[Keith Williams]

The Pine Valley thread has had me thinking...

Of all the great classic courses out there, are any of them at the very best of their existence today, right now as we speak?  Many of the times we discuss these great courses someone manages to bring up detrimental changes wrought upon the layout and how it was better x decades ago.  Recent discussion reflects really great improvements to some courses (i.e. tree removal at Oakmont, recent work at NGLA) but are they better now than ever before?  

So how many great courses out there (if any) are better now than they ever have been before?

I'll toss out one possibility:  I don't know very much about the history of the course, but I do know that it hasn't been significantly altered over the years and that past restoration work there has been positively reviewed, so maybe Holston Hills?

Keith.

[Francis Macomber]

Holston Hills might be a possibility, especially considering it has just recently started recieving the attention and praise it deserves.

[john_stiles]

I would tend to agree with Frank & Keith.

However, more trees went down unnaturally last year and more are coming down this year.  This doesn't include a few dying white pines.  Maintenance meld is improving under hard work by superintendent Ryan Blair.  Some very 'minor' work re: trees, maintenance, and tees, under the eye of Hepner, is planned. So, more trees will be cut this year and next.  

Tree obscuring wonderful plateau green at 15th is coming down.

Anyone wanting to play this out-of-the-way course can drop me a line or simply call the shop in almost all cases.  You'll never need a leash looking for your sick dog.

Florida, Alabama, Auburn, and Notre Dame all play in Knoxville this fall.

Holston could yet peak but probably only if membership went down to 200 or so, the club was still open, and access was restricted.

[Keith Williams]

Thanks John,

Also, in your neck of the woods, how does the current day Lookout Mountain rank in its existence?

I was hoping for a little more input so far considering the recent discussions regarding Cypress Point's un-amoebas and Pine Valley's old photos.  I think everyone might agree that the current day Riviera, ANGC and Yale don't rank as the best "iteration" of each course, but what about some others like Seminole or even the new MPCC shore... could it reveal itself to be head and shoulders better than it has ever been?

Keith.

[brad_miller]

Prairie Dunes (IMO) will be at it's all time best once the C&C/Axland work is complete.

[TEPaul]

In my opinion, and generally speaking, the best time and blueprint to use (usually with old aerials) for really good restoration of the old classic "Golden Age" courses is the decade of the 1930s.

However, that may be a great time to use as an architectural blueprint (including trees) but as to whether the coures were actually at their best back then--I'd say architectural yes, generally speaking, but agronomically back then wasn't even close to what we have now. This does not include irrigation practices, though. But I think slowly but surely we're getting back to understanding that latter factor better.

[john_stiles]

Keith,

I do not remember many details about Lookout Mountain before the Silva restoration,  having only played once pre-Silva.

But if Doug Stein or others were to weigh in,  I think the consensus would be that Lookout Mountain is much, much improved. The bunker work completed by Silva brought back the Raynor style.

There is room for additional 'peaking' at Lookout.

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