Golf Club Atlas
GolfClubAtlas.com => Golf Course Architecture Discussion Group => Topic started by: Ben Stephens on September 09, 2012, 03:50:23 AM
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Following the completion of BUDA X
Firstly I would like to congratulate the ROW team for making an amazing comeback in the last day superbly lead by Captain Mayhugh and in form Michael 'Tiger' Whittaker who had the most wins during the week. The GB&I team were lead very well by Captain Boon which unfortunately are still recovering from the shock of the strong fightback from the Yanks (hope this is not the same at the Ryder Cup)
Thank you to Mark 'Canary' Pearce for organising a fantastic event on a wonderful and challenging golf course which deserves to be higher in the majority of rankings - its isoloated location is its only downfall. Mark - I was a bit disappointed that you showed a lack of 'yellow' awareness in you attire but can see your influence on many other in choosing a 'yellow' ball!! :)
It was great to see old and new faces putting the face to the name. One of the highlights was Eric Smith dancing to the U2 tribute band under the influence of cider with 9.4% alcohol and yet went to St Andrews the following few days and shot 39 on the front nine!!
I would like to open up a thread for suggestions for a venue for BUDA XI
It can be one or two courses (if the one is really special like Silloth) and the date could be June rather than September.
There were a number of suggestions at BUDA X for next year's venue they are:
a) Kington
b) Huntercombe
c) Hunstanton/Brancaster
d) Woodhall Spa/Seacroft
e) Ganton
f) IRELAND
g) HOLLAND (Netherlands)
h) FRANCE (possibly Le Touquet and Hardelot)
............ the list is endless. Thats the joy of being a GCA'er!
Cheers
Ben
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Ben (and others),
There are a few good suggestions floating around. However, before we drift off into a discussion of idealistic BUDA possibilities, there awesome realities that need to be addressed.
Hosting BUDA asks a lot of the home course (courses). We have been lucky in recent years, with Silloth being the latest of a run of clubs which have not just been willing to have us, but have welcomed us with open arms. For that, it helps to have some local contacts. There was a general feeling that it is important that BUDA is organised by someone who understands the BUDA ethos and knows how BUDA works. That doesn't mean we need a BUDA veteran but certainly someone who has participated in a BUDA. There's more organising goes into these things than some think (as I found out this year).
I think a Netherlands/Belgian BUDA would be great but don't see an obvious organiser. I'd love to see one of the Low Countries GCAers at BUDA next year, as a possible precursor to BUDA XII. Similarly, I don't see anyone with the contacts to organise a French BUDA, though would be happy to be corrected. My impression from previous discussions is that Hunstanton/Brancaster would be a struggle for tee times at Brancaster, though it might be worth investigating.
I hadn't heard Ganton mentioned but, actually, could see that working with some planning. The trick, as always, would be the organiser. What we need is someone to step forward with a plan that has been investigated and to take on the reins. I know of at least one person at BUDA X who was oing to go away and make some calls. If anyone else wants to step forward then they should feel free to post their proposal and we can see where we go. Remember that last year plans for both Liphook/Hankley and Silloth were well advanced, so we ended up settling BUDAs IX and X last year!
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Is a nearby beer festival (with or without a tribute band) an essential pre-requisite?
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Ben (and others),
There are a few good suggestions floating around. However, before we drift off into a discussion of idealistic BUDA possibilities, there awesome realities that need to be addressed.
Hosting BUDA asks a lot of the home course (courses). We have been lucky in recent years, with Silloth being the latest of a run of clubs which have not just been willing to have us, but have welcomed us with open arms. For that, it helps to have some local contacts. There was a general feeling that it is important that BUDA is organised by someone who understands the BUDA ethos and knows how BUDA works. That doesn't mean we need a BUDA veteran but certainly someone who has participated in a BUDA. There's more organising goes into these things than some think (as I found out this year).
I think a Netherlands/Belgian BUDA would be great but don't see an obvious organiser. I'd love to see one of the Low Countries GCAers at BUDA next year, as a possible precursor to BUDA XII. Similarly, I don't see anyone with the contacts to organise a French BUDA, though would be happy to be corrected. My impression from previous discussions is that Hunstanton/Brancaster would be a struggle for tee times at Brancaster, though it might be worth investigating.
I hadn't heard Ganton mentioned but, actually, could see that working with some planning. The trick, as always, would be the organiser. What we need is someone to step forward with a plan that has been investigated and to take on the reins. I know of at least one person at BUDA X who was oing to go away and make some calls. If anyone else wants to step forward then they should feel free to post their proposal and we can see where we go. Remember that last year plans for both Liphook/Hankley and Silloth were well advanced, so we ended up settling BUDAs IX and X last year!
Mark,
I have dealt with Bob Carrick the secretary of Hunstanton Golf Club and go there every year thanks to the East Anglian Spring Foursomes in April and Grafton Morrish in October. Recently I got a letter if I was interested in becoming a country member :) I am familar with the Hotel accomodation in Hunstanton having experienced a number of different hotels and B+B - the Le Strange Arms is the best bet to accomodate all. There is a great curry house with the hottest Jalfreezi that Mr Boon and I ever had!
Brancaster is a hurdle that we can try and make to convince them with foursomes in the morning and possibly singles in the afternoon after all it is a two ball club (with three balls with the secretary's permission) Chappers is the best person to deal with Brancaster (I think).
It can be done in the next 3 or 4 years and gives everyone an opportunity to play two wonderful links courses! Firstly I would prefer to allow others to put forward a bid and let the majority choose the most popular bid.
Ganton would be awesome!! John and I briefly talked about it
Cheers
Ben
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Isn't Hunstanton also a 2-ball club?
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Isn't Hunstanton also a 2-ball club?
It is and they allow 4 balls on Tuesdays only as advertised on their website - http://www.hunstantongolfclub.com/
I can ask whether greensomes will be acceptable with foursomes in one day and 2 rounds of fourballs on a Tuesday.
Cheers
Ben
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I'd potentially be up for organising a Hardelot/Le Touquet Buda in the first week of August. If the masses wanted to go there.
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I've only participated in one day of BUDA in my life but if you wish me (probably along with veterans Muldoon & Hiseman) to organise one for Carne / Enniscrone / Strandhill then I'd be delighted... May I suggest that 2014 might be the year for that though... We'll have the new 9 well & truly up and running and hopefully integrated by that time... Just shout and I will oblige... Ally
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I was planning on Ireland for next year on my own and was hoping to get lucky with an Irish BUDA, but ...
For a low low low fee, I could be persuaded to offer my translation services for France. Et oui! Especially when I look at the airfares to Ireland from the West Coast at the moment. That's assuming you still accept "virgin" attendees, as I've never been to a BUDA.
However, there are a couple of requirements: 1) all will be required to attend a L.O.S.C. game in Lille and will cheer my boys, 2) you will try escargots and like it. Other than that, I can butter my own croissants ... thank you.
So a vote here for Ireland ... or France.
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Firstly, let me add my congratulations to Mark for his superb organisation of BUDA X, and particularly his choice of the venue. The golf course at Silloth is superb--particularly for match play--and the hospitality shown to us by the club was equal to the very high standards of all previous events.
Secondly, let me put forward a case for Ireland--specifically Donegal:
1. Great golf
2. Great craic
3. Guinness
4. Numerous pre/post BUDA play options
5. Well kent place, particularly by one of Donegal's finest sons (Donal O'Ceallaigh) and less so by me and I'm sure others
Thirdly, let me put forward a specific candidate that I know well--Ballyliffin (I know that Donal will have some other ideas and hopefully chip in with those in time).
1. Two intersting courses (Old and Glashedy)
2. Chance to compare and contrast old (Hackett) and new (Ruddy)
3. Numerous fine hotels within 1 mile from the golf courses
4. Short ferry ride to Portrush (in season)
5. I know ex-Club Captain and local Grandee (my wife's uncle)
Fourthly, some thoughts on timing:
1. We have had successful BUDAs in both early and late summer
2. Late summer usually gives better (i.e. faster and firmer) conditions, at the expense of daylight
3. Next year, early summer (~June 15) will bring us the US Open at Merion
plus--opportunity for great late night pub viewing (as per the Lundin/Elie BUDA)
minus--US players may want to stay at home to watch
4. Next year, the Walker Cup will be played Sep 7-8 at NGLA
plus--great chance to watch the event on the BBC/RTE (no commercials, completely unbiased coverage ::))
minus--US players may want to stay at home to watch
Fifthly, comments? Please!
Rich
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Ireland? Wouldn't miss it!
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I haven't played in Ireland and can't think of a better way to visit than with the Buda Cuppers.
Since next year is bracketed by the USOpen at Merion and the Walker Cup at NGLA (my situation is complicated by the necessity of being at Merion in June and a strong desire to be at NGLA in September) is a mid-summer date possible - perhaps in the weeks between the USOpen and the end of the UK school year or the end of August?
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I haven't played in Ireland and can't think of a better way to visit than with the Buda Cuppers.
Since next year is bracketed by the USOpen at Merion and the Walker Cup at NGLA (my situation is complicated by the necessity of being at Merion in June and a strong desire to be at NGLA in September) is a mid-summer date possible - perhaps in the weeks between the USOpen and the end of the UK school year or the end of August?
Second the motion (if there is one)!
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I'm in either way, even for a flight to Ireland. The only thing I would recommend against is do France in August, it is very crowded as all the French are having their vacation then.
I could one day see myself taking a stab at organising something, but need a good venue for that.
Ulrich
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Carne and Enniscrone would be a great double header and I'd be happy to help Ally with the arrangements, being a member at Carne. 2014 is best as Ally mentioned.
For a lower key, low cost, but high quirk quota, how about Kington and Church Stretton?
Or Machrihanish and Mach Dunes?
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Ben,
I was playing the drums. ;D
Just did a Machrihanish and Machrihanish Dunes trip and would go back in a heartbeat. A special corner of the world for sure. Honestly though, all options on the table would make great BUDA venues. Will follow the discussion with great interest.
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I am willing to look into Kington and possibly Church Stretton BUDA with a few conditions.
1. There must be strong support from Pests/wannabe Pests.
2. I will only organize a weekend Buda. If the club says it can't happen or Pests aren't interested I am out on the organizing front.
3. It can't be in June. September likely date though could be July or August - maybe even May.
Ciao
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I’ve been waiting for this as having the world’s largest and third largest sporting events held within 2miles of your home is just no substitute for a good BUDA.
As many of you no doubt are fully aware, I would love to see an Irish Buda. Earlier this year I dropped into Co. Sligo GC and they were most helpful and made a fantastic offer. However despite the evident hospitality promised, we wouldn’t be truly on the ‘inside’, and that does help make the events extra special.
Ballyliffen being one site with two courses is a strong contender.
But because I haven’t made there and that we have a members new holes to play, I’ll cast my vote for Carne/Enniscrone in 2014.
That still leave’s 2012 and it’s wonderful to have so many fine options to consider. Most intriguing to me is the chance to play Kington more than once at a BUDA style event. Everything I’ve heard suggests this is Quirk of the highest order and the way we choose to play holes on the first round may be radically changed by the third. Church Streton also sounds intriguing
I would be happy to help with the load organising any of these options.
Going forward I’d also like to see
2015 Somewhere on the European Mainland (let’s make this happen)
2016 Woodhall Spa / Seacoft. Intersting combination of inland and links.
2017 Ballyliffen
2021 Co Sligo.
All agreed?
;)
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"2015 Somewhere on the European Mainland (let’s make this happen)"
Tony M. -
A BUDA on the links of Holland (Kenmer? Hague?) would certainly be of interest to me.
DT
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I think there's a danger in trying to plan too far ahead. As far as I can see, there are two possible hats thrown into the ring for 2013 - Rich/Donal (Donegal) and Sean (Kington). If anyone else has a serious option for next year, let us all know this week. Otherwise, I suggest we choose between those two (the technical details of the selection process will, I imagine, always remain a mystery). In 2014 we may be able to choose between Carne, Woodhall Spa (though I remain to be convinced this isn't pie in the sky), the Low Country (this would be fantastic but may take some planning) and others.
I don't, for what it's worth, believe there's any reason why we couldn't go to Ireland two years running.
As to my preference for the two firm suggestions for next year, I'm torn. I love Kington and think it would make for a great BUDA but I have never played golf in Ireland and that's a big gap in the golfing education. Both would, I think, be great BUDAs and I'd support either. Perhaps enquiries should be made regarding both?
As to timing, I don't have a preference between June and September. I think August in the UK would be tricky, as would late July. If we need to avoid both US Openand Walker Cup, then late June/early July might work but my instinct is that we would just have to choose the lesser of the two evils and accept that some may not be able to make it as a result.
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Sounds sensible Mark.
But I do urge you to keep in mind that Robin & I believe we could organise you a very cheap and varied trip to Carne & Enniscrone for 2014. I don't believe it likely that you will travel to the north west of Ireland two years in a row. The extended trip could easily take in Co.Sligo and the Donegal courses (or indeed vice-versa if that is the choice of the group).
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Unless I'm severely misjudging the usual BUDA crowd and their sentiments, the Carne/Enniscrone offer is basically a done deal. It's only a question of when you guys say you can put it on. If 2013 doesn't work, then we'll do it in 2014.
Personally, I think there is room for two BUDAs in the North West of Ireland. Donegal and Narin & Portnoo for one, Carne and Enniscrone the other. That still leaves courses like Strand Hill, Rosses Point and Cruit Island for Post- or Pre-BUDA play.
Ulrich
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Ally,
Like Ulrich, I really think we could do consecutive Irish trips. However, I think with BUDA that the key factor is whether the overseas team would make the journey(s), so I'd welcome input from American BUDAites on whether Ireland two years running might work. My feeling is that most of the usual suspects from the UK would be more than happy to make both trips.
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Gentlemen,
As a newbie, not yet been to a BUDA but living in, knowing my way around and being a member of THE best links course in The Netherlands. I'm happy to offer my humble services. If only a veteran can be entrusted with responsibility for organizing then there is always the option of having that veteran do so with the help of a local (newbie in this case) contact. The Hague might be tough for this type of thing as they don't love groups but Noordwijkse/Kennemer (one of my best friends is a member at Kennemer) might be an option to impress all of you and perhaps have you sent home in shambles after a severe but extremely fun links beating from Noordwijkse. Kennemer would offer a touch of refrain perhaps although not too much. I do note that the KLM Open returns to Kennemer next year in the beginning of September.
Just an option so you know it is there, since it's been mentioned.
Would be happy to welcome you all and do battle with a sizeable home court advantage.
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I reckon we could fix up some weekend play on a Carne/Enniscrone ticket, though of course it depends upon club schedules. All a bit immaterial unless our American cousins express an interest, so over to you chaps.
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I reckon we could fix up some weekend play on a Carne/Enniscrone ticket, though of course it depends upon club schedules. All a bit immaterial unless our American cousins express an interest, so over to you chaps.
Two thumbs up!
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It seems that 2014 is more or less fixed at Carne/Enniscrone ;D
Could this be the first BUDA with teams being lead by Golf Course Architects? Ally for ROW and Robin for GB+I
Nothing has been decided yet for 2013 venue for BUDA XI which is a big GCA year due to
US Open - Merion
Open - Muirfield
Walker Cup - NGLA
BUDA XI - ??
Cheers
Ben
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Giles (and maybe Philip) said he would be happy to host next year's BUDA at Huntercombe it would work keeping the single course element.
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+1 Huntercombe 2013. Could it get any better than that?
Ulrich
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I've only participated in one day of BUDA in my life but if you wish me (probably along with veterans Muldoon & Hiseman) to organise one for Carne / Enniscrone / Strandhill then I'd be delighted... May I suggest that 2014 might be the year for that though... We'll have the new 9 well & truly up and running and hopefully integrated by that time... Just shout and I will oblige... Ally
That would be an excellent option...
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It seems that 2014 is more or less fixed at Carne/Enniscrone ;D
Could this be the first BUDA with teams being lead by Golf Course Architects? Ally for ROW and Robin for GB+I
Nothing has been decided yet for 2013 venue for BUDA XI which is a big GCA year due to
US Open - Merion
Open - Muirfield
Walker Cup - NGLA
BUDA XI - ??
Cheers
Ben
...except that Ally is as Scottish and hence as British as they come (at least until after the BUDA in 2014 if Mr. Salmond get his way), so he should, by rights, be the GB & I skipper.
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I need to check course availability for Huntercombe - which I am doing.
One possible fly in the ointment is the cost of accomodation in Henley (I don't think that we would want to stay in Wallingford). The hotels are not cheap - if we want one central point - the alternative would be to use B&Bs and base ourselves in one pub/bar.
Plus side - plenty of good places to eat or drink, although I can't promise a beer festival.
I will update on progress as soon as I make any.
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It seems that 2014 is more or less fixed at Carne/Enniscrone ;D
Could this be the first BUDA with teams being lead by Golf Course Architects? Ally for ROW and Robin for GB+I
Nothing has been decided yet for 2013 venue for BUDA XI which is a big GCA year due to
US Open - Merion
Open - Muirfield
Walker Cup - NGLA
BUDA XI - ??
Cheers
Ben
...except that Ally is as Scottish and hence as British as they come (at least until after the BUDA in 2014 if Mr. Salmond get his way), so he should, by rights, be the GB & I skipper.
As a bit of a new face amongst BUDA ranks, I most certainly am not the right person to skipper (although you would be Mr.Hiseman)... I much prefer to organise festivities and then skulk around in the background... Although I'd be more than happy - as I'm sure Eamon Mangan would also - to give a low-down on the development of the new nine at the dinner.
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Personally, I'd go anywhere if I can fit it into the schedule, England, Ireland, Scotland, France....
However, I see there is a need to promote your local venues so I will give a couple more strong arguments for The Netherlands (Holland).
British pound high, dollar high - euro low. Not that you fellas are in need of watching pennies or pence a smart investor plays the currencies in their favor while they can.
Logistics - all cheap airlines fly into Amsterdam. US airlines fly direct into Amsterdam in most cases. Courses are 20 minutes from the airport (Noordwijkse, Kennemer, Royal Hague). Ryanair even flies into Eindhoven (1.5 hour drive to Noordwijk/Amsterdam)
Accommodation choices may be either Amsterdam (30 minutes from the courses) or Noordwijk aan Zee (which is a beach town). Noordwijk aan Zee is 10 minutes from Noordwijk and 30 minutes from Kennemer. (20 from Royal Hague).
Cuisine (while I'm sure it can be argued in some circles, nothing beats haggis or other high end island cuisine) - The Netherlands is going to blow away any of the competition I've seen in this area. (I'll personally make sure of that). That being said as I've already shared with Ally the best food I've ever had at a golf course in the UK or Ireland was at Carne.
Adult beverages - Heineken, Amstel, jenever, Hoogaarden, Wiekse Witte, Duvel, Ketel 1 and whatever imports that may interest you.
Non-golf entertainment - hard to beat Amsterdam I suppose (although I sure this would not be of interest to many) Always nice to combine great golf and architecture with some mild site seeing.
Links and heathland options. Great play for extra days.
Option to throw in Belgium as well. Although not worth the drive and commute for a short trip to NL in my opinion as there is enough great courses here close by.
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Nordwijkse and Kennemer sounds great to me as well, especially if Royal Hague can be a post or pre BUDA option (don't know their visitor policy). The cuisine argument ... well ... I'm not completely sold on that! Suffice it to say that gastronomically the Netherlands isn't Belgium, but if you survived Fish & Chips, then a Pannekoekenhuis should do you ok :)
Ulrich
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I like the idea that BUDA (more often than not) takes me to courses that I might not have visited otherwise: Liphook, Hankley Common, Silloth, Littlestone, Elie, Lundin Links, Southerndown, Pennard, etc.
With that in mind, I love the idea of visiting some links/heathland courses on the other side of the channel. If that is what happens I'll be there. Huntercombe, however, is a FABULOUS location for a BUDA... for me it represents the quintessential example of how to construct a great course on an average piece of land. As I've said many times, no golf course architect should be allow to design a course without having spent a week at Huntercombe. As for accommodations, there are options galore if one thinks outside the box... consider all the options within a £10 taxi ride and the problem is solved, I think. Also, there are a LOT of quality courses within reasonable striking distance from Huntercombe.
I vote for Carne/Enniscrone for 2014. Nothing could be finer.
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Nordwijkse and Kennemer sounds great to me as well, especially if Royal Hague can be a post or pre BUDA option (don't know their visitor policy). The cuisine argument ... well ... I'm not completely sold on that! Suffice it to say that gastronomically the Netherlands isn't Belgium, but if you survived Fish & Chips, then a Pannekoekenhuis should do you ok :)
Ulrich
Ulrich, I agree, Belgium IMO has the best food in the world. All the benefits of French influence with the Belgian's take on the relaxed and endless enjoys of eating and drinking superb food and wine.
I will personally guarantee the quality of food for this trip and it won't be fish & chips and certainly not pancake houses no more than a trip to Germany would entail wurst and sauerkraut. (not that there is anything wrong with that, I a big fan of German food as well). Standard Dutch food hardly exists but the ethnic kitchens here are fantastic as are the # of places with French and Belgian influence. However you have to know where you are going.
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I vote for Carne/Enniscrone for 2014. Nothing could be finer.
Say no more...
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I vote for Carne/Enniscrone for 2014. Nothing could be finer.
Say no more...
As it happens I was talking to the good folks at Carne this afternoon and mentioned this in passing.
They'd be most delighted to accommodate us all. Weekend play is surely possible and during most times of the year so you can take this as a done deal should you want to. Robin & I can iron out the details later.
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Personally, I'd go anywhere if I can fit it into the schedule, England, Ireland, Scotland, France....
However, I see there is a need to promote your local venues so I will give a couple more strong arguments for The Netherlands (Holland).
British pound high, dollar high - euro low. Not that you fellas are in need of watching pennies or pence a smart investor plays the currencies in their favor while they can.
Logistics - all cheap airlines fly into Amsterdam. US airlines fly direct into Amsterdam in most cases. Courses are 20 minutes from the airport (Noordwijkse, Kennemer, Royal Hague). Ryanair even flies into Eindhoven (1.5 hour drive to Noordwijk/Amsterdam)
Accommodation choices may be either Amsterdam (30 minutes from the courses) or Noordwijk aan Zee (which is a beach town). Noordwijk aan Zee is 10 minutes from Noordwijk and 30 minutes from Kennemer. (20 from Royal Hague).
Cuisine (while I'm sure it can be argued in some circles, nothing beats haggis or other high end island cuisine) - The Netherlands is going to blow away any of the competition I've seen in this area. (I'll personally make sure of that). That being said as I've already shared with Ally the best food I've ever had at a golf course in the UK or Ireland was at Carne.
Adult beverages - Heineken, Amstel, jenever, Hoogaarden, Wiekse Witte, Duvel, Ketel 1 and whatever imports that may interest you.
Non-golf entertainment - hard to beat Amsterdam I suppose (although I sure this would not be of interest to many) Always nice to combine great golf and architecture with some mild site seeing.
Links and heathland options. Great play for extra days.
Option to throw in Belgium as well. Although not worth the drive and commute for a short trip to NL in my opinion as there is enough great courses here close by.
David, my business involves importing plants so you can imagine I’m very familiar with Holland and love visiting. I need no convincing as to the quality of the hospitality , food, architecture etc.
As Mark suggested in an earlier post I think you will be able to devise a better BUDA once you’ve played in one yourself and met the gang. Typically there’s a hard core of about a dozen faces who turn up wherever they’re summoned to; and another score who play in it regularly when they can. Add to this a few who join each year because the venue is close at hand or it fits with other plans they’ve made. It makes for a very loose relaxed group who share a common affinity for fine golf and socialising.
There’s clearly an appetite within the group to take it Europe and as you say it’s as easy for the US contingent to fly into Schipol as it is to anywhere in GB. It will be amusing if they are offered cheaper flights - with a change at Heathrow! I’d be happy to help you organise this.
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I worry that a Holland BUDA wouldn't be any fun.
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I worry that a Holland BUDA wouldn't be any fun.
You should worry about a Dutch BUDA. You should worry that you might not survive Amsterdam.
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I worry that a Holland BUDA wouldn't be any fun.
Bone dry Eric. :)
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I have never , never seen Mr. Candyman Smith without a shiteatin grin on his face so his timid, timorous fears regarding Holland I jut ain't buyin.
In addition to beer and golf the third triumverate , babes, are available in Amsterdam. I like it but also....
I can all but guarantee my attendance either there at Huntercombe where I could slash thru some of those great courses surrounding London which are a gap in my portfolio
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I worry that a Holland BUDA wouldn't be any fun.
Bone dry Eric. :)
Eric,
Theres the red light district in Amsterdam, many fine quality dutch lagers plus clogs!!
Plenty to do in the Netherlands - the future is bright the future's orange!!
Cheers
Ben
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I have never , never seen Mr. Candyman Smith without a shiteatin grin on his face so his timid, timorous fears regarding Holland I jut ain't buyin.
In addition to beer and golf the third triumverate , babes, are available in Amsterdam. I like it but also....
I can all but guarantee my attendance either there at Huntercombe where I could slash thru some of those great courses surrounding London which are a gap in my portfolio
Wardo,
I'm sorry but Mr Smith was unable to last the pace at BUDA this year and cried off the final day's singles, citing exhaustion. If he can't cope with the sleepy Cumbrian town of Silloth then fears for his health in Ansterdam must be very, very real.
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Mark
I will take him under my wing at this years Dixie Cup and begin him on a strict and comprehensive training regimen for next year
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Mark
I will take him under my wing at this years Dixie Cup and begin him on a strict and comprehensive training regimen for next year
Thank you. A responsible thing to do.
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Wardo,
I'm sorry but Mr Smith was unable to last the pace at BUDA this year and cried off the final day's singles, citing exhaustion. If he can't cope with the sleepy Cumbrian town of Silloth then fears for his health in Ansterdam must be very, very real.
In my defense, counselor, I had played 11 rounds in 7 days. With plenty of Belhaven sprinkled in between. Of course, I say this without expectation of sympathy from this august body. :)
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Guys,
Not to second guess how extremely difficult of a group you all are, how fussy and perfectionistic I'm certain your expectation are and how decadent your golf tastes are, I've organized so many golf trips to The Netherlands, Scotland, Ireland, US and any other place for myself and other people that I know struggle to appreciate anything but their very specific wishes that I'm certain a couple chats with one of your senior respected veterans and knowing your very specific wishes, dietary requirements and allergy afflictions it's basically a no brainer.
As for fun, seriously if you can't have fun in The Netherlands I'm seriously concerned and I've not even started to sell things like the Red Light District, coffee shops etc etc which are not for everyone, but if that's what the group wants that's fine, I won't judge. It's not my thing but you wouldn't be the first non-stag, stag party I've survived. I honor the Vegas rule here, what happens in Amsterdam stays in Amsterdam.
As mentioned the group would not have to stay in Amsterdam either. Noordwijk is brilliant if the festivities only amount to adult beverages and R&R plus a speech or two from an industry expert.
I don't care what year it happens as the only thing in it for me is getting to meet all the attendants and be a good host which I very much enjoy. On the other side, it's nicer to offer to arrange first and give a good time to others as the new guy rather than just take from someone that's been already doing it for years.
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David,
I was obviously kidding about the fun. Yours is a BUDA that has to happen! Take Tony Muldoon's advice - allow him to assist you in this endeavor and with that nod of diplomacy my guess is you're well on your way towards an XI tattoo on your shoulder. If the dates work, I'd love to come. Especially if Wardo would shepherd me and allow me to learn his ways.
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We had the EIGCA conference in Noordwijk in 2008 and it was a lot of fun. Can't see how it would be anything but a good spot to go. Golf courses are great too...
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David,
I was obviously kidding about the fun. Yours is a BUDA that has to happen! Take Tony Muldoon's advice - allow him to assist you in this endeavor and with that nod of diplomacy my guess is you're well on your way towards an XI tattoo on your shoulder. If the dates work, I'd love to come. Especially if Wardo would shepherd me and allow me to learn his ways.
Thanks Eric, I couldn't of guessed ;-) I also responded with a touch of sarcasm for the record. Plus I'm not trying to run any show, just offering to host to ensure a great time since I have the ability to do so and connections with the clubs and powers that be here in NL.
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I will leave others to settle the location for 2013 and it is hard to argue about Buda going to Ireland, but if it is not next year then i hope it is not too long before the group takes up David Davis on his offer to take the group to the Netherlands. I think Kennemer/Noordewijk/Royal Hague are a great selection of courses, not to mention some of the heathland style inland courses. Netherlands is definitely a dark horse and i would be amazed if anyone regretted visiting there. As for Huntercombe, happy to help Giles if that is where people want to go. I am sure Mike is right about accommodation.
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Gentlemen,
I've only 3 Buda Cups under my belt so am no expert, but I'd say its heart is in Great Britain (perhaps some post Olympics patriotism coming to the fore again). Therefore, and for various practical reasons also, my personal preference would be for any overseas Buda to be in alternate years rather than back to back. For instance next year at say Huntercombe, then Ireland, then say Machridhanish, then Holland. I'm not saying I'm not keen to travel, just that there are plenty of years ahead of us and we should spread the fun and stay true to the cups roots? Or am I being a miserable, tight, stick in the mud? ;)
Please go back to discussing the finer points of the entertainment in Amsterdam... ;D
Cheers,
James
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Or am I being a miserable, tight, stick in the mud?
No, you're just younger than some of us, who wonder if they'll ever make it to the Netherlands :)
Ulrich
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Or am I being a miserable, tight, stick in the mud?
No, you're just younger than some of us, who wonder if they'll ever make it to the Netherlands :)
Ulrich
Amen, brother!
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Or am I being a miserable, tight, stick in the mud?
No, you're just younger than some of us, who wonder if they'll ever make it to the Netherlands :)
Ulrich
;D
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Looks like the shortlist for 2013 are:
Huntercombe (single course) - Giles Payne and Philip Gawith
Holland (Noordwijk and Kennemer and possibly Royal Hague) - David Davis and Tony Muldoon
Other nominations can be added
2014 is more or less confirmed as there is a strong majority for - Carne and Enniscrone - Ally McIntosh and Robin Hiseman
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Ben,
Actually I reckon the two firm options for 2013 are Rich and Donal's potential Donegal gig and David's Dutch offering. If and when Giles confirms that Huntercombe is a real option we can throw that into the mix. Agreed that Carne looks quite likely in 2014 but experience suggests that we're better off making sure we have a venue for 2013 before we look too far into the future.
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One of my mates has just joined National Golf Links, how about an away event!!
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One of my mates has just joined National Golf Links, how about an away event!!
Thank you for pitching in with that one Mark but it looks like the earliest he can organise it will be 2025, as Boony wants more home Buda's.
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I'm very sorry I couldn't trump captain Boonster, I'll inform the member to keep 2025 free for Buda XXIV :'(
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I know this is a joke but, for what it's worth, NGLA would be a dreadful BUDA venue for two reasons. It's on the wrong continent and it's on just about everybody's bucket list.
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When we played an 8 a side match at Chicago Golf Club a couple of years ago the percentage of their members playing was like us fielding a team of 65!
Mark - picking a team could be a valuable proposition for the captains.
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I don't have strong opinions about future venues - seems that anywhere being proposed would be great in terms of the golf.
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seems that anywhere being proposed would be great in terms of the golf.
John I think everyone pretty much feels that but whats needed is for people to identify their slight preferences or we'll never come to a conclusion ;)
It's great we have so many strong contenders, any one else have any slight preferences?
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seems that anywhere being proposed would be great in terms of the golf.
John I think everyone pretty much feels that but whats needed is for people to identify their slight preferences or we'll never come to a conclusion ;)
Amen
Ciao
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Having only been a one-off BUDA attendant, my preference should hold no weight...
Clearly I'd love - as Robin would - to see it come to Mayo / Sligo in 2014 and therefore I'd like to see it go elsewhere in 2013... I think the Holland offer is a very strong one: It gets people to an area that is often overlooked, even by this group. But I can assure you that the golf is absolutely top-notch and extremely varied... Kennemer, Noordwisjke and Royal Hague are all very different courses.... Plus you're by the beach... and it might even be sunny...
David sounded like a well connected person so if he could manage to put a date and approximate cost on the table then I can't see that it would make anything other than a wonderful weekend...
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Any of the locations mentioned sound fine to me, but since this is a BUDA I think the final decision should be up to the UKers. For me it's easier to get to London area than either Ireland or Amsterdam. More important are the dates - June is better; the first half of September a no-no next year. If the dates are OK and the prices aren't too outrageous then any of the sites would be fine with this ROWer.
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I agree with Bryan. The deciding factor for most BUDAites will be the dates, providing the cost isn't outrageous, which it has never been in the past.
It will not be possible to accommodate all interested parties with respect to date. Some of us will howl and cry. Tough luck, the clubs set the dates.
So I think for the various proposals on the table, if we could hear a date and rough schedule, then "slight preferences" will become a lot stronger :)
Ulrich
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if we could hear a date
My preference (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XQf9dtrc26A)
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Just a quick update from my side. Working on dates. BUDA group size dictates that by all the old clubs here I need to turn in official request forms to the club managers even if I'm just trying to get a date option. This is not the US or UK where they will just give you an answer and estimate if you call (although I'm not sure that one of the old private clubs there would do that either for a group this size.)
I will keep you all informed about the Dutch option as it progresses with the help of Tony and Mark who have given all the details and requirements.
I do have an excellent speaker who would love to address the group in Frank Pont who is also a GCA'er. Like the rest of you he too needs dates. The ball is in my court so I just need to get past those 8 ft tall defenders. have to ask a little patience as I'm dealing with Dutch bureaucracy at this stage.
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Just a quick update so that no one thinks I'm not on top of this ;-)
I sat down for coffee with our manager yesterday. He acknowledges receipt of my request and said it will be Mid November before I can get an answer in terms of dates. This has to do with their annual planning. Again a group this size has to fit into all kinds of restrictions. We have club sponsors that get first dibs as well as club medals and since they schedules are not yet made they won't risk suggesting dates.
I'm positive (though not 100% certain) that the rules will be slightly bent. The golf would unfortunately be not in the weekend. It would be on a Monday and Wednesday with another club on Tuesday coming into the mix. I won't chase to get another club until I have defined dates from Noordwijkse and have ran then past everyone here to see if the next step is of interest to everyone.
This is the challenge with working with very private classic clubs here in NL.
Will keep everyone up to date.
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Great work David, organising a BUDA event takes quite a commitment.
Ulrich
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seems that anywhere being proposed would be great in terms of the golf.
John I think everyone pretty much feels that but whats needed is for people to identify their slight preferences or we'll never come to a conclusion ;)
It's great we have so many strong contenders, any one else have any slight preferences?
I know there has been a lot of email passing to and forth behind the scenes, but it would be good if people would give their preferences on dates and location. Since the UKers and USAers are the core of BUDA, it important that as many of them can make it as is possible.
So if it's the Netherlands, Donegal, Carne/Enniscrone, Kington, and Notts, Huntercombe (both have also been mentioned), who's willing to go and when?
At this stage I'm fine with:
Netherlands / Donegal, Carne/Enniscrone, Kington / Notts / Huntercombe: OK
September: OK
June: OK
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I'm in for the Netherlands and very open on dates. The sooner the date can be determined the better, as other commitments will booked in the meantime.
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The Netherlands would be great, would have to be June for me.
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Let's not get ahead of ourselves, guys. Nothing's written in stone yet. Kington and Donegal are still in the running for next year, so let's have indications of preferences but let's not assume Holland is the venue (similarly, let's not assume that 2014 is a done deal, either, whilst Carne/Enniscrone sounds great it seems to me that it could just as easily be 2015, if, for instance, Holland was easier in 2014).
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Let's not get ahead of ourselves, guys. Nothing's written in stone yet. Kington and Donegal are still in the running for next year, so let's have indications of preferences but let's not assume Holland is the venue (similarly, let's not assume that 2014 is a done deal, either, whilst Carne/Enniscrone sounds great it seems to me that it could just as easily be 2015, if, for instance, Holland was easier in 2014).
I agree it's early days yet and a lot can happen in a very short time. I should have mentioned the other options in my previous post. I've now edited it.
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I'd certainly be interested if it was at Huntercombe, as i live less than an hour away.
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Let's not get ahead of ourselves, guys. Nothing's written in stone yet. Kington and Donegal are still in the running for next year, so let's have indications of preferences but let's not assume Holland is the venue (similarly, let's not assume that 2014 is a done deal, either, whilst Carne/Enniscrone sounds great it seems to me that it could just as easily be 2015, if, for instance, Holland was easier in 2014).
I agree it's early days yet and a lot can happen in a very short time. I should have mentioned the other options in my previous post. I've now edited it.
A bit fussy about venues, I see.
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While the Netherlands would probably be my first choice for an upcoming Buda venue, I am concerned that we won't know availability (if any) and dates until at least November. If it doesn't work out there, then it seems we are getting a bit late to be looking at other options. We really cannot expect someone else to keep working on options with other clubs/locations as a backup.
Though this is a bit selfish, it's far easier for those of us coming from NA to book both calendar time (more is needed due to extra travel) and airfare(advance generally saves money) the further in advance that we know. The date is less important than enough advance notice to lock in the date.
How much confidence is there in the Netherlands happening for next year?
My preference would be in August, but either June or September should also work. If not the Netherlands, my second & third choices would be Huntercombe & Kington.
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Don't worry, David looking at the Netherlandish option does not cut any of the other efforts short. In fact, I know that several people are working behind the scenes, but at this point there is no saying which option is going to be ready first. It all depends on the clubs and other vagaries, but rest assured that people are on it.
Ulrich