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Dan_Callahan

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Three Days in Vermont (with photos)
« on: July 21, 2008, 07:45:53 PM »
Last weekend, I went with three friends to Okemo for two nights at the Jackson-Gore hotel and rounds at Green Mountain National, Okemo, and Tater Hill. The weather was very, very muggy. Friday and Saturday hit 90 with what seemed like 100 percent humidity. The haze obfuscated the views that are so spectacular in the fall.

We started on Friday afternoon at Green Mountain National, a muni that is regarded by some as the best pubic course in the state. Weekend play required a cart, which ended up not being a bad thing given the heat and hilly terrain. GMN is a very tight course that isn't incredibly long. One guy in our group was a short hitter, so we played one up from the tips at about 6,200 yards. I think I hit driver only twice, opting for a 4-iron more often than not. While the course gets heavy traffic, the greens were spectacular and incredibly fast. Huge undulations, coupled with the speed, made for a cautious day with the putter. Here are a few photos in no particular order:













Next on the trip was Okemo, a course I played a few years ago and came away less than impressed with. I remembered lots of lost balls in the tall grass (heather?) and many forced layups. On the second time around, my opinion changed dramatically. Coming from the narrow fairways of GMN, Okemo's open vistas were refreshing. It bills itself as an American heathland course, an obvious a marketing term but it does convey something different than the typical New England layout. Okemo is also not incredibly long. We played it at about 6,300 yards, and I hit driver at least 10 times. I'm not sure if they thinned the wispy grass, but it seemed to be much easier to find wayward balls than it was the last time I was there. There are a few clunker holes . . . the 9th in particular feels like it was forced into position to get you back to the clubhouse while also not extending beyond the property border. There are also some odd routing choices, but I would guess that also had to do with balancing the nines, environmental concerns, etc. Here are some photos:













The last course on the trip, Tater Hill, was a letdown from the moment we drove into the parking lot. The first hole is a 175-yard par 3, and tree limbs that extended over the tee box were definitely in play with my 7-iron. Not really what you want to think about when you start your round. The next few holes were brutally boring, constructed in a wide open field with single rows of trees separating the fairways . . . everything that is bad about low-budget New England golf. The first few holes were built 50 or 60 years ago, and it's clear they didn't require an ounce of imagination. But then, without warning, the course took a turn for the better. At about the 7th, we ventured onto holes that were built within the last 10 years, and I have to admit they were really good. This was a totally different look than the other two courses . . . tree-lined but wide corridors. Huge greens with subtle slopes rather than wild undulation.

After the first few holes, I was wishing we had just stayed at Okemo. I was hung over after a much too late night at an Irish bar in Ludlow, couldn't find a water to save my life, was hot, wanted to watch the Open, and generally was pissed off that I drove 30 miles to get to this dump. By the end of the day, I would put Tater Hill a notch below Okemo but just as good as GMN. If the first few holes weren't so unbelievably bad, this could be a really interesting course. Unfortunately, my picture of Tater Hill are bad. It was so bad early on that I didn't take out my camera, and by the middle of the round I was having so much fun I totally forgot about pictures. Here's the best of what I've got, which really don't do justice to the quality of the design:







At the end of the day, if I had 10 rounds, I would play 6 at Okemo, 2 at Tater Hill and 2 at GMN. I would definitely like to get back for a few rounds in October, when the cool crisp air, foliage, and firm conditions would bump up the experience considerably.


« Last Edit: July 21, 2008, 07:47:40 PM by Dan_Callahan »

Dan Herrmann

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Re: Three Days in Vermont (with photos)
« Reply #1 on: July 22, 2008, 08:34:23 AM »
Dan,  Who were the architects/designers?

Dan_Callahan

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Re: Three Days in Vermont (with photos)
« Reply #2 on: July 22, 2008, 08:48:24 AM »
Green Mountain National was designed by Gene Bates in 1997. It was the first muni in Vermont (hard to believe, given that it is so new and in light of Vermont's socialist tendencies).

Okemo is a Steve Durkee course that is a renovation of the former Fox Run Golf Course. I have no idea how much of the previous course remains or if it was a total redo.

Tater Hill was originally built by Don Warner in 1964. The new holes are by Jordan Golf Design.

Brad Tufts

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Re: Three Days in Vermont (with photos)
« Reply #3 on: July 22, 2008, 11:00:55 AM »
Thanks for the pics Dan. 

I have played GMN 3 times, and Okemo once, and I think it's a toss-up.  GMN is shortish, and has a couple funky holes (2, 11-13?), but it's low-key, solid design in a wonderful environment.  I remember a couple standouts here such as the 7-9 stretch. 

I would define Okemo as almost the same.  It's an interesting course on the side of a steep hill, and there are a few holes that were (had to be?) forced onto the side of the hill.  I can think of one hole that cascades down the hill after a dogleg left in almost like a rounded-edge staircase.  I remember 17 being noteworthy as well, and very challenging at 210 yards or so.  I admit that one play is not enough, and I'd like another pass at it.

I dicovered the joys of St. Johnsbury, CC of Barre, and Crown Point last year, and I'm almost convinced that you can't go wrong on any of VT's 90 or so courses.
So I jump ship in Hong Kong....

Craig Sweet

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Re: Three Days in Vermont (with photos)
« Reply #4 on: July 22, 2008, 01:47:22 PM »
Durkee did the new nine at Dorset as well didn't he? And the make over at Neshobe in Brandon? 

I played Tater Hill a couple of years ago, before they were bought out by the Okemo people....if I recall it did not start out with a par 3...but maybe my memory is bad....Tater looks to be better maintained than it was when i played it....

Okemo has always intrigued me....it is a little different than most Vermont golf...so is the the new nine at Dorset...very similar "heathland" treatment....

I'll be in Vermont in a few weeks and hope to play Okemo and Dorset and perhaps drive down to Williamstown and play Taconic...your photo's have me all jazzed up for some Green Mountain lushness!
Project 2025....All bow down to our new authoritarian government.

Kirk Gill

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Re: Three Days in Vermont (with photos)
« Reply #5 on: July 23, 2008, 05:35:35 PM »
Forgive the thread hijack, but does anyone know of any quality courses further north, up near Burlington/St. Albans? A friend is wondering whether or not to take his clubs on a week's vacation.

The three courses pictured look like a lot of fun, and one can only imagine how they'd look in fall color........
"After all, we're not communists."
                             -Don Barzini

Cliff Hamm

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Re: Three Days in Vermont (with photos)
« Reply #6 on: July 23, 2008, 05:54:17 PM »
Stowe is within an hour and has a relatively new Bob Cupp course.  Have not played it.

http://summer.stowe.com/golf/stowe_mountain_club/

There is also Vermont National, outside of Burlington, a Nicklaus design that allows some outside play.

http://www.vnccgolf.com/
« Last Edit: July 23, 2008, 05:59:54 PM by Cliff Hamm »

Brad Tufts

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Re: Three Days in Vermont (with photos)
« Reply #7 on: July 23, 2008, 07:30:25 PM »
Kwiniaska is long and not bad, in Shelburne, but decidedly "Vermont public".

Burlington CC is the private show in town, was a Ross once, but has been modified to the point of an attribution change.

St. Johnsbury near the canadian and NH border is great, but probably more than an hour from Burlington on non-highways....
So I jump ship in Hong Kong....

Craig Sweet

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Re: Three Days in Vermont (with photos)
« Reply #8 on: July 23, 2008, 09:52:37 PM »
Kwiniaska...hmmm...I played in a state amateur there long ago...it is long.  How about the Basin Harbor Club in Vergennes?  And of course the Barre Country Club...its closer than the drive to St. Johnsbury....
Project 2025....All bow down to our new authoritarian government.

Brad Tufts

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Re: Three Days in Vermont (with photos)
« Reply #9 on: July 23, 2008, 10:05:38 PM »
Hi Craig,

I've always wondered about the wonders of Dorset...it's right up my alley and I was never able to check it out in my four years at Midd.  It's always been just off the beaten path enough to not allow for many connections to be made.

I just saw your mention of Neshobe, and I'm a big fan.  We used to hit balls and play there quite a bit as the second-closest course to school.  Now one of my dad's classmates is the pro.  It's a fun course with many fun half-par holes.

As for your last two mentions....CC of Barre was a fun old-time test.  Not perfect, but it has a number of fun holes with great undulation over some classic VT terrain.  As for Basin Harbor, the complete opposite.  Flat, boring, (rows of) tree-lined...you might as well just rent a boat or swim in the lake, unless they've made changes since my one play in 2000.

-Brad
So I jump ship in Hong Kong....

Craig Sweet

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Re: Three Days in Vermont (with photos)
« Reply #10 on: July 23, 2008, 10:24:15 PM »
Brad, I think you're right about Basin Harbor...we use to have a place on the lake just north of Vergennes and I remember taking a drive out there to check it out...I was probably about 12 years old...I played Neshobe a few time in some high school golf tournaments...I remember it being only nine holes back then.......Long ago I was a member at Dorset...the original nine was short, fairly tight....lots of fun.  When they built the new nine they re routed the old nine and integrated it in with the new....I have not played it, but did walk it once a few years ago...the new nine is longer, and does resemble Okemo somewhat...

I have some friends back there that are still members so I hope to get a game while I'm visiting...the one course I do want to play is my old club...Mt. Anthony in Bennington....talk about sidehill!!  What a fun course...
Project 2025....All bow down to our new authoritarian government.