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Ian_L

  • Total Karma: 0
Since professionals have outgrown classic courses in the last several decades, are architectural features on these courses now more in play for the weaker player, who can now often hit it as far as the professionals did in the Golden Age?  Is golf now more of a thinking man's game for the amateur, who likely uses more run-up shots and cannot clear all the original bunkers on his/her drive?

Ally Mcintosh

  • Total Karma: 7
Re: Has Architecture on Old Courses Become More Amateur Oriented?
« Reply #1 on: October 07, 2008, 04:48:08 AM »
It should be.... Except that 90% of amateur golfers don't think....

Rich Goodale

Re: Has Architecture on Old Courses Become More Amateur Oriented?
« Reply #2 on: October 07, 2008, 07:21:50 AM »
Good topic, Ian

I can hit my ball now with my equipment roughly as far as Tom Watson could with his ball and equipment in 1981.  I base this on following him and Sandy tatum around Royal Dornoch in 1981 and my many plays of that course previously and since that encounter.  What I could not then and still cannot do, however, is hit approach shots so cleanly and crisply as could and can a player of Tom's caliber (then and now).  I am sure if we ever played together he would still outdrive me, and still play the aerial game to holes that I would have a hope in hell of hitting only using the ground game (e.g. the 14th at Dornoch).

But, getting to the question, this was also the case in 1981, when Tom and I were both in our early-mid-30s.  Amateurs have ALWAYS had ways to attack great courses, if they turned on their brains from time to time and realised that they were never and would never be as good as Watson or any other of the 10,000+ top pros, and decided not to try to emulate them.

Interesting golf courses have and always will be "Amateur" oriented.

rich

Phil_the_Author

Re: Has Architecture on Old Courses Become More Amateur Oriented?
« Reply #3 on: October 07, 2008, 09:57:52 AM »
Ally,

Unfortunately you're giving too much credit to the other 10%...

Phil Benedict

  • Total Karma: 0
Re: Has Architecture on Old Courses Become More Amateur Oriented?
« Reply #4 on: October 07, 2008, 12:11:03 PM »


Interesting golf courses have and always will be "Amateur" oriented.

rich

You could argue that elite golfers have never played interesting golf and that technology is making them less interesting still.

Patrick_Mucci

Re: Has Architecture on Old Courses Become More Amateur Oriented?
« Reply #5 on: October 07, 2008, 07:54:23 PM »
Ian,

I think that's a great question.

A few years ago I played Winged Foot West with Neil Regan and Tom Nieporte.

We played from tees that approximated the U.S. Open course in 1959.

It was a lot of fun.

Playing WFW from the U.S. Open tees isn't fun, especially if your score counts for something..

If nothing else, it's an endorsement to play from tees commensurate with your game.

Ian_L

  • Total Karma: 0
Re: Has Architecture on Old Courses Become More Amateur Oriented?
« Reply #6 on: October 08, 2008, 05:31:02 PM »
Interesting answers.  One thing I forgot to mention is that the amateur sees bunkers as hazards, instead of a safe miss as most professionals do today.

Jeff_Brauer

  • Total Karma: 3
Re: Has Architecture on Old Courses Become More Amateur Oriented?
« Reply #7 on: October 09, 2008, 07:45:12 AM »
Ian,

I like to say that my "target design foursome" is 3 single digit handicappers - with one each having the major game strength of length, accuracy and finesse.  The fourth is a high handicapper.  I rarely design for Tour Pros, since at 99% of courses, they simply won't show up.
Jeff Brauer, ASGCA Director of Outreach