| Course | pounds | dollars |
| Royal St. Georges-1 | 330 | 419 |
| Sunningdale-2/5 | 600 | 762 |
| Royal Birkdale-3 | 340 | 432 |
| Swinley Forest-4 | not listed | xxx |
| Woodhall Spa-6 | 225 | 286 |
| Royal Lytham-7 | 320 | 406 |
| Ganton-8 | 195 | 248 |
| St. Georges Hill-9 | 255 | 324 |
| St. Endoc-10 | 150 | 191 |
| Royal C Ports-11 | 235 | 298 |
| West Sussex-12 | 150 | 191 |
| Alwoodley-13 | 225 | 286 |
| Walton Heath-14 | 260 | 330 |
| Royal Liverpool-15 | 310 | 394 |
| Royal W. Norfolk-16 | not listed | xxx |
| Rye -17 | not listed | xxx |
| Silloth on Solway-18 | 95 | 121 |
| Hollinwell-19 | 190 | 241 |
| Wentworth-20 | not listed | xxx |
| Berkshire-21 | 240 | 305 |
| Course | pounds | dollars |
| St. Andrews Old-1 | 320 | 406 |
| Trump Turnberry-2 | 495 | 629 |
| Muirfield-3 | 340 | 432 |
| Royal Dornoch-4 | 280 | 356 |
| North Berwick-5 | 240 | 305 |
| Carnoustie-6 | 300 | 381 |
| Kingsbarns-7 | 418 | 531 |
| Castle Stuart-8 | 295 | 375 |
| Royal Aberdeen-9 | 245 | 311 |
| Trump International-10 | 400 | 508 |
| Cruden Bay-11 | 175 | 222 |
| Ardfin-12 | not sure | xxx |
| Royal Troon-13 | 340 | 432 |
| Prestwick-14 | 270 | 343 |
| Loch Lomond-15 | not listed | xxx |
| Gleneagles-16 | 280 | 356 |
| Dumbarnie-17 | 299 | 380 |
| Western Gailes-18 | 245 | 311 |
| Machrahanish-19 | 120 | 152 |
| Course | euros | dollars |
| Ballybunion-1 | 350 | 382 |
| Lahinch-2 | 325 | 354 |
| St. Patricks-3 | 240 | 262 |
| Portmarnock-4 | 325 | 354 |
| European Club-5 | 290 | 316 |
| Waterville-6 | 300 | 327 |
| The Island-7 | 270 | 294 |
| Course | pounds | dollars |
| RC Down-1 | 360 | 457 |
| Royal Portrush-2 | 340 | 432 |
| Course | pounds | dollars |
| Royal Porthcawl | 220 | 279 |
Jeff, thanks for taking the time to compile the list. Another chat that I participate on, someone posted they were in the planning stages of a trip to Scotland and the first response "Go to Nebraska. Same golf better weather." With the 2024 level of green fees in GBI, COVID pent-up demand or so called "revenge travel" coming to an end, and much improved new offerings in North America there will be a softening in demand. Looking out five years, with the exception of the very few at the top, I think the rates will be flat with the current pricing but more likely less.
Jeff, thanks for taking the time to compile the list. Another chat that I participate on, someone posted they were in the planning stages of a trip to Scotland and the first response "Go to Nebraska. Same golf better weather." With the 2024 level of green fees in GBI, COVID pent-up demand or so called "revenge travel" coming to an end, and much improved new offerings in North America there will be a softening in demand. Looking out five years, with the exception of the very few at the top, I think the rates will be flat with the current pricing but more likely less.
Interesting that both of you located in the local markets take a much more bullish point of view than me looking at it from the outside.
| | Hankley £ 145.00 | $ 184.15 | |
| Burnham & Berrow | £ 150.00 | $ 190.50 | |
| Queenwood | n/a | | |
| Woking | £ 180.00 | $ 228.60 | |
| Hunstanton | £ 150.00 | $ 190.50 | |
| Worplesdon | £ 185.00 | $ 234.95 | |
| Liphook | £ 145.00 | $ 184.15 | |
| Westhill | £ 160.00 | $ 203.20 | |
| Berkshire Blue | £ 240.00 | 165 @ if you play both courses | $ 304.80 |
| Princes | £ 145.00 | $ 184.15 | |
| West Lancs | £ 195.00 | $ 247.65 | |
| Broadstone | £ 130.00 | $ 165.10 | |
| Parkstone | £ 125.00 | $ 158.75 | |
| Walton Heath New | £ 260.00 | 192.50 @ if you play both courses | $ 330.20 |
| Hindhead | n/a | | |
| JCB | n/a | | |
| New Zealand | n/a | | |
| Delamore Forst | £ 130.00 | $ 165.10 | |
| Southport & Ainsdale | £ 200.00 | $ 254.00 | |
| Moortown | £ 140.00 | $ 177.80 | |
| Wentworth East | n/a/ | | |
| Royal Ashdown Old | £ 140.00 | 80 @if you play both courses | $ 177.80 |
| Adleburgh | £ 145.00 | $ 184.15 | |
| Woburn Marquess | £ 225.00 | 182.50 @ if you play both courses | $ 285.75 |
| Ferndown Old | £ 170.00 | $ 215.90 | |
| Ipswich Purdis Heath | £ 125.00 | $ 158.75 | |
| Woburm Duke's | £ 225.00 | 182.50 @ if you play both courses | $ 285.75 |
| Beau Desert | n/a/ | | |
| Sherwood Forest | £ 135.00 | $ 171.45 | |
| Little Aston | £ 150.00 | $ 190.50 | |
| Bearwood Lakes | n/a/ | | |
| Remdy Oak | £ 160.00 | $ 203.20 | |
| Saunton West | £ 145.00 | $ 184.15 | |
| Addington | £ 140.00 | $ 177.80 | |
| Royal North Devon | £ 100.00 | $ 127.00 | |
| Coombe Hill | n/a/ | 170 in 2023 | |
| Wallasey | £ 195.00 | $ 247.65 | |
| Wisley Church & Garden | n/a/ | | |
| Hayling | £ 115.00 | $ 146.05 | |
| Lindrick | £ 125.00 | $ 158.75 | |
| Stoneham | £ 115.00 | $ 146.05 | |
| Trevose | £ 105.00 | $ 133.35 | |
| Littlestone | £ 125.00 | $ 158.75 | |
| Seacroft | £ 80.00 | $ 101.60 | |
| Perranporth | n/a/ | | |
| East Devon | n/a/ | 85 in 2022 | |
| Blackmoor | £ 110.00 | $ 139.70 | |
| Seaton Carew | n/a | | |
| Huntercombe | £ 120.00 | $ 152.40 | |
| Tandridge | n/a | 100 in 2023 | |
| St Mellion Nicklaus | £ 90.00 | $ 114.30 | |
| Blackwell | £ 110.00 | $ 139.70 | |
| Royal Wimbeldon | n/a | | |
| Camberley Heath | £ 98.00 | $ 124.46 |
Sunningdale Old or New is £350 for either and £600 for both. Not sure the - very helpful - chart makes this particularly clear.Tom, correct. I tried to note that in point 7 where it is $762 for both. Also, the England $ per round average is noted as factoring in a 36 hole day at Sunningdale. Not perfect as the formatting isn't fun.
Speaking of price inflation/gouging, has anyone checked out transatlantic airfares lately for this coming summer? 30% to 50% higher than there were last year. :(
You can still play Enniscrone and Carne for less that 200 Euros. And some of the other courses in Ireland, like Rosses Point, if you buy a day pass and play 36 you'll average less than 200 a round. Even still, it's incredible how quickly the prices have gone up in the last five years. There's no doubt they gouge the overseas visitor. On the other hand, it's still less than many of the top public courses in the US. And I appreciate that the vast majority of great courses in the UK and Ireland allow public access.
It's not overseas visitors. It's visitors generally. I am not aware of any clubs that have a specially high American rate :)
It's not overseas visitors. It's visitors generally. I am not aware of any clubs that have a specially high American rate :)
I was talking about Ireland, and given that it's an island, I would consider pretty much all visitors as being "overseas." Wasn't limiting that to just Americans.
You can have both good golf, a beautiful coast, and a great time in Southwest England for reasonable prices. I love it in Devon and Cornwall. These are in-season prices. The courses also have twilight fees that are much cheaper.
Pounds. Dollars
Saunton (both) 220 279
St Enodoc. 150. 191
Burnham & Berrow. 150. 191
Royal North Devon 100. 127
Trevose. 105. 134
Overseas memberships as Sauton and RND are inexpensive.
It would be interesting to see a chart, over time, of the ratio of visitors fees compared to a membership for a local person. What would that be at these courses now? As high as 50% (in that a visitor pays 50% for one round of what it would cost a local person to play all year). And how would that compare to 20 years ago.
A visitor is anyone who isn't a member of the club. I don't know about Ireland but in Scotland at a lot of clubs most visitors are Scottish/locals and therefore not from overseas.
Niall
Someone from Cork visiting a course in Dublin is still a visitor. In GB&I a "visitor" is someone who is not a member and not playing with a member (that'd be a guest). Locals play local courses, too.
It's not overseas visitors. It's visitors generally. I am not aware of any clubs that have a specially high American rate :)
I was talking about Ireland, and given that it's an island, I would consider pretty much all visitors as being "overseas." Wasn't limiting that to just Americans.
I therefore demand, as an American tourist, that you bring back Liz Truss in time for this summer’s trip ::)Even with our recent electoral penchant for self-harm, that isn't happening.
In GB&I a "visitor" is someone who is not a member and not playing with a member (that'd be a guest). Locals play local courses, too.This is not entirely accurate. Quite a few courses have two categories of visitor. I have several potential itineraries "in the works" and have seen some version of this in Scotland, England, and Ireland. A few examples from Scotland:
It is entirely accurate. The existence of different classes of visitor, all of whom are not members of the club and not playing with a member does not detract from the accuracy of the broader definition.In GB&I a "visitor" is someone who is not a member and not playing with a member (that'd be a guest). Locals play local courses, too.This is not entirely accurate.
That is fine, but I don't really care about semantics. The point that others were trying to make earlier, and I was attempting to reinforce, is that not all visitors pay the same rate. I should not have cited your post as inaccurate.It is entirely accurate. The existence of different classes of visitor, all of whom are not members of the club and not playing with a member does not detract from the accuracy of the broader definition.In GB&I a "visitor" is someone who is not a member and not playing with a member (that'd be a guest). Locals play local courses, too.This is not entirely accurate.
But yes, some clubs do distinguish between classes of visitor. Dumbarnie, for instance, has, I think, at least three different classes of Scottish resident, depending on how locally they live. This is relatively new and still rare, I think. But I suspect it may become more common.
In GB&I a "visitor" is someone who is not a member and not playing with a member (that'd be a guest). Locals play local courses, too.This is not entirely accurate. Quite a few courses have two categories of visitor. I have several potential itineraries "in the works" and have seen some version of this in Scotland, England, and Ireland. A few examples from Scotland:
Lundin (peak season):
150 visitor
120 UK resident (20% discount)
Panmure (peak season):
160 visitor
135 UK golf club member (16% discount)
Monifieth Medal (peak season):
125 visitor
95 Scottish golf club member (24% discount)
Montrose (peak season):
140 visitor
70 Scottish Golf Union member (50% discount)
Carnoustie, Arbroath, Scotscraig, Elie, and many others do still have just one visitor rate.
But yes, some clubs do distinguish between classes of visitor. Dumbarnie, for instance, has, I think, at least three different classes of Scottish resident, depending on how locally they live. This is relatively new and still rare, I think. But I suspect it may become more common.
In GB&I a "visitor" is someone who is not a member and not playing with a member (that'd be a guest). Locals play local courses, too.This is not entirely accurate. Quite a few courses have two categories of visitor. I have several potential itineraries "in the works" and have seen some version of this in Scotland, England, and Ireland. A few examples from Scotland:
Lundin (peak season):
150 visitor
120 UK resident (20% discount)
Panmure (peak season):
160 visitor
135 UK golf club member (16% discount)
Monifieth Medal (peak season):
125 visitor
95 Scottish golf club member (24% discount)
Montrose (peak season):
140 visitor
70 Scottish Golf Union member (50% discount)
Carnoustie, Arbroath, Scotscraig, Elie, and many others do still have just one visitor rate.
I was at an English club recently which is considering adding a non UK fee for visitors. This would be the first in England that I encountered. The concept is spreading in Scotland.
Ciao
Thanks David, I'm very glad I took the opportunity to play Alwoodley and Ganton when I did as they are now way above what I'd be willing to pay.
Niall
David
The buzz word for the last few years has been sustainable. I wonder how sustainable some of these greenfees are in the mid to long term, particularly as the pent up demand caused by COVID subsides; the possibility of the pound gaining on the dollar; and a continued reduction in inflation ?
Niall
I didn't want to thread hijack Sean's Scotland price gouging thread as this is broader. First, it is great that the model in the UK is very welcoming to visitors. Second, yes it has gotten quite expensive, but supply and demand, if you can't afford it stay home.
So I have some lists below sorted by:
- Country
- Course by Top100golfcourses country ranking (not best, but easiest to use)
- I have the top 50 in that list for UK & Ireland listed
- Local currency is first column with US dollars conversion (1.27 for pounds and 1.09 for euro) in the second column
- The price is for listed for 1 visitor green fee for peak summer 2024, midweek if cheaper.
- This is green fee only, not inclusive of any other caddie/buggie fees
- Sunningdale is $762 for both, Muirfield is $667 for 2 rounds/lunch
- Several courses don't have listed fees (Royal Aberdeen technical issue), several are private (Loch Lomond, Swinley Forest, Wentworth), some you have to inquire (Ardfin, Rye, Royal West Norfolk). If anyone has definitive 2024 visitor prices let me know.
England
- For the 17 England courses with prices it would cost $5,232 or $308 per round. Assuming Sunningdale 36 day promo rate
- For the 16 Scotland courses with prices it would cost $6,118 or $382 per round.
- For the 7 Ireland courses with prices it would cost $2,262 or $323 per round.
- For the 2 N. Ireland courses with prices it would cost $889 or $445 per round.
- For the 1 Wales course listed it would cost $279 per round.
- For the 43 courses listed it would cost $14,780 or $344 per round.
- We can maybe do this list again in 2025 and we have a running total to refer to.
Course pounds dollars Royal St. Georges-1 330 419 Sunningdale-2/5 600 762 Royal Birkdale-3 340 432 Swinley Forest-4 not listed xxx Woodhall Spa-6 225 286 Royal Lytham-7 320 406 Ganton-8 195 248 St. Georges Hill-9 255 324 St. Endoc-10 150 191 Royal C Ports-11 235 298 West Sussex-12 150 191 Alwoodley-13 225 286 Walton Heath-14 260 330 Royal Liverpool-15 310 394 Royal W. Norfolk-16 not listed xxx Rye -17 not listed xxx Silloth on Solway-18 95 121 Hollinwell-19 190 241 Wentworth-20 not listed xxx Berkshire-21 240 305
Scotland
Course pounds dollars St. Andrews Old-1 320 406 Trump Turnberry-2 495 629 Muirfield-3 340 432 Royal Dornoch-4 280 356 North Berwick-5 240 305 Carnoustie-6 300 381 Kingsbarns-7 418 531 Castle Stuart-8 295 375 Royal Aberdeen-9 not listed xxx Trump International-10 400 508 Cruden Bay-11 175 222 Ardfin-12 not sure xxx Royal Troon-13 340 432 Prestwick-14 270 343 Loch Lomond-15 not listed xxx Gleneagles-16 280 356 Dumbarnie-17 299 380 Western Gailes-18 245 311 Machrahanish-19 120 152
Ireland
Course euros dollars Ballybunion-1 350 382 Lahinch-2 325 354 St. Patricks-3 240 262 Portmarnock-4 325 354 European Club-5 290 316 Waterville-6 300 327 The Island-7 270 294
Northern Ireland
Course pounds dollars RC Down-1 360 457 Royal Portrush-2 340 432
Wales
Course pounds dollars Royal Porthcawl 220 279
In GB&I a "visitor" is someone who is not a member and not playing with a member (that'd be a guest). Locals play local courses, too.This is not entirely accurate. Quite a few courses have two categories of visitor. I have several potential itineraries "in the works" and have seen some version of this in Scotland, England, and Ireland. A few examples from Scotland:
Lundin (peak season):
150 visitor
120 UK resident (20% discount)
Panmure (peak season):
160 visitor
135 UK golf club member (16% discount)
Monifieth Medal (peak season):
125 visitor
95 Scottish golf club member (24% discount)
Montrose (peak season):
140 visitor
70 Scottish Golf Union member (50% discount)
Carnoustie, Arbroath, Scotscraig, Elie, and many others do still have just one visitor rate.
I was at an English club recently which is considering adding a non UK fee for visitors. This would be the first in England that I encountered. The concept is spreading in Scotland.
Ciao
It's happening already this year Sean.
Ganton -
GB&I - £195
International - £250
On the website it says GB&I need to be a member of a club but when I called up they said that wasn't the case.
In 2020 it was £140 for everyone
Alwoodley -
GB&I - £190
International - £225.
In 2020 it was £125 for everyone.
These increases are significantly above inflation.
Veblen goods behave this way: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Veblen_good (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Veblen_good)Exactly - but most people don't understand the term.
Veblen goods behave this way: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Veblen_good (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Veblen_good)Not just courses. Golf is absolutely stacked full of Veblen goods.
Veblen goods behave this way: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Veblen_good (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Veblen_good)Not just courses. Golf is absolutely stacked full of Veblen goods.
Atb
It appears that supply and demand is also working in a perverse way in UK & Ireland courses as the demand for overseas play has apparently increased when clubs upped their fees. A £30 course was deemed to be not worth playing but if the same course charged £150 then all of a sudden there was more interest.
The tourists are back
Visitors from overseas, particularly the US, have come back with a vengeance. Golfers from across the world are flocking back to play our golf courses. And they usually don’t mind paying an extra £50 to play. Such is the cost of some of those trips, it just gets lost in the rounding.
One tour operator put it to me like this, ‘A lot of foreign visitors have decided since Covid they will do whatever it takes to come to play in the UK and Ireland. Hotels, transport and green fees are all going up but I barely have a single discussion about the overall cost, they just want to know they can get on the courses’.
I have talked before about the weird phenomenon where some clubs have increased their green fees considerably over recent years because overseas visitors believe it must be a better course if it’s so expensive!
Visitor numbers at both Crail and Elie have increased since fees went above £100.It appears that supply and demand is also working in a perverse way in UK & Ireland courses as the demand for overseas play has apparently increased when clubs upped their fees. A £30 course was deemed to be not worth playing but if the same course charged £150 then all of a sudden there was more interest.
Wayne can you provide any evidence beyond "it appears"?
I hear this all the time but I've yet to see any hard evidence. As others have stated many tourists buy a package and have no idea what each green fee is.
Visitor numbers at both Crail and Elie have increased since fees went above £100.How much was the increase - was it very significant? Didn't some places go from like £40 to over £100?
I *think* £60-£120 at Crail, £80-£120 at Elie. So significant. And, to be fair, Elie has very limited visitor slots in the peak Summer anyway.Visitor numbers at both Crail and Elie have increased since fees went above £100.How much was the increase - was it very significant? Didn't some places go from like £40 to over £100?
Same at St. Enodoc. Now 150GBP and no decline in play. IMO, that's a bargain - about the same as a nice dinner at Rick Stein's seafood restaurant.I *think* £60-£120 at Crail, £80-£120 at Elie. So significant. And, to be fair, Elie has very limited visitor slots in the peak Summer anyway.Visitor numbers at both Crail and Elie have increased since fees went above £100.How much was the increase - was it very significant? Didn't some places go from like £40 to over £100?
Sunningdale Old or New is £350 for either and £600 for both. Not sure the - very helpful - chart makes this particularly clear.
It appears that supply and demand is also working in a perverse way in UK & Ireland courses as the demand for overseas play has apparently increased when clubs upped their fees. A £30 course was deemed to be not worth playing but if the same course charged £150 then all of a sudden there was more interest.
Wayne can you provide any evidence beyond "it appears"?
I hear this all the time but I've yet to see any hard evidence. As others have stated many tourists buy a package and have no idea what each green fee is.
We are in Machrihanish currently. There’s virtually no one here. We can play anywhere we want at any time. Second breakfast where we are the only people in the hotel. I suspect it will be much the same tomorrow. I repeat, it’s July on a top 100 in the world course and we can essentially treat it like our personal playground. I know this is remote but so are lots of places in the UK.
I’m not sure where all those people are that were on our full plane, but it isn’t Cruden Bay, Brora, or Machrihanish. I don’t think it has anything to do with pricing. I used to think golfers would gravitate to the good. But I think more and more that overseas visitors gravitate to the expensive. And in-country visitors and locals gravitate to the more value-oriented rounds of golf. It leaves many courses in-between in the pricing structure and they have to react accordingly.
Tony and Wayne, all the courses that have seen an increase in visitor play after increasing the fees, have seen so as the result of increased visitor traffic in the area and a lack of capacity in the more high profile courses, so the golfers need to go somewhere to fill their schedules.
If a low profile course in an area off the tourist trail increased their fees from a base of 30-50 pounds or euros to 300 they would lose all their business.
On the tourist trails most pay a package fee and don't know the individual price per course, this is the main driver behind the increase in prices.
We are in Machrihanish currently. There’s virtually no one here. We can play anywhere we want at any time. Second breakfast where we are the only people in the hotel. I suspect it will be much the same tomorrow. I repeat, it’s July on a top 100 in the world course and we can essentially treat it like our personal playground. I know this is remote but so are lots of places in the UK.
I’m not sure where all those people are that were on our full plane, but it isn’t Cruden Bay, Brora, or Machrihanish. I don’t think it has anything to do with pricing. I used to think golfers would gravitate to the good. But I think more and more that overseas visitors gravitate to the expensive. And in-country visitors and locals gravitate to the more value-oriented rounds of golf. It leaves many courses in-between in the pricing structure and they have to react accordingly.
Ben I also noticed last week that Dornoch was rammed, yet Brora and Cruden Bay had only the odd minibus. Cheaper still, Tain, had more visitors.
I think this has yet to play out and in the next few years some rates will have to drop, while the very top continue to escalate. My understanding of the Veblen Effect is that it's not just the price that needs to be high to appeal to some ones wallet. If you have a bucket list of 'top' courses, you might well be better playing it ASAP.
In my experience, with the exception of the odd Irish course, prices don’t drop. There may be more deals to be had, but rack rates don’t drop.
Just at Cruden Bay…it was steady busy…not rammed. North Berwick was rammed. Fraserburgh was nearly empty on a Sunday.
Ciao
Sean,
How did you like Fraserburgh? We really enjoyed it last year. We had the course to ourselves (admittedly, a raw day). 100 pounds if I remember correctly.
Ira
I don't believe that the private clubs in the UK and Ireland are allowing visitor play out of the goodness of their hearts. Yes, no doubt some would do just fine without the visitor revenue but they would have to significantly increase their member dues which is not necessarily something that every member can afford. The same is true of overseas members who I would speculate by and large do not play enough to be a positive economic decision for them. The private clubs must demonstrate to their members that allowing visitor play makes economic sense especially where member play becomes significantly restricted.
Sean: I remember back about 10 years ago going to Ireland to play Ballybunion and Lahinch where in each case I had a member as a caddie. Each one told me that they had what I thought was very limited access to the respective courses as a great deal of the play was visitors who paid substantial visitor fees. The member dues were roughly 500 Euros annually which were possible through those visitor fees.