's reliance on a computer system to determine the pin placement.

Before the luddites start attacking the concept as ridiculous (which it may in fact be) can the experts here explain a few things for me?
1. Was Chris right, is there a computer choosing pin locations?
2. What benefit could this possibly serve? (he said it was in a bid to reduce wear and tear on the green)
3. Is a computer THAT much better at pinning a green than an experienced Super?
4. Are there other courses of note that use a system like this?
5. What kind of expense is this? I'm guessing some crazy digital surveying has to be accomplished prior to a system like this working as advertised, or am I overthinking the concept?
6. Has anyone really studied this concept to determine if the results are definiitve? I'm guessing "John Henry" wins here, but I could be wrong...

Thanks in advance!

[Matt OBrien]

I think what he is trying to say is that they use a little device on the greens that measures the slope of the spot in which the hole will be cut. It is not uncommon for a course to do this for tournaments and such but I think it is a little to much to have to do everyday.

[Mike Demetriou]

Matt, I thought that might be the case, but he said the computer "determines the pin locations". He may not have been right, but that's what I'm wondering.  He also said that this is what happens when you have a Super who doesn't play. I thought that was a bit harsh, but I have no clue if it is true or not, having no knowledge of the Super, staff ect. We played unaccompanied, so I didn't meet any members who could've weighed in.

Regardless, the course was remarkable.

ALSO, I forgot to mention that I was very excited to wear my Ballyneal "I'm on a Doak" hat - definitely the coolest tournament Schwag I've received in a long time...

[Tom_Doak]

I have not heard anything about this but I will try to find out.

In previous years, Lost Dunes had used a 13-day rotation for the hole locations, which always caused some problems because most days it meant there were 2-3 holes that were in nutty places.  But, the greens are difficult and the guy in charge of cutting holes [as well as the guy who designed the course] is always going to be open to criticism as a result.


P.S.  I have not heard anything about the hats, either, which is kind of amazing since in theory someone would need my permission to use my name in that manner!

[PCCraig]

I can't imagine you would really need a computer to pin those greens. While "wild and crazy" in spots for the most part each green features pockets of pinnable areas. Once in those pockets I find the 5-15ft putts to be pretty flat and simple. Maybe that's just me though.

[Mike Demetriou]

Perhaps the use of said computer was a one time analysis, which generated the 13-day rotation you're talking about?  Regardless, the question is more out of ignorance than anything - I never really knew how the hole locations were theorized, with the exception of the Sunday pin concept.

[Mark Smolens]

When we were over for the Midwest Mashie one of the caddies in our group told us the same thing -- that the super had invested in some type of computer program which dictated the rotations for the varying pin placements. The caddie was equally unimpressed as has been the tenor of this thread.

Ballyneal and Lost Dunes in the same month. Pretty good July.

[Jud_T]

so THAT'S why I missed those clutch putts on 11 and 15 to let you back into the match!    And I have to admit that the hats are the money.....

[Mike McGuire]

This is a great solution in dealing with whiners about pin placements.

"sorry about that pin placement, the computer picked it out"

[Richard Hetzel]

This is a great solution in dealing with whiners about pin placements.

"sorry about that pin placement, the computer picked it out"

+1. How smart is that? Blame it on technology!

[Joe Perches]

I have not heard anything about the hats, either, which is kind of amazing since in theory someone would need my permission to use my name in that manner!

Though it would certainly be polite, I'm not sure permission is actually necessary.

De minimus, factual and such.
(No, I'm not a lawyer, though if you pay one (enough?), you'll likely get a different opinion...)

As far as I know Doak isn't trademarked for anything other than soap.
At least that's what Tess tells me.

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