The Rules of Attribution

[JMorgan]

Okay, JMorgan.

Rule #1 -- For the first ten to twenty years of the course's existence, the designer of record is whomever the owner says it is.

Rule #2 -- After that, all hell breaks loose.

Rule #3 -- Long-term, the guy who routed the course and the guy who made the final call on the shaping of the greens are the ones who should be recognized.  Bunkers are just window dressing on most courses, so moving them counts for nothing.

Rule #4 -- Anyone who has changed the routing of more than two holes, or rebuilt and changed more than two greens, should receive redesign credit.  I suggest that "changes" qualifying for attribution should be EXPENSIVE changes, so that architects will not be tempted to make little changes in order to attach their name to a famous course.  [I'm sure someone will be SHOCKED that I insinuated such a thing, to which my response is:  www.reesjonesinc.com ]

Now we're cookin'! 

[Bob Jenkins]

This discussion is very relevant to what has been happening at Predator Ridge Golf Resort which is near Vernon, B.C. See www.predatorridge.com   and there is a map which shows the layout of the courses.

Until recently, there were 27 holes, all designed and built under the direction of Les Furber in the 1990s. They were known as the Osprey, Red Tail and Peregrine nines. It has been a very successful resort, likely the most successful in the Okanagan Valley of B.C., which has seen a tremendous amount of development in the last 15 years.

The resort decided to add another 9 holes and hired Doug Carrick to do the design. Doug's new nine holes are completely new but with the exception of one hole on the old Peregrine 9, Doug has followed the routing of the old Peregrine 9. Each of those holes was completely rebuilt as tees and fairways were scraped out, all greens were rebuilt, new drainage, irrigation etc. The new Doug Carrick holes start after what was the 4th hole of the old Peregrine 9 and end at what was the old Peregrine 5th, however that hole has been lengthened considerably and will be the 13th and Doug has added a new hole which will be the 14th.

Considering the terrain and the real estate that was near some of the Peregrine 9, Doug did not have much if any choice but to follow the original Furber 9 holes as part of the new course.

The resort is openly advertising the new course, which will be known as the "Ridge" course, as a Doug Carrick design.

I am not being critical but it seems to me that a significant amount of the work that remains, specifically the routing for at least 8 and likely 9 of the holes, were the work of Les Furber. That course is not yet open although I have walked it a few times and it looks great but clearly different in character than the work of Les Furber. Les' greens were much more severe and undulating whereas Doug's are much more subtle. The bunker work by Doug is clearly different  and there may be more distinquishing features but I will need to play it once it opens in July before I can comment further.

In conclusion, considering Ian's criteria in particular, it seems to me that the Ridge course is really in part a Les Furber design. The original Osprey and Red Tail nines by Les Furber are now known as the Predator Course. 

[TEPaul]

JMorgan:

The real problem with anyone trying to figure out how to assign design credit or some methodology for it for all the little architectural things that go on in the creation of a golf course, is that that kind of thing is basically never even recorded in the first place, and that's generally why the architect of record gets the design credit.

But in my opinon, if some club wants to assign design credit to everyone who had significant design input then the best they can do is to just take every single thing that ever was recorded accurately by those who did it and just put it into their archives and let researchers now and in the future interpret it and what it means any way they want to.