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Craig Van Egmond

  • Karma: +0/-0
The Jones Brothers come to Oklahoma
« on: May 15, 2008, 03:33:25 PM »

Rees Jones hired to restore Tulsa Country Club (Tillinghast)

http://www.tulsaworld.com/sports/article.aspx?articleID=20080327_2_B8_World27460

RTJ II and Chambers Bay project lead Jay Blasi hired to create the Patriot course outside Tulsa...

http://www.cybergolf.com/golf_news/the_patriot_designed_by_robert_trent_jones_ii

Can Oklahoma handle having the Jones boys withing 30 minutes of each other at the same time?

Dan Herrmann

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: The Jones Brothers come to Oklahoma
« Reply #1 on: May 15, 2008, 04:20:41 PM »
Can you imagine what they could do if they'd just let bygones by bygones?  It's such a sad story.

Garland Bayley

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: The Jones Brothers come to Oklahoma
« Reply #2 on: May 15, 2008, 05:02:58 PM »
I sounds like Jay has a good piece of land to work with. You might be adding a new treasure to OK.
"I enjoy a course where the challenges are contained WITHIN it, and recovery is part of the game  not a course where the challenge is to stay ON it." Jeff Warne

Craig Van Egmond

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: The Jones Brothers come to Oklahoma
« Reply #3 on: May 16, 2008, 08:00:09 AM »

Garland,

       After Chambers Bay, I'm excited to see what Jr. and Jay can come up with.

Jon Spaulding

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: The Jones Brothers come to Oklahoma
« Reply #4 on: May 16, 2008, 08:37:16 AM »
I sounds like Jay has a good piece of land to work with. You might be adding a new treasure to OK.


"The club has entered into a contract agreement with noted golf course architect Rees Jones to restore the original A.W. Tillinghast design and upgrade course features."

Perhaps we might be adding one treasure and subtracting another?
You'd make a fine little helper. What's your name?

Chris_Clouser

Re: The Jones Brothers come to Oklahoma
« Reply #5 on: May 16, 2008, 09:17:30 AM »
I visited Tulsa CC a few years ago and I could see where they might want to pursue this, but why such a high-profile guy unless they have other ideas long-term for the club?  I would think there would be a number of guys that would bring a lower price tag and still accomplish their goal. 

As for the other project, that area north of Tulsa is ripe with land that would be great for golf courses.  Maxwell tried for years to get someone to do a project up there in the late 40s and no one would bite on it.  The question is long-term how the project will survive.

Craig,

I don't know the demographics of that area of the state that well.  But do you think a high cost project like that would work?  I know Karsten is a fine course and is supposedly public, if anyone is willing to pay the green fee, but I wonder if such a course would work in that area of the state.
« Last Edit: May 16, 2008, 09:19:40 AM by Chris_Clouser »

Craig Van Egmond

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: The Jones Brothers come to Oklahoma
« Reply #6 on: May 16, 2008, 09:37:36 AM »

Chris,

         I think that as part of a master planned community like Stone Canyon it will work, but I doubt it would work as a stand alone. The Tulsa area market is fairly saturated, all of the city owned courses are suffering.


Craig Van Egmond

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: The Jones Brothers come to Oklahoma
« Reply #7 on: May 16, 2008, 09:39:19 AM »
Jon,

       But Rees Jones is the authority on Tillinghast restorations.   Of course this means it will be a Rees Jones course now, much like Torrey and Bethpage Black.  ;D
« Last Edit: May 16, 2008, 09:41:14 AM by Craig Edgmand »

David Stamm

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: The Jones Brothers come to Oklahoma
« Reply #8 on: May 16, 2008, 09:47:31 AM »

Rees Jones hired to restore Tulsa Country Club (Tillinghast)

http://www.tulsaworld.com/sports/article.aspx?articleID=20080327_2_B8_World27460

RTJ II and Chambers Bay project lead Jay Blasi hired to create the Patriot course outside Tulsa...

http://www.cybergolf.com/golf_news/the_patriot_designed_by_robert_trent_jones_ii

Can Oklahoma handle having the Jones boys withing 30 minutes of each other at the same time?

In my mind the question is can Rees be sensitive to AWT's design intent.
"The object of golf architecture is to give an intelligent purpose to the striking of a golf ball."- Max Behr

Chris_Clouser

Re: The Jones Brothers come to Oklahoma
« Reply #9 on: May 16, 2008, 10:06:27 AM »
David,

I just had to chuckle about your comment.  I was talking with someone this week and they said the same thing about a course I was at (a Ross course).  They were talking about how someone who worked there captured the real design intent of the course.  The person I was discussing this with was someone who worked at the course.  I asked him how they knew what the design intent was.  Did Ross write it down somewhere in the plans, did it get documented in an interview along the way or something else?  The guy said, "Well we just kind of thought this is what Ross would want." 

So I find it funny when people throw that phrase about design intent out like it means something.  Unless it is documented somewhere it is hard to pinpoint.  With Tulsa, I think it is pretty straight forward what Tilly wanted with the holes as they are still representative of his style, but at other projects that have been messed around with that may be harder to ascertain.  But even if it is documented we are still interpreting what we think they would want and implement into today's game. 

Wasn't trying to pick on you or anything, just struck me as funny when I read that.

David Stamm

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: The Jones Brothers come to Oklahoma
« Reply #10 on: May 17, 2008, 01:25:38 AM »
Chris, my statement stands. I take no offense to your comments. I'm glad I brought some humor to your day. ;)


My other question would be, will Jones claim this course as his own when he's done like he's done with others as stated in this month's GD article?
"The object of golf architecture is to give an intelligent purpose to the striking of a golf ball."- Max Behr

Jon Spaulding

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: The Jones Brothers come to Oklahoma
« Reply #11 on: May 18, 2008, 12:27:35 AM »
Jon,

       But Rees Jones is the authority on Tillinghast restorations.   Of course this means it will be a Rees Jones course now, much like Torrey and Bethpage Black.  ;D

Please keep us posted on how his latest masterpiece works out. :-\  "Restoration while upgrading course features" smells like a license to commit major crimes if you ask me - provided that TCC has any AWT left. I have not played it so will not comment as to what can be gained, or lost here.

I prefer that he claims TP South as his own; many, if not all of the locals like it less than the Bell version. In concert with the work he did @ Santaluz up the street, not too popular a name in the area.
You'd make a fine little helper. What's your name?

Sam Morrow

Re: The Jones Brothers come to Oklahoma
« Reply #12 on: May 18, 2008, 11:50:06 AM »
I have played Tulsa Country Club a handful of times and have a good friend who was an assistant there in the late 70's. It's my understanding that the golf course has been greatly changed since Tillinghast first did it.  That aside the course is a joy to play and I've had the pleasure of playing it in the morning while finishing my day a little south at Southern Hills.

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