[Kalen Braley]

After reading a few recent threads about tough tracks and the USGA wanting to hold more opens on the west coast, it got me thinking about the Institute Golf Course in Morgan Hill, CA. I have a question out for my NorCal brethern to see if any of you have any inside information, or have played it.

What I know...or should I say, what I think I know!!  

The course is owned by the Fry Family, which made thier money from the Frys electronics chain in CA which has been wildy successful.  The design is attributed to either Robert Muir Graves or Damian V. Pascuzzo depending on where you look.  Although interesting enough, its doesn't appear on either portfolio of courses that they have done. Perhaps this is due to the controversy regarding its creation which in short, they built it without the proper environmental, federal, and state permits.  Several groups have tried to shut it down, but to no avail to my knowledge.  I guess the city of Morgan Hill is in the Frys pockets, and approved some type of retroactive permits after it was built. It gets no more than 30 rounds or more per day, so it seems like one of those personal playground courses.

What makes all this interesting, is that its a long beast from the tips, over 7900 yards,  and supposedly several tour players played it during the 2005 WGC event held at Harding Park and were unable to break par.  There is also a whirl-wind of speculation that it could host the Frys.com event which is currently in Vegas.  Other rumors include it potentially holding a Open due to its length/toughness.  Has anyone played the course and would it be worthy of a U.S. Open, or is this all mute considering its not technically legal?

Thanks,

[Tom Huckaby]

Kalen:

"The Institute" has been discussed many times in here.  In fact it was designed by a now-infrequent, sometimes-frequent poster in here, Neal Meagher - who reported that even he hadn't played it, and he is under confidentiality restrictions prohibiting him from saying even the bare minimum about it.

I know no one who has played it.  I'd be very surprised if any participants here have.  It's open to friends of Fry and that's it.

That being said, I like you have heard it can stretch to nearly 8000 yards.  There was an article in the SJ Merc in the last year or so that gave some pretty good descriptions.  But outside of that, it remains our local mystery course.

Even driving up to it - as a few of us have - you really can't see much.

TH

[Kalen Braley]

Thanks Tom, I was hoping you would chime in.

I'd like to think I'm at least slightly above average in the intelligence and computer skills dept, but I tried using the advance option in the search tool on this site to find prior discussion and I couldn't find anything.  

I've looked at some aerials of the place using Google, but that doesn't give a good feel of the place.  I've only managed to locate just a picture or two on google as well, so it really is a mystery course I guess.

Perhaps my best bet is to hang out in Morgan Hill and stalk some math geeks who actually go to the institute and coerce some secrets out of them.  

[Tom Huckaby]

That would seem to be the best way, Kalen.  Either that or find some way to befriend one of the Frys.

 

As for the search here, I'm of the opinion even the intellect of one like genetic physicist Dr. Geoffrey Childs isn't enough to make it work.  Eric Franzen once posted a way to get it work though, which of course I failed at... but he's a certified computer genius also.

The point is don't feel bad if you can't find anything via the search - just join the club.

 

Just got word the NCGA powers that be will shlep me along as a course rater again this year... so my hope is Mr. Fry decides he wants to post scores, so we can give the course a rating.  If that occurs, I shall report - as much as the expected confidentiality agreement allows me to!

[Mike Benham]

The course is owned by the Fry Family.

John Fry is the head Fry of the group and does let his brothers play there on occasion.

The design is attributed to either Robert Muir Graves or Damian V. Pascuzzo depending on where you look.  Although interesting enough, its doesn't appear on either portfolio of courses that they have done.

Non-disclosure Agreement

I guess the city of Morgan Hill is in the Frys pockets, and approved some type of retroactive permits after it was built. It gets no more than 30 rounds or more per day, so it seems like one of those personal playground courses.

"Is in the back pockets" would not be the term I would use.   By agreement with Morgan Hill, they are limited to no more than 36 round per day.



This is a photo on the 7th, about where your third shot would be from (not mine, as I am a longer hitter), 659 yard par-5.

[Kalen Braley]

lol..

Well first I must say congrats on getting the nod for another year.

And if you ever get to go out there, tell them you need to bring along a sidekick (me)   to take copius notes for reference when drawing up your official course slope and rating.

[PThomas]

does the course have a logo?

[Kalen Braley]

Hi Mike,

According to Tom, it was neither who designed the course.  But with the non-disclosure part, sure makes getting info tough.

And yes "in their back pockets" might be a bit strong, but it certainly appears on the outside looking in that the city council caved in to the Frys.  Don't get me wrong here, that would be tough to hold them at bay.

On a side note, I noticed your beer avatar.  Well the one I use comes from a brewer in San Diego called "Stone Brewing".  Having tried both the bock and the dark beer offerings from Stone, no offense, but the Shiner Bock is like drinking a budweiser in comparison.  

[Tom Huckaby]

Neal has said on here that he did the work, working under one of those two names - forget which one.  That's about ALL he said as well.  The NDA is pretty strict.

And Kalen, we can always use observers.  If this happens, you'll be the first to know.

 

[Kalen Braley]

No logo as far as I can find Paul, not even a website, or any other official publications about the place.

[PThomas]

No logo as far as I can find Paul, not even a website, or any other official publications about the place.

certainly appears to be one of the most private courses there is, along with The Sanctuary, Schwab's course in Hawaii, perhaps Canyata, etc

[Kalen Braley]

Interesting link with another photo of the place.

http://www.gilroydispatch.com/news/contentview.asp?c=73150

[Mike Benham]

And yes "in their back pockets" might be a bit strong, but it certainly appears on the outside looking in that the city council caved in to the Frys.  Don't get me wrong here, that would be tough to hold them at bay.

On a side note, I noticed your beer avatar.  Well the one I use comes from a brewer in San Diego called "Stone Brewing".  Having tried both the bock and the dark beer offerings from Stone, no offense, but the Shiner Bock is like drinking a budweiser in comparison.  

I believe the story goes that The Fry's acquired a permit to do some work on the property.  If you dig further, there was 9-holes already on the property (The Flying Lady or J or something like that) and so in doing the work, perhaps they exceeded the intention of the permit that was submitted and the city found out about it.

So the city negotiated an agreement that was deemed reasonable by both sides but it falls under the old notion of "asking for forgiveness instead of asking for permission".


It seems like every year around February this topic comes up ...

GCA Institute Thread

[Kalen Braley]

Thanks for that Mike, I really gotta play with that search tool more to find these posts.

I did know that they got a permit to do some work on the property and that there was a 9 hole course prior.  But in the various readings it was implied that using the work permit was only a feble attempt after the fact in trying to cover thier tracks when they were caught red-handed.  

And yes this is a perfect example of "its better to seek forgiveness than to ask permission."  

[Mike Benham]

... and Mike, well darn it, where on earth did you come up with that picture??  I promise I won't tell...

When I played there of course !!!!


The Pro

[Kalen Braley]

Hi Neal,

Great to see you join in.  And for the record its Kalen  

I am a big fan of delta view, kudos for the great work on the original 9.  I had only heard that they were enlarged as the originals were small and hard to support all the play it gets.  I do also like the 2nd 9 that was added to the course, it fits in pretty well with the original 9.

As to whether MacK designed the original 9, that was what I came to understand after looking around a bit.  Its also attributed to him in the book that Doak, Scott, and Haddock put together about his lifes work, but I'm sure you already knew this.  

On a side note, did you ever work on Meadowwood in Liberty Lake, WA?  I lived there for approx 5 years and had many a fun round out there.

[Mike Benham]

On a side note, I noticed your beer avatar.  Well the one I use comes from a brewer in San Diego called "Stone Brewing".  Having tried both the bock and the dark beer offerings from Stone, no offense, but the Shiner Bock is like drinking a budweiser in comparison.  

Well, since I can't get Stone Bock at my local grocery for $ 6.99 a sixer, I will have to continue drinking Bud ...

[John_Cullum]

I bought a six pack of that Shiner Bock about 4 months ago because I remembered it from Mike's avatar. (I think that is the first time I ever used the word avatar) I don't think I've tried it yet. In fact, I don't think I've had a beer in 4 months.

[JohnV]

Thanks Tom, I was hoping you would chime in.

I'd like to think I'm at least slightly above average in the intelligence and computer skills dept, but I tried using the advance option in the search tool on this site to find prior discussion and I couldn't find anything.  

Let Google help with your searches.

Go to Google and put in:

site:golfclubatlas.com Institute Morgan Hill

The site: command restricts it to searches of that site and it works a lot quicker and better than the search function here.

There were a few relevant results returned, but not much more information that you already have seen.

[Mike Benham]

I bought a six pack of that Shiner Bock about 4 months ago because I remembered it from Mike's avatar. (I think that is the first time I ever used the word avatar) I don't think I've tried it yet. In fact, I don't think I've had a beer in 4 months.

Since Belhaven Best is not imported into the good 'ole USA and Martin only comes over once every blue moon, I have been on a search for US based replacement.

Obviously, nothing can replace BB but I need something in the ballpark and bocks are on the right path.  

[Kalen Braley]

Thanks Tom, I was hoping you would chime in.

I'd like to think I'm at least slightly above average in the intelligence and computer skills dept, but I tried using the advance option in the search tool on this site to find prior discussion and I couldn't find anything.  

Let Google help with your searches.

Go to Google and put in:

site:golfclubatlas.com Institute Morgan Hill

The site: command restricts it to searches of that site and it works a lot quicker and better than the search function here.

There were a few relevant results returned, but not much more information that you already have seen.

Thanks John,

I'll use that in the future.

[Kalen Braley]

On a side note, I noticed your beer avatar.  Well the one I use comes from a brewer in San Diego called "Stone Brewing".  Having tried both the bock and the dark beer offerings from Stone, no offense, but the Shiner Bock is like drinking a budweiser in comparison.  

Well, since I can't get Stone Bock at my local grocery for $ 6.99 a sixer, I will have to continue drinking Bud ...

Hey Mike and bay area guys,

Next time I'm out in the bay area, we'll get together if you all like and I'll host a beer sampling night and introduce some less heard of micro-brews that will knock your socks off...well at the very least get you buzzed!!

Just as in the world of golf there are the Cypress Points/Pine Valleys as compared to say Torrey Pines/<insert local munie track>, the same is true in the beer world.  

[Adam Clayman]

I had heard about this secret place when I was caddying on the peninsula. It was rumored Mr. Fry's hope that he would day have the PGA Tour begging to use his massive playing field since everything was becoming too short, due to I&B advances. He must've done his diligence because he has recently stepped up to the plate, financially, for other PGA Tour events. It shouldn't be long now.

I recall When I left the area it was shortly after Cisco Sytems announced a major industrial park in the vicinity. Since then, the Techs have been hard pressed to justify sinking that much Capital. Now, with Cisco's resurgence is their plan back on track for that vicinity?

It sure would help make the metrics work for a Tour event.

[Mike Benham]

Just as in the world of golf there are the Cypress Points/Pine Valleys as compared to say Torrey Pines/<insert local munie track>, the same is true in the beer world.  

Kalen - nothing more than an access thing, just like GCA.  We drink what we have access to, just like our Bay Area golf is limited to what we have access to.  I'm sure there are some people that think Belhaven Best is, in the words of Scotty, a member of the grounds crew at Gullane, "full of chemicals".

I have travelled to play some great courses, I have travelled to drink some great beers.  I have travelled to play some not great courses, I have travelled to drink some not so great beers.  

Did you know that they serve Budweiser in Scotland, and many like it.

[Kalen Braley]

Well said Mike,

However, there is great access to awesome beers in the bay area.  Its just a matter of knowing where to go.  If you want to mix it up a bit, I would recommend hitting the BevMo stores that are found all over the bay area.  They have some great micro selection as well as wines.

Here's a link to some highly rated beers, and unlike golf course ratings, these are very consensus amongst beer snobs such as myself   :

http://ratebeer.com/Ratings/TopCalifornian.asp

Anything you can find on the top 30-40 on that list, you cannot go wrong with. I've personally tried at least 2/3rds of them and they are all excellent.  

If you are in San Fran playing olympic or SFGC, scurry on over to the Toronado in the Haight district.  Thier selection of taps is 2nd to none.

As to budweiser in Scotland, that is just crazy, although not surprising.  But then again, I'm one who is only midly interested in Guiness because its not that heavy and light on the tongue in comparison to my dark beer favorites.  

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