Grass preferences

[Slag_Bandoon]

What are your favorite grass species for...

1. Greens
2. Fairways
3. Rough
4. Natural surrounds
5. Tee grounds
6. Green aprons

Please post your region. Be as specific as you care to be on mix blend percentages or hybrids and WHY you might like that species for its relative task.

Is there grass(es) that you do not like for specific reasons?

I'm trying to gather info to present to a city planning committee here in wettish Oregon and have some ideas on low maintenance choices but would like to know what y'all like to play upon.

'Isn't it rare
 To be walking on air, loving
 Walking on velvet green' IA

 

[RJ_Daley]

The best turf selection I know of is the combination of selection and how it is maintained at Wild Horse.  Greens are generally cut to .125 bents - 1/2 provident and 1/2 SR1119; fairways are cut to 9/16th generally and are K-blue cultivar blend of Award, American Midnight; and the the most important turf selection, in my view, surrounds are fescue blends of Jamestown II and Tiffany cut at about 7/16.  When I played there 3 weeks ago the course tee-fairway-surrounds-greens were fast, firm, and perfect - and I have seen nothing better anywhere.  Hooray Josh Mahar!!!  

In the cool season, there really isn't a choice on green turf and bents are it.  I have never seen a fescue green, although I guess it has been tried...  I am not familiar with the exact cultivar blends of fairways at Whistling Straits but I believe it is a rye-fescue blend that is cut about 9/16 also like Wild Horse.  I very much like the higher cut fairways in the 1/2 to 3/4 inch cut maintained firm and fast.  Sand Hills is more like Whistling with a big Fescue fairway composition.  

I am not experienced enough on warm season bermuda or transition Zoysia.  And, also I have no experience with Kikuyu except to look at it at Riviera.

[Carl Spackler]

I prefer a hybrid cross-- ah, Bluegrass, Kentucky Bluegrass, Featherbed Bent, and Northern California Sensemilia. The amazing stuff about this is, that you can play 36 holes on it in the afternoon, take it home and just get stoned to the bejeezus-belt that night on this stuff. Here . . . I've got pounds.

[Don_Mahaffey]

Greens-If you have the resources to fight off the poa I would seed one of the newer A or G series creeping bentgrasses because the high density has shown to be difficult for poa to germinate. These grasses need to be maintained at .120 or lower so they will be fast and may not work on greens with severe slopes (I say use em anyhow, I like to see the ball roll off the green).
If your low budget and not able to fight the poa, I would seed poa reptans and just get the poa transition over with.

For all the short grass areas I would use a rye/dwarf blue mix.

For the longer grass areas I would use a blue/fine fescue mix.

For natural areas I would first try and identify native species and try to plant those grasses.

For areas that are longer (6+ inches) but not really native I would use sheep fescue. It is a bitch to play out of, but man is it pretty.

I would refer to the NTEP trials to pick specific varieties.

[Anthony_Nysse]

Greens: L-93 or A-4
Fairways: Colonial Bent with some fescue
Tees: Colonial or Penn-Trio
Roughs: Fescues with blue stem and natives
 I'm from the West Michigan Area, but I worked in the great area of Long Island. Victoria National is complete L-93(fairways, tees and greens)I've been told it's some of the best surfaces people have played off. The course that I worked on this summer has the grasses described above.

[Poa Pete]

Viper or Providence bent for greens, great cool season performers. Viper has no track record in the US (I intend to change that), but is big in Australia.

Rye grass fairways, (Primo'd) with at least 40% Essence, another great cool weather variety.

Fescue roughs, Chewings, Hard, Sheep and  creeping red. This is where you can get it up to 6-8 inches then turn the water off. let it get thin, wispy and that tan color we all love. Water only to keep plants viable.

Rye tees, cut tight, (Primo'd).

Natives from a local native guru. Or collect the seeds yourself. Start now!

If poa annua control is going to be attempted, stay away from any bluegrass in the mix. Poa control tools will smoke any blue.

If the budget is limited, like Don says be prepared for poa. In a cool coastal climate Poa is your friend.  

[John_D._Bernhardt]

Please toss in some ideas of the grasses of the gulf coast.

[Don_Mahaffey]

John,
Bermuda will most likely be your grass of choice. Whether you overseed or not should determine the cultivars.

If your designer has definitive fairway mowing lines and they are incorporated into the irrigation design, I reccomend a vegetatively (sp?) planted type like tifsport for fairways and tees, and a seeded type for roughs. I love the contrast in color and texture. I’m not a big fan of the same grass used for fwys and roughs, but I’m in the minority.

For greens I'm learning that some of the ultradwarfs are not the maintenance headaches they are made out to be. I really like mini-Verde. Check out the NTEP results.

[Jeff_Mingay]

I think one of the most overlooked things in golf architecture today are grassing plans.

There's a certain architect here in Canada who's work I've always found to look the same. Granted, many of his hole designs are different, but still the holes look the same; very dull and bland.  

It took me awhile to figure it out, but it's the basic grassing -- run-of-the-mill bents in the fairways and on the greens, with simple bluegrass in the roughs -- (combined with the consistency of glaring white sand in the bunkers) that make this guy's courses look the same, time after time.

An intelligent grassing plan adds so much to the overall aesthetic appeal of a golf course. There are plenty of awesome examples to cite throughout the world.

[Jeff_Mingay]

It's all about contrasting colours and texture. *SEE Mike Miller's and Geoff Shackelford's new book, "The Art of Golf Design".  

[Slag_Bandoon]

 Intention is to build a low maintenance, low budget shortish niner on environmentally sensitive ground next to a river.  The ground is 90% sand (mean).  I am not a developer or (paid) designer but feel compelled to let our parks commission know why a golf course is the best choice.  

I'm leaning toward perennial rye tees and fairways with bent greens and fescue surrounds - Red, chewings, sheep.  Cutting will probably be at the taller end of playability in all areas for maintenance cost and turf durability reasons. Hoping to keep watering to a minimum.

If this sounds wrong or if I sound misinformed, educate me - I'm open minded. The meeting isn't for three weeks.
www.ntep.org  is very useful.

Pete, Viper? What are its distinctions that you admire? Will it be the Barnbougle bent?

[Slag_Bandoon]

Jeff M, Excellent point. If this commission doesn't appreciate the many blessings that a low cost golf course can bring, at least they can't deny the idea of beautiful natural area.  Three posts mention its importance. I'll look more into the indigenous grasses angle for my presentation.

[Slag_Bandoon]

 Here's a nice picture, with thistle even.

http://www.agolfarchitect.com/photos2.jpg

(A little plug for Tony Ristola)

[aclayman]

John- When I was in Fla. I overheard the super at the el diablo loving his tif dwarf bermuda greens. And after watching my boy Eddie make nine birdies that day I couldn't argue, they were very nice and they were even a day shaggy.

This was the guy who had enough sense to sign off on the GN1, which ultimatley killed everything.

Hope it helps
adam

p.s. Will you be doing the P.S. circut? I'm coming out of hybernation and feel the need to golf more than ever.....Tommy?? I'm back from dermitius hell, had my first date shake at Hadley's today. YUM YUM   Sweet

[Peter Galea]

Slag,
Had some test plots at HMB Ocean and Viper shone. Good disease resistance. Good density (not as dense as the A's and G's-which means less agressive maintenance and the ability to get topdressing into the canopy-VIP).
Cool weather performance, which means it doesn't "puke", and has good growth and recovery in cooler coastal temps.
Providence (SR 1019) fared well too.

[BY]

L-93 greens.
Colonial, fescue fairways.
Heinz 57 roughs

Call your SR seed rep, they're in your area, they'll come up with some great blends.