[Tom Huckaby]

Patrick:

That was lawyer-speak worthy of shivas.  What's the title of this thread again?

Oh yeah.....

Is the handicap system the double edged sword

Sorry, you can't use Sand Hills as an example here.

As for the rest, good lord you have worn me down.  I understand what you are TRYING to get at here.  Once again, I not only don't see the huge problem, I see no viable solutions.

Why don't you offer some?

[Patrick_Mucci]

Less than 20% of all golfers have handicaps.  Of those, about 20% never or rarely post a score (0-5 posted scores per year.)

So, the approximately 16% of golfers who regularly maintain a handicap must have a huge influence over all golf courses if their desire to have a handicap is driving all these course changes.

Of course they do.

They're the ones who run the club

Americans love to "know the score".  They like to compete against their personal bests just as much or more than they like to compete against other golfers.  

This desire, not a handicap is what drives them to finish every hole.

Go play a muni any Saturday or Sunday and you'll see that almost everyone with the exception of some beginners (mostly female) finish every hole.  

Ask how many maintain a handicap.  
It will be a relatively small number.

Why is foursomes not a popular form of play in America?  
Because they wont' have score or they won't be getting their money's worth.

The British are more interested in competing against each other than against themselves.  That is the nature of sport there.

The part of handicapping that is always good for a laugh is when you go to a course to do a rating and all the old guys will tell you how the course is much tougher than its rating.  I then would point out that if we raise the rating, their handicap will go down.  Immediately they tell me that the course is actually rated way to high.

That's good.

Likewise, a friend of mine doesn't get upset by cheaters because he feels their lower scores obtained through cheating lower their handicap, versus their true handicap.

[Kalen Braley]

JVB,

I have felt this way concerning 4-somes.  If i'm playing a course, I want to play every shot.  Even in a scramble you get to putt most of the time unless there is a really good putter on your team.

I could see playing 4 somes in a GCA get together kind of event, but can't imagine visiting a really nice course in the UK and being required to play 4 somes, unless its the 2nd round at a course like Muirfield.  (I believe they do the package 36 hole deal with morning 4 ball, lunch, and afternoon 4 somes)

[Sean_A]

Saying the handicap system is the cause for softening features is very different from saying players with handicaps are responsible for softening features.  I can't fathom why handicapping would be to blame.  The idea of handicapping has been around for donkeys ages.  People are responsible for softening features.

Sadly, I think the UK is going more and more toward killing 4somes.  I can't recall the last time I saw anybody play greensomes - which as a game is the best thing going - especially if handicaps are involved.  There is so much strategy as to choosing whose drive to take.  I don't know why it isn't more popular.  Perhaps its for the same reason 4somes is dying - folks like to hit their own ball - worrying about scores rather than playing a game.  Its a pity.

Ciao

[TEPaul]

JVB:

Your reply #25 rings as historically true to me. It seems like it pretty much evolved over here from the fact, as you said, that American's just "like to know the score" in a gross round sense even if they're playing match play or even if they aren't playing against anyone.

I was looking at the way it once was in all forms of match play abroad in Chapman's book and it seems it wasn't all that long ago that all players abroad playing match play didn't even consider strokes in a numerical sense---eg it was all done with, "the Odd, the Like etc, etc. In that type of calculation with match play a numerical score wasn't just unnecessary but it was pretty much unknown! 

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