Fazio and Oakmont

[Jeff_Brauer]

For anyone interested, Tom Marzoff prepared a little info on their work there.

http://www.asgca.org/documents/ArchitecturalHistoryofOakmontforWebsite.pdf

John K,

Get over it!  The geometric vs. traditional curvy is part of what makes them unique.  The best part is that the inward angle makes each successive pew visisble from the tee so golfers see them all, understand the pew concept and understand the challenge.

[George Pazin]

I actually thought Jax was just trying to draw out the lemmings with that post.

As far as I could see from photos, the Pews have always been relatively clean and symmetrical. If anything, they look a little rougher now.

[Mike_Young]

It was surprising that Oakmont used Fazio?  I played with a board member of Oakmont last year and he said that they told him everything they wanted to do.  As an example, they would take him out to a spot and say "we want this bunker replaced to look like this" and show them the old photos.  He gave me the impression that Fazio had no say at all.   I've thought about why do you need Fazio or anybody to do that work???

Furthermore, I saw an article that MacDonald & Sons was hired in 2005 to rebuild some tees and reconstruct all the bunkers.  Again, why use Fazio or anybody for that fact as an architect.

Lastly, I heard from another architect who talked with the people at Oakmont a few years ago that Fazio waived his fee in order to get the job.

Joel,
I am told I can fly a 757...unless there is a problem....IMO architects can do more than just put their "touches" on a course and I am sure TM brought much to the project.....
ALSO on a different note....your thoughts on the subject seem to go against much of what I hear on this site regarding the "restoration experts"  .....am I not correct that they usually research and find the """we want this bunker replaced to look like this" and show them the old photos. "" routine.  However, I do agree that many members may be able to figure 90% of what the architect would do..it is the 10% that he gets the big bucks for.....JMO
Mike

[Tommy_Naccarato]

Tom Marzolf of the Fazio office has orchestrated everything you saw — from weighing in on tree removal to all of the tees, bunkers, greens work and fairway delineation. He has lived and breathed Oakmont for the past 6+ years as I ujnderstand it.

And just to think all the while he was destroying Rivera in the process!

There's no stopping that guy!

[Don_Mahaffey]

Tom Marzolf of the Fazio office has orchestrated everything you saw

Forrest,
That statement is absurd.
The course looked great, so as consulting architect, he/they did a nice job. But I saw greens mowed tight and rolling great, Marzolf orchestrated that? The mowing patterns, the placement of the ropes, the course set up...I could go on and on.
I detest your type of post because you shamelessly promote one professional over all those who contributed to a great event. Good events are the result of great teamwork and strong leadership. In this case I have no doubt that Marzolf was a key member, but you are wrong in your assessment that he orchestrated the entire event.

[Tommy_Naccarato]

Forrest,
I have to agree with Don, that I think the statement is inaccurate.

At one point Tom Doak was being considered as consulting architect of Oakmont, and during that process, the tree removal by Super Super John Zimmers was already underway.

As well, John Zimmers, Mark Studer, probably deserves a great amount of praise in the process, as well as the guy that put himself out there as well as the other members who followed that impressive lead.

The entire Oakmont celebration should be hi-lighting this effort. I hope it leads to more efforts like it.

[Mike_Young]

Tom Marzolf of the Fazio office has orchestrated everything you saw

Forrest,
That statement is absurd.
The course looked great, so as consulting architect, he/they did a nice job. But I saw greens mowed tight and rolling great, Marzolf orchestrated that? The mowing patterns, the placement of the ropes, the course set up...I could go on and on.
I detest your type of post because you shamelessly promote one professional over all those who contributed to a great event. Good events are the result of great teamwork and strong leadership. In this case I have no doubt that Marzolf was a key member, but you are wrong in your assessment that he orchestrated the entire event.

Don,
when I read Forrest's entire sentence it says"...Tom Marzolf of the Fazio office has orchestrated everything you saw — from weighing in on tree removal to all of the tees, bunkers, greens work and fairway delineation. He has lived and breathed Oakmont for the past 6+ years as I ujnderstand it."......he doesn't mention TM handling maitenance issues...I really don't know of any architect that doesn't think these things are not team efforts....AND I wholeheartedly agree with you as to the efforts of all involved.....I never read it as promoting one professional over another...
Take care,
Mike

[Forrest Richardson]

Gee...one can almost hear the flurry of telecommunications clicks and buzzes between Tommy and Don..."Let's get that idiot, Forrest...he knows nothing about what he is talking about."

For the record, I give tremendous praise to John Zimmers. I know what he has accomplished there. I have spoken with him many times (going back 5 years), have met with him and I also spoke with him at the US Open.

My comment was not absurd at all. The Fazio office directed and brought the recent changes to reality at Oakmont. And, yes, it was a team effort — both the things you like and dislike. However, in the end it IS one professional over another in remodeling a golf course that typically takes on more of the overall responsibility for design, nature of changes and directing details — and that professional is mostly the golf course architect.

- - -

Don — "Mowing patterns and placement of ropes..." What does that have to do with this thread?  

[Tom_Doak]

Tommy:

I don't know where you got your info that I was being considered for the consulting work at Oakmont, but if it's true, they did so without ever talking to me directly about it, which puts your statement right up there with all those courses which were "nominated by Golf Digest" for the best new course of the year award.

I have yet to work on any courses which were in line to host the US Open.  My only chance was at Shinnecock Hills, where I was invited to consult -- but my sense was that the only thing I would get to do was to put tees where the USGA guys had determined they should go, so I declined.  It's a good thing, too, or I might have been a convenient scapegoat for the slope of the seventh green!

I would be less fearful of getting involved with one now, because I believe Mike Davis has proven he is going to be very proactive in the setup of the courses to make sure nothing really frightening happens again.  But, there are still some in the USGA who like to play architect, and when they go to a potential venue and tell the members they would have to put tees here and there to be considered for a championship, it really does take a lot of the decision-making process out of the architect's hands.

[Tommy_Naccarato]

Forrest,
That was a very paranoid response! First, I wasn't being combative either and I'm sorry you took it that way, so I'll apologize. Still, I just don't agree with your original statement: Tom Marzolf of the Fazio office has orchestrated everything you saw....... It overlooks the most important factors in this, John Zimmers and Mark Studer, both whom you failed to mention in your posts.

Tom, Maybe it was Gil then.

One thing I know for sure, it was one of you!

[Forrest Richardson]

I did mention John in my earlier post. John implemented many of what was done...obviously, he is the head grounds guy. The design was orchestrated by Tom Marzolf.