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GolfClubAtlas.com => Golf Course Architecture Discussion Group => Topic started by: Richard Choi on January 20, 2015, 07:09:47 PM

Title: Photo Tour - Chambers Bay - US Open Edition - 1st Hole
Post by: Richard Choi on January 20, 2015, 07:09:47 PM
I joined this board for this.

I really did.
(http://hhgpsa.bn1303.livefilestore.com/y2pEM6K7ZS48TSu1O5SUqUVmp4p5EYBcMkXX0NmivkpK0uJ_rrBUS8LG-B2hKbU_u1R5tL_Ky0QnUZpiQz-V0C8eR4xP3JByYtEEZ6AzaqOcv6SPeCV6dvV1jzTXYZwj3cE-4LAcPfsppHwni3RVXG9HQ/WP_20130331_11_08_39_Panorama%20%28800x212%29.jpg)
It all started with me winning a local sports radio contest. KJR-AM Seattle had a contest for a spot on the media play day one week before Chambers Bay officially opened in 2007. All you had to do to enter the contest was write an email to the station on why you should win. I don’t even remember what I wrote, but it was something about how much I appreciated golf course architecture (I was a frequent visitor to GCA) and how excited I was about Chambers Bay. I am guessing not many people put much effort into the contest as I was selected as the winner (99.99% of the listeners probably had no idea what Chambers Bay was).

It was a love at first sight.

After the round, lunch was served for the press before the press conference with architects and key contributors. After getting my plate of food from the buffet, I saw that RTJ II was sitting by himself at a table. I sat next to him and introduced myself. I told him how much I loved the course and we ended up conversing for about 30 min. During the conversation, I quizzed him about many of the questions that came up about the course on GCA threads.

When I got home, I wrote an email to Ran about the conversation as I thought many in the treehouse would appreciate it. Ran gave me an account to post the conversation myself and I have been posting here ever since.

At that time, I was not convinced that Chambers Bay would ever host US Open. It is unlike any other course that ever hosted US Open. It is a true links course that belongs in The Open rota much more than US Open. I figured PGA Tour players would hate it.

I was shocked as anyone that USGA awarded 2015 US Open to Chambers Bay. I don’t know if I still believe it today.

2015 seemed so long ways away back then. It is amazing how time flies. Here we are now, less than six months before tee balls fly at Chambers Bay for our national tournament, I am still in shock.

When Chambers Bay got US Open, I told myself that I would do a detailed posting about it when the time came. That time is now.
I have played over 100 rounds at CB (probably closer to 200) and I feel like I REALLY know the course (at least better than any other golf course I have ever played). It is probably likely that no course more accessible has EVER hosted US Open (not even Bethpage, as trying to get a tee time at BPB is much more difficult, and the round can cost less than $100 if you play with a local). I would like to make it even more accessible for you.

I will be discussing hole-by-hole in detail. I will try to describe the strategies and features of every hole from US Open point of view. I will tackle one hole a week as there is much to be discussed. I should be done with the endeavor by June. My hope is that in the end, it will provide a bit more perspective when you are watching the event on TV. I encourage everyone to participate and I will try to answer any and all questions from everybody.

With that out of the way, let’s talk some GCA, US Open style…
Title: Hole 1, Par 4/5, 510/600 Yards
Post by: Richard Choi on January 20, 2015, 07:13:25 PM
(http://hhgpsa.bn1303.livefilestore.com/y2pUL6IxgMMTv7pKebzepTDIjb6LpqBYmQ1KzkVFc1oMMdjQXTSJeq4c9jTHMuOdYf3eCA6pNj9gGj8eViEwacoeQT_0wD8aSM58NRvdXMdKYl_ZLPpFcY17neoSLOVcfT6V8WJXk4zkOkwL1wfw6zifg/Chambers%20-%20Overhead.jpg)


Right off the bat, this will be unlike any other US Open. Mike Davis has announced that #1 and #18, which run parallel to each other, will be played as par 4/5 combos for US Open. If there is a strong western wind (from Puget Sound), #1 will play as a par 5 (head wind) and #18 will play as a par 4 (tail wind). In all other situations, #1 will play as a par 4 and #18 will play as a par 5 as originally designed.

No one really knows the exact yardage this hole will play to as one of the strongest feature for Chambers Bay is that yardages are almost meaningless as every hole can be set up to play any desired length. #1 can play as short as 400 yards to as long as 650 yards.

My guess is that they will tee off somewhere around 500 yards if playing as a par 4 and somewhere around 600 yards if playing as a par 5.
Please refer to the overhead view below as I will be referring to the specific hole features labeled below.
(http://hhgpsa-ch3302.files.1drv.com/y2pzxXdoaGzy6dZdPsMEQQtrOFgfcamgkNs9T63HiF-cYOV3QgQ2SAyr0MUWIlHP5xlxfLJ1rBV3M059EhXm7mT-2wsAntg5mRwEwpXykG88mwLuoSSxw54ocMwezLFt45S-iEXq0VOlwotCSBpR6mJqw/Chambers%20Bay%20-%20Hole%2001%20-%20a%20-%20Overhead%20%28800x255%29.jpg)

Tee Shot

If the first hole is playing as a par 5, this may be the easiest opening drive in US Open history. As long as you can drive 250 yards (into wind), there is virtually no way that you can miss the fairway as the landing area (A) is as wide as a football field and the fairway bunker is not in play unless you can drive over 350 yards. You want to favor the left side for a better angle to the green. However, it is not worth the gamble of hitting into the tall fescue on the left. The aim should be straight towards the far side fairway bunker (B) in the middle of the fairway.

There are far more important things to worry about during your round than this drive.
(http://hhgpsa.bn1303.livefilestore.com/y2p384lV_DAAMTn8VWx8cLyRlnP5azepzYbsjPb8Bkf-hu19wjx9v-3rS6hk0xFYk4qvcoQPl5H3qOZ8u0tP7f6UMGei5HRQH2iWgW-VytYJn0wtdN7QfdrEGnuw9M5LzJB4sjv5UuwuCC-jINtdJYGRw/Hole%2001%20-%20WP_20130630_001%20%28800x450%29.jpg)
Tee shot is far trickier when it is playing as a par 4. If you hope to reach the green in two, you must reach the plateau (C) which is about 270 to 300 yards away. Anything shorter will not have enough momentum to climb the slope up the ridge to the plateau and you will have a completely blind (and severely uphill) second shot (and probably no chance to reach the green in two). Hitting a drive long enough to reach the plateau means that the fairway bunker (B – it is an actual FAIRWAY bunker as the fairway is mowed closely all the way to the bunker from tee) is now very much in play. But you may prefer the bunker compare to the complete crapshoot that waits for you in the left rough (D). The top part of this rough closest to the fairway is not so bad to play out of, but if you pull it a bit more, it will end up in the lower part of the slope which has some of the densest rough at Chambers Bay. This is one of the very few places at Chambers Bay where you can lose your ball. Just getting the ball back to the fairway will be a challenge from this rough.

Approach/Second Shot
(http://hhgpsa.bn1303.livefilestore.com/y2pF3GXl9I_KF90S3y8FSR7N3lciG6poghT5FLVUk37DJvEpBDl4m4mWLxPpqMuKPCQBug3oFrWrmEGGrjjBb7Ya0eroevaT9ha4wricyfMqzU2Ma4Q7p21pquYFrHDvRTmSSDHEao3IVk4HPFkfLWFvA/Hole%2001%20-%20WP_20130901_002%20%28800x450%29.jpg)
If you are in the middle of the lower bowl (A), there is not much to the second shot other than trying to hit it long enough to go past the end of the rough on the left (200 yards +). As it is with almost every hole, the gigantic dune on the right (E) is to be avoided at all costs. The dunes are very steep and grounds are very uneven. Getting a playable lie after hitting into the dune is an unlikely proposition.
(http://hhgpsa.bn1303.livefilestore.com/y2paoHKTs9ieT5LfjC1HXNKWBlHvBpkL8dUlZD3xNNeWXnMj-fnhnbATV4Z7OF3atdOvufslNIixIWyeT7cZmASbo03KqekV81OvwXk5avBwpGU75onJm877DdYEncTnIhLDV7LppfOJs8wzSWAiYFt-g/Hole%2001%20-%20WP_20130901_003%20%28800x450%29.jpg)
If you are in the fairway bunker your only goal should be to get it somewhere near the left side near the green (G). The steep slope coming down from the dunes on the right and the steep face of the bunker will preclude you from hitting it towards the pin. If you get too greedy, there is a significant chance that your next shot will be a buried shot from the face of the bunker.
(http://hhgpsa.bn1303.livefilestore.com/y2pcE_e7GLyG-m0lY5osqMTXTnUPX3JgMTOnJZpLTdF7SLYMz-VdIvTLdqLHrhGoXzK2ZHbiUDupChN53y1T6TeCOO02gNa2i2hbK_3fB304G0cabSztCg_wwxAelwy1KKyQ1C9VZsMjvp5ypgOVUdkHA/Hole%2001%20-%20WP_20130901_006%20%28800x450%29.jpg)
If you are lucky enough to hit from the plateau (C), the excellent view and level lie will temp you to fly your long approach (200+ yards) close to the pin. The fact that only 4 players hit the green in regulation during the first day of US Amateur should remind you that you need to pay much more attention to the shot at hand.

The reason why so few hit the green in regulation during US Amateur was that grounds were rock hard. This caused not only any approach shot that landed on the green to end up bouncing through the green to the lower back area 10 feet below the green, but any ball that landed short of the green that was kicked forward (H, as designed) so hard that they ran through the green as well. While I do not believe the fairways will be as firm as it played during US Amateur for US Open, I believe Chambers Bay made a wise decision to soften the hump (H) short right of the green so that the kick forward will not be so violent (one of the very few changes that I agree with).
(http://hhgpsa.bn1303.livefilestore.com/y2pCq0K_iNKn0MMn6bjSxhwD_Wnba-9_ZRHWfROIZJtzjXxIFBLsHE3v_sHxjoPcafVwLyKucIcmsdAy-7AWhBhqmQ2lB-KfNGKLDRmVsazR3yzPtaENhDCsZyvx888_zeX37m9K6syGK-4a7HgrMTMmA/Hole%2001%20-%20WP_20130901_010%20%28800x450%29.jpg)
The right to left slope of the hole dictates everything here. If the pin is in the front half, the approach shot MUST land in the right side of the fairway about 20 yards short of the green, preferably with a high, soft fade. The correct approach shot will feed down gently to the green. Anything that land on the front half of the green will roll to the back half of the green and anything that land in the back half of the green will end up 20 feet below 20 yards behind the green (J). Anything short left (really anything left of the center of green) will also end up down on the fairway shared with #18, 20 feet below the green (G).
Plays Around the Green
(http://hhgpsa.bn1303.livefilestore.com/y2pt6LY2nqlOyxMkRocBCLYULer-idkKYTyKryui46LyuWD6NoWHPpKMwDCW6SFLG0o5bY3rBlhIp9N8_ZRLen__av2WDJO_5aEW-01sU4Mw-LBDyQ8rksmq3UXVG1jB8GScbbTM2PGCQTIEDsjC0ECp-36pPo-gtfUKS6IpX5OuSA/Hole%2001%20-%20WP_20150419_13_38_22_Pro%20%28800x450%29.jpg)
The flop shot, the short shot di rigueur for most US Open, is going to be on the endangered watch as there is almost no rough to speak of around the green. Sure, you will be hitting a flop shot from the bottom of the fairway if you miss to the left of the green (G), but you will be doing that because the green is 20 feet above you, not because that is the only shot you can hit out of that lie. The lies around the green will be tight and ground will be rock hard. It will take some cojones to try to pull off flop shots on delicate approaches. I suspect a putter (and hybrids) will be a very popular choice from off the green. This is especially true since Chambers Bay is fescue from tee to green and rolling speed will be pretty consistent from fairway through the green.
(http://hhgpsa.bn1303.livefilestore.com/y2pELHvMPVBRQUAC8vurFX-TmP68JcNFFyZu-mGBTeHopEc3Wl4X65sq0j1xZR4K0J_4F94J4srN4blULWKK5hGK4GeZ4Jo-F2YJY3eOgyC27ihpVQHBNjr3e3BsRc4IAOTB8A3Xmx0cgwcPdrUF3B1XA/Hole%2001%20-%20WP_20140810_006%20%28800x450%29.jpg)
If the pin is in the front, it is almost preferable to miss to the left of the green. Even though the pin will be 20 feet above you, there is enough room on the right side of the green to feed the ball back down if you hit it a bit long. If the pin is in the back, you really want to leave it on the fairway to the right where you can see the pin and will have more inviting shot towards the back.
(http://hhgpsa.bn1303.livefilestore.com/y2ptwnP3mvWjrluEuHW1jMPzleP_HB8tGAI2iRD2zygwXqXL2huZMaHBe__FxmlL3N-njqd1z6DtiKvD7nbaCU7vxRX8NuhpxEjhW1YmdbXq980cclyCXPgP1I-Naug8Z5RsIVcfvVoBeX_c5XQpwfY-A/Chambers%20Bay-1st-Green.jpg)
The back right greenside bunker (I) can be nasty based on the lie as it is narrow and deep. However, if the lie is decent, it is a preferable place to miss to as most pins will be readily accessible. Most pro’s would prefer this bunker shot compared to hitting a blind shot.
(http://hhgpsa.bn1303.livefilestore.com/y2pYWkW-Krhp1hu2BjlKb3jH8cPuaQHNw_oo7sC03euYaAfomOgpMisWUQBFoRXM6wbG6g_0kGgga0i7mYBP0MUZrrQJHld-w0xp7CmQExIVvPg5IaEt7hExy0IKKfw9Fti29dh2fKE-a1a-XmclYXzggsITqFPDPGcr5k0BQFK7ps/Hole%2001%20-%20WP_20150419_13_38_47_Pro%20%28800x450%29.jpg)

The only bunker that you MUST avoid is the front right bunker above the hump (J). There will be some approach shots that will end up here as you need to skirt this bunker to access the front pins. If you are in this bunker, you are looking at bogey at best and double or triple at worst as you will have a downhill lie bunker shot with everything running away from you. Leaving this shot anywhere on the green would be a terrific effort.
(http://hhgpsa.bn1303.livefilestore.com/y2peieVJsAB_Dge2YaVha20O-UtjKGEyuiALo2RluYmXGomr2NCLgYEZJ6dqA3HQV14pHg9bZZ0E1MxCKqEhaqjn7QaZPawGg7b66dyJXprvvekFcc2S5U23Y1woh8HQfnRKPHmjV8cxQ_UutQmtMnVIg/Hole%2001%20-%20WP_20130901_014%20%28800x450%29.jpg)
Many players will end up in the back left after hitting their approach shot through the green. For a back pin, this shot is not the most difficult as you have plenty of fairway to work with. Just make sure that you don’t hit it short as the ball will come back right back to your feet.

Putting
(http://hhgpsa.bn1303.livefilestore.com/y2py3Wq8llCu-e416N1muXmR3AzGFvqlpYInPLqxA4sC0xszRvMnsaeVnRBUMpMsK9RCQVLDkhZhIlOk0pCcOhXVQzU5zWyl9ffAwyxZCvN4FfzrXArqdkO_ND9ftMRhWqxKst6KqZGvioaDn-F7HMCkQ/Hole%2001%20-%20WP_20130901_013%20%28800x450%29.jpg)
I have noted what I believe are the most likely spots for pins in the diagram above (1-4).

The valley that bisects the green is the dominant feature. Any indifferently hit putt across this valley will end up off the green (hopefully on the plateau just below the green instead of the fairway all the way down). To have any hopes of getting a birdie (or even an easy par), you must hit the right half of the green where the pin is. The front pins (1 & 2) will cause the biggest problems when playing the hole as a par 4 since keeping a mid to long iron in the front half will be extremely difficult. The front part also has the most right to left (and front to back) slope which will cause problems with putts. Putts above the hole will be treacherous. As long as the you navigate the valley correctly, the back pins (3 & 4) will be much easier to deal with as the green is relatively flat in the back.
Title: Re: Photo Tour - Chambers Bay - US Open Edition - 1st Hole
Post by: Joe Bausch on January 20, 2015, 07:21:40 PM
A big TIA RC.
Title: Re: Photo Tour - Chambers Bay - US Open Edition - 1st Hole
Post by: Jim Tang on January 20, 2015, 07:41:55 PM
Richard-

Thanks for sharing. I'm looking forward to your tour. I've not been to Chamber's Bay. The first hole seems to have a lot of width. Is that true for other holes.  Given what you may or may not know about the set up of the course, do you think the course will play more like a typical U.S. Open or more similar to an Open Championship?
Title: Re: Photo Tour - Chambers Bay - US Open Edition - 1st Hole
Post by: Richard Choi on January 20, 2015, 07:52:12 PM
Jim, you are not mistaken, there is a lot of width. Like I said, this will be unlike any US Open in modern history. It will play more like The Open than US Open.

While there is plenty of width, the actual playing width will be narrower than it looks as the ground will be firm and fescue fairways will run fast. There is also plenty of undulation in the fairways to give some discomfort to players even when they are playing from the fairway. The slopes in the fairway will also redirect drives with wrong shape towards the rough.

Most of the photos that I will be using have been taken over the last year or two and the rough line will be what will be used for US Open. They have been cutting this line every since US Open was awarded and modifications were made.

The 1st hole is much narrower than the original design as there was no real rough to the left side of the landing zone and the shared fairways between 1st and 18th holes were much larger. I am hoping that the rough line will be expanded back to the original design after the US Open (the rough line for 7th hole is especially egregious), but I am not holding my breath.
Title: Re: Photo Tour - Chambers Bay - US Open Edition - 1st Hole
Post by: Chris Mavros on January 20, 2015, 08:36:59 PM
Very nice detail and I'm looking forward to following along.  I played CB in the summer of 2012 and I loved every minute of the round.  My caddie made the round and it really opened my eyes as to how many different options reside in how the course can be played.  The Fourth is one my all time favorite holes.  It will be an interesting US Open for sure.
Title: Re: Photo Tour - Chambers Bay - US Open Edition - 1st Hole
Post by: Garland Bayley on January 20, 2015, 08:44:13 PM
This had better become an IMO or Best of Golf piece when Richard is done.

Richard, this is much appreciated.
Title: Re: Photo Tour - Chambers Bay - US Open Edition - 1st Hole
Post by: Garland Bayley on January 20, 2015, 08:46:09 PM
Quote from: Chris Mavros on January 20, 2015, 08:36:59 PM
...  The Fourth is one my all time favorite holes.  It will be an interesting US Open for sure.

Interesting choice the fourth. I think most would have chosen the fourteenth (AKA, Kalen's demise).
Title: Re: Photo Tour - Chambers Bay - US Open Edition - 1st Hole
Post by: Jon Cavalier on January 20, 2015, 08:46:31 PM
Outstanding. Thanks Richard. Very much looking forward to following along for this one.
Title: Re: Photo Tour - Chambers Bay - US Open Edition - 1st Hole
Post by: Joe Perches on January 20, 2015, 11:59:18 PM
Quote from: Richard Choi on January 20, 2015, 07:09:47 PM
I joined this board for this.

Thanks RIch.

I am very much looking forward to the separate threads for each hole. (well, maybe except eight)
Title: Re: Photo Tour - Chambers Bay - US Open Edition - 1st Hole
Post by: Marc Haring on January 21, 2015, 06:16:40 AM
I think we all will avidly follow in anticipation.

I'd be interested to hear your views on the likely style of play favoured by the victor. Jim Furyk/Zach Johnson or Bubba/Rory?
Title: Re: Photo Tour - Chambers Bay - US Open Edition - 1st Hole
Post by: Josh Tarble on January 21, 2015, 09:02:54 AM
Thanks for putting this together Rich.  I will definitely be following along.

Chamber's Bay is one of the courses I've followed from inception so I hope to one day get out there to play.  It's my opinion that the CB open may even better showcase fast and firm and width than the Pinehurst open.   
Title: Re: Photo Tour - Chambers Bay - US Open Edition - 1st Hole
Post by: Phil McDade on January 21, 2015, 09:19:35 AM
Richard:

This makes me look forward to the next five months ;D -- thanks for doing this.

Re. your comment: "As it is with almost every hole, the gigantic dune on the right (E) is to be avoided at all costs. The dunes are very steep and grounds are very uneven. Getting a playable lie after hitting into the dune is an unlikely proposition."

What are your thoughts on this for a US Open set-up? Is it your view that this rough will be cut/maintained so that the player is left with a wedge-out, or will players truly be left w/ an unplayable lie? I like the former; I'm not a big fan of the latter if there is no reasonable place to take an unplayable and the player is forced to drop in yet more unplayable stuff. I like the idea of severe penalties for players wayward on a course with so much width -- I'm particularly interested in set-up issues as I think Davis and co. may use some of the same principles at Erin Hills here in Wisconsin in 2017 as they do at CBay.

Title: Re: Photo Tour - Chambers Bay - US Open Edition - 1st Hole
Post by: Tom Yost on January 21, 2015, 09:31:32 AM
Bravo Rich!  Looking forward to the tour.

You mentioned the softening of the hump on the short/right side of the green and the addition of the native area left off the tee.  Was that all that was done? 

Can you summarize the changes that were made to the first hole?

Title: Re: Photo Tour - Chambers Bay - US Open Edition - 1st Hole
Post by: Michael Graham on January 21, 2015, 09:35:06 AM
Richard - as others have already said I'm thoroughly looking forward to seeing the rest of the course over the coming months. Many thanks for going into such detail. Your comment about lots of players likely using their putters when they can from around the greens made me think Martin Kaymer is one to keep an eye on. Whenever possible he will putt rather than chip as he did for four rounds at Pinehurst. His lag putting is usually outstanding.

Michael
Title: Re: Photo Tour - Chambers Bay - US Open Edition - 1st Hole
Post by: Dan Kelly on January 21, 2015, 09:36:51 AM
Quote from: GJ Bailey on January 20, 2015, 08:44:13 PM
This had better become an IMO or Best of Golf piece when Richard is done.

"Best of Golf," I think. Or "Best of Golf Club Atlas."

Thanks, Mr. Choi. I will have this thread handy in June.
Title: Re: Photo Tour - Chambers Bay - US Open Edition - 1st Hole
Post by: Jason Thurman on January 21, 2015, 09:53:27 AM
This course is going to look fabulous on TV. For all the talk about how Pinehurst's rugged presentation would help change the "Green is good!" mentality, this Open and the three following it are at least equally important to reaffirm the message - all on spacious layouts with few trees and plenty of tawny grass (Please note that I typed this before reading Josh's post above, which only reaffirms this thought).

Rich, I'm interested in your thoughts on the strategy of the hole. From your description and photos, its clear that the hole offers a lot of variety in recoveries and can easily bite a player who isn't precise or fails to judge their shots correctly. There's a ton going on. And yet, it seems that the strategy is fairly straightforward when played as a par 4 - hit a big drive up to the plateau and keep it in the fairway so that you can control your approach enough to keep it from running away.

Is there enough meaningful width on that plateau to make the advantage of shading to the left off the tee worth the risk of getting into the fescue? What is your ideal line when you play the hole, and what will the ideal line for the pros be? It seems like you want to be as far left in the fairway as possible, as the dune would likely block your view from the right and using the ground contours to feed the ball from right to left on the approach seems more controllable from the left side. Is that impression accurate? Also, is the dune as imposing as it looks from the fairway bunker? It looks like if you get into the bunker, you're essentially doomed to a missed green as you'll have to come out to the left. Can you foresee the best in the world coming up with a green-hitting recovery from there?

Also, thanks for doing this. I can already imagine pulling this thread up as a reference when watching the tournament.
Title: Re: Photo Tour - Chambers Bay - US Open Edition - 1st Hole
Post by: David Davis on January 21, 2015, 10:38:32 AM
Thanks Rich, pretty good description. I've only managed to play 4 times so looking forward to your tour.

Chamber's certainly does play like a true links, is fast and firm like one and has the fine grasses but I don't believe it fits the definition of a true links given that the sand was all trucked in and it used to be a rock quarry. The land is also not the "link between the fertile ground and the sea" i.e. it's not dunes land. However, that won't matter for the players or anyone visiting it's a great playing experience even for people use to true links golf. It's on the very long side if you play the back tees even though it plays shorter being so firm.

I missed the 1st green once to the left with my approach and watched my ball roll all the way down to the bottom of the hill. Very tough up and down from there. I can't remember if my approach which was from the right side of the fairway actually rolled over the front of the green first, I seem to remember this being the case but it was about a year and a half ago. I was really surprised to find it all the way down to the left in any case.
Title: Re: Photo Tour - Chambers Bay - US Open Edition - 1st Hole
Post by: Richard Choi on January 21, 2015, 01:03:38 PM
I promise I will answer every question you post, with every detail that I know.

Quote from: Marc Haring on January 21, 2015, 06:16:40 AM
I'd be interested to hear your views on the likely style of play favoured by the victor. Jim Furyk/Zach Johnson or Bubba/Rory?

Marc, I am not sure any style of play will be favored going into play. Obviously, the course will be playing very long, so long driving will definitely be a plus (this and the hot putter is how Peter Uihlein won US Am), but the firmness of the fairways will even that out a bit. What I would favor is a player with patience. Going pin hunting is usually not advisable in US Open and at this course, that will be doubly so. With all the humps, hollows, and sideboards, the best strategies often involve hitting away from the pin and using the contours to feed the ball closer to the pin. This will frustrate many, many PGA Tour players. I think long players with good imagination and shot shape, like Bubba, has to be the favorites going in.

Quote from: Phil McDade on January 21, 2015, 09:19:35 AM
What are your thoughts on this for a US Open set-up? Is it your view that this rough will be cut/maintained so that the player is left with a wedge-out, or will players truly be left w/ an unplayable lie? I like the former; I'm not a big fan of the latter if there is no reasonable place to take an unplayable and the player is forced to drop in yet more unplayable stuff.

Phil M, the rough (at least the ones in flat areas) have been watered and fertilized so they are quite thick and juicy. Based on what I have seen the grounds crew do over the last several years, they will keep these areas quite tall (calf height). They will be as bad as any US Open, if not worse. But since they are not everywhere like other US Open courses, I think this setup is more than fair. You really have no business hitting these rough except for a few holes.

The dunes are different stories. The dunes are so steep that it cannot be maintained with machinery. It pretty much grows wild – which adds to its unevenness. There will be unplayable lies in those dunes if you are not lucky. What I am afraid of is that many players will try to play it anyway instead of taking an unplayable lie and replaying the last shot, quickly turning a bogey into double or worse.

Quote from: Tom Yost on January 21, 2015, 09:31:32 AM
Can you summarize the changes that were made to the first hole?

Hi Tom! I will try to put better emphasis on all the changes that have occurred since the course opened. I did not dwell on it too much on the first hole since this hole has not been altered much. Here are all the changes for the first hole:
1.   Rough area created left of the landing area (used to be mostly fairways between first and eighteenth hole)
2.   Additional tee box extended next to the starter shack to allow the hole to play as a par 5 (600+ yards)
3.   Front green mound soften to lessen the kick forward effect.

Quote from: Jason Thurman on January 21, 2015, 09:53:27 AM
And yet, it seems that the strategy is fairly straightforward when played as a par 4 - hit a big drive up to the plateau and keep it in the fairway so that you can control your approach enough to keep it from running away.

Jason, this is such a long and tough par 4 that survival is your main strategy. It is much more interesting (strategy wise) as a par 5.

Quote from: Jason Thurman on January 21, 2015, 09:53:27 AM
Is there enough meaningful width on that plateau to make the advantage of shading to the left off the tee worth the risk of getting into the fescue? What is your ideal line when you play the hole, and what will the ideal line for the pros be? It seems like you want to be as far left in the fairway as possible, as the dune would likely block your view from the right and using the ground contours to feed the ball from right to left on the approach seems more controllable from the left side. Is that impression accurate? Also, is the dune as imposing as it looks from the fairway bunker? It looks like if you get into the bunker, you're essentially doomed to a missed green as you'll have to come out to the left. Can you foresee the best in the world coming up with a green-hitting recovery from there?

Great questions!

You will favor the left side more based on how firm the ground is. If the ground is US Am firm (I am not expecting this since it is June and not August), you MUST be on the left side and hit a high fade to the short right of green to have any chance of holding the green. Any sort of draw from the right side of the fairway will not hold in that situation. So, your impression is correct.

I have a very hard time believing that you can hit the green from the fairway bunker. You are looking at 230+ yard shot that you must first, clear the very steep lip of the bunker, that will have 30 yard + fade.

Another big factor with these bunkers is that they are filled with real sand and not crushed rock. The sand here is not as weathered as those at Bandon, so they don’t play quite as soft as they do in Bandon Dunes, but the balls do not sit up like they do in crushed rock bunkers. Hitting a long iron from these bunkers will not be an easy task.

Quote from: David Davis on January 21, 2015, 10:38:32 AM
Chamber's certainly does play like a true links, is fast and firm like one and has the fine grasses but I don't believe it fits the definition of a true links given that the sand was all trucked in and it used to be a rock quarry.

This is not true. This site was both sand and rock quarry. Almost every golf course (from 20’s to 80’s) in Seattle area has greens built with sand from this site.

Quote from: David Davis on January 21, 2015, 10:38:32 AM
The land is also not the "link between the fertile ground and the sea" i.e. it's not dunes land. However, that won't matter for the players or anyone visiting it's a great playing experience even for people use to true links golf.

This is true.
Title: Re: Photo Tour - Chambers Bay - US Open Edition - 1st Hole
Post by: William_G on January 21, 2015, 01:38:31 PM
Quote from: Richard Choi on January 21, 2015, 01:03:38 PM
This is not true. This site was both sand and rock quarry. Almost every golf course (from 20’s to 80’s) in Seattle area has greens built with sand from this site.


Thank you Richard, great stuff.

Everyone I spoke with when the course first opened said a huge amount of sand was brought in to fill the site as it was essentially a huge excavated pit pre-golf.

Great job by the county!
Title: Re: Photo Tour - Chambers Bay - US Open Edition - 1st Hole
Post by: Pete_Pittock on January 21, 2015, 02:44:50 PM
Richard,
What about spectators areas? The hill on the right would be brutal in dry, slippery conditions., like medevac dangerous. The left side will only be good watching for the first 300, after that everything is way above you. Stands behind the green don't make much sense, unless they are way back because of the  collection area.
Title: Re: Photo Tour - Chambers Bay - US Open Edition - 1st Hole
Post by: David Davis on January 21, 2015, 03:00:14 PM
Rich, actually what about wind? I've really not had any wind to speak of in my 4 plays. What's June like? Are we likely to see some challenge from the elements other than of course the possibility of rain?
Title: Re: Photo Tour - Chambers Bay - US Open Edition - 1st Hole
Post by: Richard Choi on January 21, 2015, 04:42:26 PM
Pete, you are correct about the dangers of the dunes. My wife fell several times during US Am. With steep slope and tall slippery fescue, the dunes can/will cause many people to slip and fall - even with golf shoes. From what I heard, USGA is limiting the ticket sales just to deal with this issue. There is enough room to host 200k spectators a day, if you really wanted to.

David, there is really no severe wind to speak of, unless there is a storm brewin'. Most likely you will see 5 to 10 mph breezes, and only in the afternoons. On most days that I play (I play very early), there is no real wind to test you. This is why firmness of the course and its flexible length will be a key to a successful US Open.

Title: Re: Photo Tour - Chambers Bay - US Open Edition - 1st Hole
Post by: Wade Whitehead on January 21, 2015, 07:14:30 PM
Been excited about this thread for a long time.

Thanks, Richard.

WW
Title: Re: Photo Tour - Chambers Bay - US Open Edition - 1st Hole
Post by: Guy Nicholson on January 21, 2015, 07:59:18 PM
I wonder if there's any chance they'll put stands on top of those hills? Not sure how great it would look on TV, but it would address the safety issue and make for a unique spectating experience.
Title: Re: Photo Tour - Chambers Bay - US Open Edition - 1st Hole
Post by: RJ_Daley on January 21, 2015, 08:34:16 PM
I'm just getting to this thread now.  Thank you Richard.  It is obvious we have an excellent tour host with 'real' on the ground benefit of knowing the course well and a good writer.  This should run many pages and is off to a great start with the excellent questions and answers.  I know I'm just preaching to the choir, but a superior effort like Richard's here can't go un-thanked IMHO.   ;D

Whistling Straits has the same slippery slopes on the manufactured clumpy fescue covered dunes, and dry conditions on the fescue and heat make the footing like a slip and slide.  But, they are great vantage points.  I wore soft spikes the several days I went to first PGA there and watched my wife in tennys slip often. 

I only walked the grow-in version of CB a few weeks before the soft opening.  Of course much of the subsequent multitude of GCA.com threads have centered around the fescue turf conditions and the long agonizing process of keeping it healthy.  Correct me if I am wrong, but has the course ever seen what would be deemed "Major tornament ready' throughout the entirety of all 18 greens and surrounds?  I'm not talking eyecandy greenery and lush.  I'm just talking about the kind of turf consistency where these selections of shot both playing the ground into greens on 2nd shot approaches or the flop, bump or chip from surrounds will get the sort of consistency of turf, not impaired by ground under repair and endless unhealed divots? Do you think the super and staff can do this, Richard?  Thanks.
Title: Re: Photo Tour - Chambers Bay - US Open Edition - 1st Hole
Post by: Richard Choi on January 21, 2015, 08:50:41 PM
Quote from: Guy Nicholson on January 21, 2015, 07:59:18 PM
I wonder if there's any chance they'll put stands on top of those hills? Not sure how great it would look on TV, but it would address the safety issue and make for a unique spectating experience.

Guy, the top of the dunes on the right of the first hole is graded and wired for hospitality tents. I am guessing the most favored USGA supporters will have their corporate tents above the first hole. Should have a very nice view of the finish as well.
Title: Re: Photo Tour - Chambers Bay - US Open Edition - 1st Hole
Post by: Richard Choi on January 21, 2015, 09:01:05 PM
Quote from: RJ_Daley on January 21, 2015, 08:34:16 PM
Correct me if I am wrong, but has the course ever seen what would be deemed "Major tornament ready' throughout the entirety of all 18 greens and surrounds?  I'm not talking eyecandy greenery and lush.  I'm just talking about the kind of turf consistency where these selections of shot both playing the ground into greens on 2nd shot approaches or the flop, bump or chip from surrounds will get the sort of consistency of turf, not impaired by ground under repair and endless unhealed divots? Do you think the super and staff can do this, Richard?  Thanks.

Thanks for the kind words RJ.

Obviously, US Amateur was deemed successful so I guess you could say it has been major tournament ready for awhile. In reality, there has been several problem child greens (#4, #7, #12, and #13 to be exact) that have had conditioning issues since the beginning. With the new greens on #4, #7 and #13, consistency (in speed) between the holes have been questionable at the very least.

To address this issue, Chambers severely cut back on number of tee times available. I would say it is half what it is normally. They have also been using temp greens throughout the year to encourage growth. The last report I read said the greens as a whole are in the best shape they have ever been this winter. I have not checked in person within last couple of months, so I cannot say for sure.

I do believe that almost all of the issues with conditioning will be sorted out by June as they are committed to do almost everything possible to make it not an issue (everything short of completely shutting down the course). I am not planning to play much at all Chambers between now and June because of this.

P.S. I will say that temp greens at Chambers are as good as any greens anywhere else. The fact that it is fescue from tee to green really helps in the regard. Playing temp greens was actually great for me since it felt like I was playing a brand new hole. Chambers with all temp greens would still be the best course in the state.
Title: Re: Photo Tour - Chambers Bay - US Open Edition - 1st Hole
Post by: BCowan on January 21, 2015, 09:13:47 PM
''While I do not believe the fairways will be as firm as it played during US Amateur for US Open, I believe Chambers Bay made a wise decision to soften the hump (H) short right of the green so that the kick forward will not be so violent (one of the very few changes that I agree with). ''

Richard,

   I didn't really watch the tourney this past summer, but I am curious as to how Lee Trevino in his prime would have done with a dozen balls, say 180 yards from the green.  Do you think iyo that the modern top players lack the shot-making skills of the Trevino's of the past? Could less loft and landing short of the hump make for a GIR reward?  Nice thread...
Title: Re: Photo Tour - Chambers Bay - US Open Edition - 1st Hole
Post by: Matthew Essig on January 21, 2015, 09:14:22 PM
Quote from: Guy Nicholson on January 21, 2015, 07:59:18 PM
I wonder if there's any chance they'll put stands on top of those hills? Not sure how great it would look on TV, but it would address the safety issue and make for a unique spectating experience.

Probably not. They will probably just let people cover the dunes themselves. The stands will typically in the lower/flatter areas. There is a fair distance between the back of the first green and the walking path. There could be a small stand placed behind the green.

Quote from: David Davis on January 21, 2015, 03:00:14 PM
Rich, actually what about wind? I've really not had any wind to speak of in my 4 plays. What's June like? Are we likely to see some challenge from the elements other than of course the possibility of rain?

Either it will be sunny/calm all day or it will be a late spring Seattle day. Spring weather can be very chaotic......There could be rain/wind for 20 minutes and be sunny/calm the rest of the hour. And it will transitional weather all day.
Title: Re: Photo Tour - Chambers Bay - US Open Edition - 1st Hole
Post by: Richard Choi on January 21, 2015, 09:27:35 PM
Quote from: BCowan on January 21, 2015, 09:13:47 PM
I didn't really watch the tourney this past summer, but I am curious as to how Lee Trevino in his prime would have done with a dozen balls, say 180 yards from the green.  Do you think iyo that the modern top players lack the shot-making skills of the Trevino's of the past? Could less loft and landing short of the hump make for a GIR reward?  Nice thread...

I marshaled for US Am (I will be doing so for US Open as well) and I saw a ton of approach shots on the first hole and there were many approach shots that I thought were ideal (about 15-20 yards short of the green with a high fade), that just ran right through the green. If you hit it any shorter it would never reach the green. It was pure luck on hitting the green. I am guessing even Trevino in his prime would have had less than %10 of his approach hold the green with the US Am set up.
Title: Re: Photo Tour - Chambers Bay - US Open Edition - 1st Hole
Post by: BCowan on January 21, 2015, 09:36:09 PM
thanks Richard.  That is cool that you marshaled for AM and are for US open!
Title: Re: Photo Tour - Chambers Bay - US Open Edition - 1st Hole
Post by: Terry Lavin on January 21, 2015, 09:37:05 PM
The US Am version of this course was way too quirky. The ground was overly firm and the bounces and rollouts leaned too far to random for my taste. Here's hoping that the combination of more years for maintenance practices to take hold, combined with USGA tweaks and the June weather will result in a fun and fair tournament. The Am was borderline.
Title: Re: Photo Tour - Chambers Bay - US Open Edition - 1st Hole
Post by: Scott Weersing on January 21, 2015, 09:41:34 PM
So is the first green better with the changes made back in 2011 or was in 2012?

I played the course back in 2009 and the first green was fine but you could not miss to the left or you would end up in the 18th fairway.

Here is a thread about the changes: http://www.golfclubatlas.com/forum/index.php/topic,48817.0.html

And here are some photos from my trip: http://www.golfclubatlas.com/forum/index.php/topic,39125.0.html
Title: Re: Photo Tour - Chambers Bay - US Open Edition - 1st Hole
Post by: Richard Choi on January 21, 2015, 09:42:52 PM
Judge, I agree the first two days (stroke play) of US Am set up was way too severe. I think they wanted to see exactly how firm the course can get and found out that it can get WAY firmer than they would ever want to set up.

After the stroke play, the grounds crew soak the course all night, and I thought the course played almost ideal for the match play that followed. It was firm and difficult, but not unfairly so.

With the earlier date in June, I doubt that they could even get the course as firm as it was for US Am stroke play, even if they tried. However, unless we get really unlucky with weather, the course should be at its ideal firmness by mid-June.
Title: Re: Photo Tour - Chambers Bay - US Open Edition - 1st Hole
Post by: Matthew Essig on January 21, 2015, 09:44:39 PM
I am looking forward to this thread! I will try to help as much as possible, too! I have played the course and worked at the 2010 US Am.

I will start off by posting bits of a paper I wrote on the history of the site:

"After the United States Geological Survey had a chance to survey most of the land in the Pacific Northwest, they discovered something incredible. The material to the north of Chambers Creek was world-class sand and gravel. In the 1890s, the U.S. government hired the Pacific Bridge Company to mine gravel for use at all army forts along Puget Sound, forts within Washington State, and occasionally for forts located across the United States. When the forts were completed, the property was sold to gravel companies.

The mine on the property is world famous for its quality. The sand and gravel mined was as high quality and pure as it gets. This occurred due to the last ice age that glaciated the Puget Sound lowland. When the ice retreated, it left the mass deposit of sand and gravel. The sand and gravel is known as “Steilacoom Grade.” It was highly, highly desirable as it was so clean and pure. As a result, it took very little processing. The railroad continued to play an important role for the property as gravel companies used the railroad as a cost-effective way to sell the highly-desired product quickly. At one point, the mine produced more sand and gravel than any other mine in the country. A host of gravel companies that evolved through a bunch of mergers and acquisitions eventually formed Lone Star Northwest Sand and Gravel in 1959. Mining continued for another three decades.

It wasn’t until the early 1990s that the Lone Star Northwest Sand and Gravel’s mining lease ran out. Pierce County officials revealed they had something else in mind for the property. After 100 years of industrial use, Pierce County reclaimed the Chambers Creek property for the public. Today, the property is called the Chambers Creek Regional Park. On the southern bank of Chambers Creek, the Chambers Bay Marina replaces the old mills. The railroad remains, with BNSF and passenger trains passing by the park serving as a reminder of the chaotic history this piece of property has gone through in the past 400 years. A bridge over the railroad tracks allows public access to a beach that was disconnected from society since the time of the Steilacoom Tribe. A golf course is the centerpiece of the park. While golf courses are typically criticized for being hazardous overall to the environment, this particular one is special. It has won national awards for using little water, fertilizer, and preventing other environmental risks every year it has been open, and it was built using the same sand that came from the mine.

Pierce County has done a remarkable job cleaning up and recommissioning the land. With the help of Tacoma, University Place was able to grow into the town it is today, and vice-versa. The park has become one of jewels along Puget Sound, a  gem that not only meets, but surpasses the jewel that the Steilacoom Tribe saw the land as. It is so special that Pierce County pushed for national attention, and it received it. In the summer of 2015, the United States Golf Association will hold the U.S. Open at Chambers Bay. Millions of people from around the world will be able to see just how remarkable the property is."
Title: Re: Photo Tour - Chambers Bay - US Open Edition - 1st Hole
Post by: Richard Choi on January 21, 2015, 09:50:57 PM
Scott, the green is better today than when it opened. In addition to the softening of the slope in front-right, the intermediate ledge between the green and the 18th fairway was better shaped to catch more errant shots. Most putts that roll off the green should stay there and go no further.

There will still be many approach shots during US Open that hit the green and end up in the 18th fairway, but if you know how to play this hole properly, it should not be a major problem.
Title: Re: Photo Tour - Chambers Bay - US Open Edition - 1st Hole
Post by: Matthew Essig on January 21, 2015, 10:01:33 PM
Quote from: Richard Choi on January 21, 2015, 09:50:57 PM
Scott, the green is better today than when it opened. In addition to the softening of the slope in front-right, the intermediate ledge between the green and the 18th fairway was better shaped to catch more errant shots. Most putts that roll off the green should stay there and go no further.

There will still be many approach shots during US Open that hit the green and end up in the 18th fairway, but if you know how to play this hole properly, it should not be a major problem.

(http://hhgpsa.bn1303.livefilestore.com/y2p8hEBc4cPiPZRNchxMHz92TJizbgrNfx6VSfIaLsx8T9M5hTsEzItHsVLpIbeWsU4r7pX3uu2ccUZN9LcWKlTPwyWFayYmJEIuvp4dohTXTGKCATfuzmlQnd0D5QfUjELZJCZ8Z7ev1TZ9kmcuUHjkw/Hole%2001%20-%20Green%20Diagram%20%28508x800%29.jpg)

As Rich has said before, the problem with the old green was with very firm and fast conditions, a good shot was not rewarded, but severely punished by rolling all the way down the hill to the 18th fairway.

Not only was the kick board short right softened, but the swale in the left center of the green (just behind 2) was softened, too, to help keep balls from rolling uncontrollably from right to left. The green is improved with the changes.
Title: Re: Photo Tour - Chambers Bay - US Open Edition - 1st Hole
Post by: Matt Bielawa on January 21, 2015, 10:04:31 PM
Too Funny.  Rich, I was literally about to type a message saying it's about time to get rid of the pouting kitty....things are looking up!  Then I refreshed the thread, and there it was!
Title: Re: Photo Tour - Chambers Bay - US Open Edition - 1st Hole
Post by: Greg Gilson on January 23, 2015, 08:18:17 PM
Richard, I want to thank you , in advance, for undertaking this task! What a great start.

I, too, fell in love with this course during an all too short (2 round) visit a couple of years ago. I still can recall EVERY hole and that's a great recommendation coming from me.

Thanks again Richard. I'm looking forward to the walk.
Title: Re: Photo Tour - Chambers Bay - US Open Edition - 1st Hole
Post by: Dave McCollum on January 24, 2015, 12:05:55 AM
Richard,

This thread should be amusing as it evolves and more so when we get to the Open.  Take your time, Rich, do it right, and this could be the most informative guide to a US Open course ever produced because there will be so many options depending on conditions and your experience and knowledge.  The caddies, coaches and players might even look at it and thank you for your effort.  For Treehouse nuts it’s a great opportunity to showcase golf course architecture by cranking up the footlights and putting the course on the biggest stage with the best actors assembled to audition for the leading roles.  For American golf one can only hope that a steady diet of this style of golf—Pinehurst, Hoylake, CBay, TOC, WStraits, Troon, Erin Hills, etc.—opens some eyes and softens some prejudices that this style is not some antiquated, quirky British aberration of the game.  If the stars align, the players endorse it as they did at Pinehurst, the weather cooperates, and they put it on TV, maybe, just maybe, a few will notice.   (I have my doubts because as I’m typing the Golf Channel is broadcasting the Humana from Palm Springs and gushing about perfection, golf in the dome, and golfers are shooting 9 under for 9 holes, while the country shivers.)

Whatever, well done.  As you suggest, at least for the Treehouse crowd, this is your destiny.  I’m rooting for you to do it well.  For me and the rest of us, I hope we live up to the “Best Of” predictions.  This tread seems to have that potential to be really special if we listen more than we speak and only speak when we have something to say.  We’ll see how it goes.  Personally, I hope the thread stays on point, doesn’t set a cga.com world record for number of pages of narcissistic grandstanding, and retains its potential for purity of purpose—insightful information.     

I’m listening and won’t comment again.  I haven’t played the freaking course.  Let’s listen to those know her and see how real golfers try to get under her skirts.
Title: Re: Photo Tour - Chambers Bay - US Open Edition - 1st Hole
Post by: Colin Macqueen on January 24, 2015, 06:36:00 AM
Richard,

This, I think, will end up being an extraordinary thread. Your descriptions and insights will be invaluable as the likes of me watch The U.S. Open take place.   taking Dave McC. suggestion to heart  "…I will listen more than I speak and only speak when I have something to say."  As I have never played the course this will be an easy task and I will not be butting in again but will be avidly following this thread.

The thread has the potential to outshine Pat Mucci's valiant effort to describe NGLA in his "Enchanted Journey" which has gotten to Hole #8 from memory! Thanks for this effort and I suspect as others do that it will end up in the "Best of Golf" sub-section for posterity.

Thanks Colin
Title: Re: Photo Tour - Chambers Bay - US Open Edition - 1st Hole
Post by: Anthony Butler on January 24, 2015, 11:59:21 AM
Quote from: Richard Choi on January 21, 2015, 04:42:26 PM
Pete, you are correct about the dangers of the dunes. My wife fell several times during US Am. With steep slope and tall slippery fescue, the dunes can/will cause many people to slip and fall - even with golf shoes. From what I heard, USGA is limiting the ticket sales just to deal with this issue. There is enough room to host 200k spectators a day, if you really wanted to.

David, there is really no severe wind to speak of, unless there is a storm brewin'. Most likely you will see 5 to 10 mph breezes, and only in the afternoons. On most days that I play (I play very early), there is no real wind to test you. This is why firmness of the course and its flexible length will be a key to a successful US Open.

Hi Richard,

Thanks for starting this thread. I visited Chambers Bay in early December..When I think about the other courses I've been to that hosted a US Open, it sort of blows your mind to think the USGA took this on the same year they are changing broadcasters....

Probably another reason they limited ticket sales is you have to drive through a neighborhood to access the course... a two lane surface road no matter where you get off Bridgeport, which appears to be the main drag through University Place..

As an example of the existing infrastructure at Chambers Bay, the car park accommodates less than 100 cars.

I understand from talking with the assistant pro the USGA will be establishing a tent village on the dog park down near the Sound. (Right next to the working crane) This ''village" can only be accessed via a single-lane maintenance road behind the existing clubhouse. I hope Rory remembers he's on West Coast time, because it will take at least an hour just to get from the i5 exit to the course... he might have to get out and run down the hill with his golf shoes once he hits the car park.. :)

Even though there are legitimate logistical concerns, I think the event will make for great TV. As I recall the US Amateur event was fairly windy. although that was later in the summer... a 10 mph breeze would definitely make things more interesting.

 
Title: Re: Photo Tour - Chambers Bay - US Open Edition - 1st Hole
Post by: RJ_Daley on January 24, 2015, 12:32:39 PM
I'll bet AirB&B has an uptick in folks renting out bedrooms in their home in and around Chambers Bay neighborhoods!  ;D
Title: Re: Photo Tour - Chambers Bay - US Open Edition - 1st Hole
Post by: Garland Bayley on January 24, 2015, 01:30:31 PM
Quote from: Anthony Butler on January 24, 2015, 11:59:21 AM
...

Even though there are legitimate logistical concerns, I think the event will make for great TV.
...
 

After all the address of the place is 6320 Grandview Dr.
Title: Re: Photo Tour - Chambers Bay - US Open Edition - 1st Hole
Post by: Richard Choi on January 24, 2015, 06:41:46 PM
Thanks for all the encouragements. It is very much appreciated. If I can convey just a little bit of my love for this place to others here, I will be extremely satisfied.

One question for the folks. Should I keep to this thread for rest of the hole descriptions or should I start a new thread for every hole? I wasn't thinking of doing that, but Joe Perches suggested it and it might be easier for references. What do you guys think?

I am busy getting my #2 guide and it is already much longer than I thought it would be a for a relatively simple hole. I think I need to edit myself a bit more.
Title: Re: Photo Tour - Chambers Bay - US Open Edition - 1st Hole
Post by: Cliff Hamm on January 24, 2015, 07:24:21 PM
Played CB a few years back...as many have said great start to a great thread...my preference is clearly to start new threads.
Title: Re: Photo Tour - Chambers Bay - US Open Edition - 1st Hole
Post by: Greg Gilson on January 24, 2015, 07:46:20 PM
Richard, given the amount of interest already...and the discussion you are inviting...I vote for separate threads for each hole.
Title: Re: Photo Tour - Chambers Bay - US Open Edition - 1st Hole
Post by: Matthew Essig on January 24, 2015, 10:33:13 PM
You could have 18 different threads, or you could have this one thread with an index in the first post referencing page/post # for each hole.
Title: Re: Photo Tour - Chambers Bay - US Open Edition - 1st Hole
Post by: Garland Bayley on January 25, 2015, 09:18:26 PM
I prefer a single thread. Matthew has a good suggestion.
Title: Re: Photo Tour - Chambers Bay - US Open Edition - 1st Hole
Post by: Jason Thurman on January 25, 2015, 10:29:00 PM
I agree with Matthew, simply because I want to be able to easily access this resource as the tournament approaches and gets underway. It'll be much easier to do that with a single thread to search for.
Title: Re: Photo Tour - Chambers Bay - US Open Edition - 1st Hole
Post by: Matthew Essig on February 18, 2015, 03:27:47 AM
Since FOX is broadcasting this year, the local affiliate decided to do a hole by hole tour, too.

Not a huge fan of them playing the holes or how it is only 2 and a half minutes, but it is for the general public, so it will have to do.

If you don't like it, don't watch the ones coming in the following weeks. If you do like it and/or you do find that they add a little something to Richard's superb analysis, they are shown every Sunday. I will try to remember to post the links.

http://q13fox.com/2015/02/15/u-s-open-hole-by-hole-preview-hole-1-chambers-bay-golf-links/

And Gil Hanse's tour:

http://www.foxsports.com/golf/usga/video?vid=453456451892
Title: Re: Photo Tour - Chambers Bay - US Open Edition - 1st Hole
Post by: Richard Choi on June 16, 2015, 12:57:29 PM
I watched the greens on this hole yesterday very closely.


When USGA lost the course for the stroke play, this was the hole where it was most obvious. Even a well struck shot that landed 20 yards short of the green was running through the green and ended up way in the back 50 yards from the green.


That was certainly not the case yesterday.The ball that landed just short of the green stayed in the front half of the green. More distressingly, I saw a collegiate player hit a ball from about 180 in the rough that landed just below the front right bunker. I said "nice shot" expecting the ball to release gently to the pin in the middle. Amazingly, the ball stayed stuck below the bunker in the fairway. I have NEVER seen this before even during everyday play.


If this course plays this soft, much of what I have discussed above can be ignored.


When playing as a par 5, none of the players carried the rise in the fairway about 350 yards away. When playing as a par 4, players hit some bombs over it. Any thing that landed beyond the rise got about 40 to 60 yard roll. Bubba Watson hit a driver and a 9 iron to reach the green. Not bad for a 500+ yard par 4.
Title: Re: Photo Tour - Chambers Bay - US Open Edition - 1st Hole
Post by: Kalen Braley on June 19, 2015, 05:44:31 PM
Rich,
I haven't had time yet to watch it today.  How are things logistically with the tee box back by the snack shack as a par 5?.  Seems like they'd have to clear out a relatively large area for safety of everyone including those on the practice green and those coming around to the front of the shack.
So far its been totally awesome to watch on the tube, brings back some fond memories of the place.
P.S.  Greens look to be in rough condition compared to a typical PGA event.  Whats been the feedback down in the trenches?
 
Title: Re: Photo Tour - Chambers Bay - US Open Edition - 1st Hole
Post by: Richard Choi on June 19, 2015, 06:37:13 PM
Kalen, the are between the tee and grandstand does not have any standing area so crowd control is no issue.


As to greens... you must not be reading much.
Title: Re: Photo Tour - Chambers Bay - US Open Edition - 1st Hole
Post by: Richard Choi on June 21, 2015, 03:42:56 PM
I absolutely LOVE  how the first hole is setup today for the final round.

The tee has been moved up to the sand tees (450 yards), which means most players will have 120 or less to the pin with how the fairways are rolling. In fact, the longest hitters have less than 100 yards to the pin.

However, the pin is located in a precarious spot in the front mere steps away from the severe drop on the left.

I actually believe, it is a much easier approach, if you leave your drive further back in the middle of the fairway where you can use the contour if the front of the green to feed the ball to the pin without much risk.

If you bomb it to the bottom, although you have a lob wedge shot, any fat or tugged shot will end up in the bottom left 60 yards away. The angle is not favorable at all.

It realm reminds me of the third hole at the ANGC the way it is set up. A really fantastic risk/reward hole today.
Title: Re: Photo Tour - Chambers Bay - US Open Edition - 1st Hole
Post by: Richard Choi on June 21, 2015, 04:17:25 PM
BTW, Chris Kirk missed his approach to the left.

It took him five shots to end up on the green as his first four shots were short and came right back to his feet.

He ended up playing even for the rest of his round. Go figure...
Title: Re: Photo Tour - Chambers Bay - US Open Edition - 1st Hole
Post by: Dave McCollum on June 29, 2015, 09:13:43 PM
Long after this thread has entered it’s Rip Van Winkle phase, I just like to say how much it enhanced my enjoyment of the US Open.  Thanks, Rich.  I didn’t follow it for the grueling, nearly 5 months, it took to construct.  Instead, I put it in the cellar, among the cobwebs and spiders, and waited in anticipation for the moment my aged attention span could retain the information long enough to use it for a special occasion.  I dug it on Monday of Open week.  Clearly, it was the best TV golf I ever saw, thanks mostly to you (and liberal use of DVR fast forward and mute buttons).