Golf Club Atlas
GolfClubAtlas.com => Golf Course Architecture Discussion Group => Topic started by: George Pazin on July 19, 2011, 02:47:30 PM
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Everyone on here is likely familiar with TRUE shoes - I thought it would be fun if we got to know the man behind the shoes. And lest there are any cynics out there, this was 100% my idea; as a struggling business owner myself, I take great delight in reading of others' successes. That makes Rob a hero of mine - which makes him like most of the posters on here...
Let fly with questions about the shoes, of course, but I think it would be more interesting to learn about Rob, the golfer. Rob's on vacation this week, so he indicated to me he will try to look in periodically to answer questions.
Have fun, play nice.
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On deck: ? Probably a new poster in early August
Full list:
List of GTK participants (http://golfclubatlas.com/forum/index.php/topic,42023.msg895218/#msg895218)
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Where would you put Sand Hills on the Doak scale?
If you took your all-time best score in relation to par left-handed and right-handed, what's your combined score?
When can my adoring fans get their hands on the Special Edition True 155's? :)
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Rob:
1. Before TRUE, what golf shoes did you wear?
2. Have you met Jim Colton?
3. What is your favorite nine hole loop to walk?
Thanks.
WW
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Where can I buy these shoes in Germany?
Ulrich
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It's been so long, I can't even remember my standard opening questions, so this will have to do:
What brought you to golf?
What brought you to this site?
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Into Walking, what about Walking the Dog, just too cool for cats, right http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SPZVrmJ2HH8
Or is it that if you play Golf - you have to walk, is as much part of the game as ball clubs and courses.
Keep on walking, Rob http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=A2_yXg6g-1s&feature=fvsr
Melvyn
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Rob-
What course or hole in the Portland area would you blow up and start over from scratch on?
Did you know there is a clan of skunks that lives in the rough between 11 and 12 at Ghost Creek?
If any advertising is good advertising, should I stop raking my bunkers and just leave the True prints as a branding message for others?
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It's been so long, I can't even remember my standard opening questions, so this will have to do:
What brought you to golf?
What brought you to this site?
First off - big thanks to George for asking me to do this. I'll try to answer questions as they come between meetings and stuff. Vacation in the homeland isn't for a couple weeks unfortunately :)
I have been a golf junkie forever - my mum is from Ireland and we used to spend summers over there every other year. I grew up caddying for grandparents, aunts, uncles, anyone who would let me drag their sticks around the course - not for the pay, but because when they went off to the 19th hole I could head out to the practice green or sneak in a few holes at twilight. The colors of the course, scent of the air, the beautiful topography of golf courses have always stirred my blood and I am very grateful that I had a few summers hitchhiking from Arva to the club in Cavan for 54 holes before heading home. It was brilliant. I had the chance to play on the links at Ballybunion, Lahinch and Bundoran which was really special. I grew up in Toronto and my family did not have a membership at a club until my dad joined The Summit in high school so golf at home usually consisted of sneaking out to the neighboring school yard in late afternoon and hitting wedges from one set of goal posts to the other. Needless to say the field was missing turf from time to time.
After moving to Portland, OR from NYC I started to get back into golf (it was tough teeing it in Central Park). I was probably doing some reading about Bandon when I stumbled on GCA. I give the site credit for putting me in touch with some great people but also helping spark the idea for The Walking Golfer.com and The Walking Golfers Society, which was how Sean Eidson (the CEO of TRUE linkswear and the guy who noticed someone golfing in VFFs in Dallas one day) and I to meet.
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I will go with the most obvious question ... What is your shoe size and why?
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Where would you put Sand Hills on the Doak scale?
If you took your all-time best score in relation to par left-handed and right-handed, what's your combined score?
When can my adoring fans get their hands on the Special Edition True 155's? :)
Oh goody, we start off with the Sand Hills question. :P I think it's an 8 but I agree with the aspect of 9 that says "you should see this course sometime in your lifetime" because it was THE catalyst for minimalist golf design. SH is a very special place and I can understand why it is a 9 or maybe a 10 for a lot of people. The great thing about GCA is that everyone is entitled to their own opinion and not everyone will agree.
I think my best score combined is 74 RH and 81 LH for 155 - I have only been playing lefty for a little over a month and it's a ton of fun so I think my scores will continue to drop as I improve this year.
Indeed, we'll have some special shoes available in '12 that Jim Colton has signed off on for his SEs. Pretty neat. Maybe we'll even bring them inline . . .
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Rob:
1. Before TRUE, what golf shoes did you wear?
2. Have you met Jim Colton?
3. What is your favorite nine hole loop to walk?
Thanks.
WW
I used to work for a footwear and apparel company so I wore their product on the course - sometimes golf shoes but more and more often indoor soccer shoes.
Yes, I have met Jim "155 was a piece of cake, give me 2 hundy" Colton - he's a stud
Wade - On second thought I'll have to ask you for one more hole so I can play 1 to 7 at Old Mac - walk past the sickest half way house in golf - and play in from the Alps on 16 to 18. I honestly think that would be one of the most epic short loops in golf.
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Where can I buy these shoes in Germany?
Ulrich
I think Capelli Golf has them and a few other places. Our distributor is just getting up and running so we still get orders direct to the TRUE linkswear website from Europe. Shoot me a PM and we'll get you sorted no problem.
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Rob-
What course or hole in the Portland area would you blow up and start over from scratch on?
Did you know there is a clan of skunks that lives in the rough between 11 and 12 at Ghost Creek?
If any advertising is good advertising, should I stop raking my bunkers and just leave the True prints as a branding message for others?
Thanks Melvyn - I hope you are enjoying the balmy summer conditions in the old country! :)
Emile - hmm - Don't get me started - David Mihm and I have talked about this most thoroughly. 9 at Ghost is one of my least favorite holes in PDX along with 18 at Witch. Hopefully we can get The Walkers Course built one of these years and people can talk about blowing up holes on our golf course.
There was always an abundance of wildlife out at Pumpkin - nice to know the skunks are hanging out with the deer. Stinky.
We certainly enjoy seeing TRUE tracks on the course but we also don't want TRUE friends to get in trouble for messing up bunkers because we do believe in raking them. I enjoy dancing around in waste areas though - it is quite effective if you properly manage the spacing.
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I will go with the most obvious question ... What is your shoe size and why?
I wear an 11 in TRUEs and usually a 12 in a barefoot/minimalist running shoe.
I like shoes without structure because you can wear a wide range of sizes and still be comfortable - I have some 10.5 samples in our shoes that I wear and an 11.5 is fine as well. I like the 11 bc there is a little extra room.
I guess the real why is because my feet are that size - trick question? That's sneaky.
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Rob:
Any progress in trying to put together your walking-only course in the Portland area?
You can take the Fifth Amendment on this if you want to, since you are a U.S. citizen.
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How much does walkability factor into your course/Doak ratings? Has your rating gone up at Sand Hills with subsequent plays because i thought I remember you saying it was a 6...
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Rob:
Any progress in trying to put together your walking-only course in the Portland area?
You can take the Fifth Amendment on this if you want to, since you are a U.S. citizen.
Not sure why so many Oregonians love them some courses that are CPO (even in summer). Consider me a charter member when TWGC opens.
And yes 9 at Ghost is horrible, but after we talked about hitting into 1 on twitter a couple weeks ago, I dislike it less now.
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Rob-
Ano other special additions coming? Camo maybe?
CJ
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Rob,
What do the boys from Swooshtown think about Trues? I know I would've worn Trues if they were around when I worked at Nike.
Where do you play in Portland? I used to play at Riverside (before they ruined things by shortening the 18th and building a new clubhouse). Also spent time at Forest Hills, Heron Lakes, Rose City, and C-E.
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What is the theory behind the sole pad under the ball of the foot in the Trues? It made me feel like I was back on my heels when I tried them on. A very weird feeling to me even though everyone swears by them.
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Rob,
Ryan Moore was getting some serious face time at the Open, in the interview room, but where were the logos? You need to add some hats or turtlenecks to the catalog! ;D
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Rob,
A couple things. First - you know I love the shoes. They are now essential gear when it comes to my golf. You wouldn't believe how disappointed I was when I left Ballyneal for Dismal and realized I had forgotten them in my room! :'( I made do with a back up pair of Nike Airs, which are really great, but still - not the same thing.
So, how did you come up with the idea to put memory foam in the shoe? Do you know the weight density of your memory foam and is it made by a factory that produces sleep products? (Geek question I know, but I think maybe I told you last year that I'm selling a line of mf products?)
Do you travel through Shanghai or Honk Kong when you visit your manufactuer?
I look forward to crossing paths with you one of these days and wish you continued success in all of your endeavors.
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Rob:
Any progress in trying to put together your walking-only course in the Portland area?
You can take the Fifth Amendment on this if you want to, since you are a U.S. citizen.
He asked me and my buddy Carl Icahn to back him on that venture. But, we turned him down. The admin and sales costs were too high.
We are threatening a proxy fight.
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Rob, I wear a size 14 but it looks like you stop at 13.
Any likelihood of partnering with Oddball Shoe, which you probably know is in Portland and exclusively services size 13 and higher?
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Rob:
Any progress in trying to put together your walking-only course in the Portland area?
You can take the Fifth Amendment on this if you want to, since you are a U.S. citizen.
He asked me and my buddy Carl Icahn to back him on that venture. But, we turned him down. The admin and sales costs were too high.
We are threatening a proxy fight.
If Icahn can pick up Mentor Graphics, then he could donate some of that campus farmland in Wilsonville to the cause. Purchase the adjacent 60 Acre former mobile home park and you'd be set. They made Langdon farms out of worse land than that.
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Rob:
Any progress in trying to put together your walking-only course in the Portland area?
You can take the Fifth Amendment on this if you want to, since you are a U.S. citizen.
Hi Tom,
The Walkers Course is currently on hold unfortunately. We found a great site about 30 mins from Portland and 15 mins from the airport, had a fantastic architect very interested and put together a really good team to make it happen. Unfortunately, the land owner was asking for more than the property was worth so he had to put it on ice. The team still has hope and I really do believe it would be a wonderful addition to golf in the Portland area. Time to sell a bunch more golf shoes so we can get it done!
Since I'm a Canuck I couldn't take the 5th :)
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How much does walkability factor into your course/Doak ratings? Has your rating gone up at Sand Hills with subsequent plays because i thought I remember you saying it was a 6...
The SH saga continues . . . how surprising and boring. ::)
I never said SH was 6. Did I speak with you directly Sean and tell you it was a 6? Someone else said that SH was a 6 or 7 at a rather raucous GCA dinner. To suggest SH is a 6 is a rather ludicrous statement. Duh.
If you are really bored I would suggest dredging through the very long thread about this last year so you can read it for yourself.
Do my opinions of courses change over time with repeat plays and reflection - absolutely. It is ridiculous to play a course once or twice in a day and form a strong opinion that will never change. I usually walk off the course and evaluate it based on what I saw of the architecture and the playing experience that I had on that day. One of the obvious faults of any magazine ratings system is that the raters simply cannot play the course enough to get a feel for all of the nuances. Therefore ratings are just an opinion, usually based on one play.
Walkability plays an important part in my opinion of courses because I believe that enjoying a round of golf goes hand in hand with the experience of walking the course because it allows you to take in much more of the nuance and design elements. I also think that very walkable layouts are advantageous to the architect because they do not have to worry about figuring out how to build in cart paths and green surrounds to accommodate cart paths. There is a reason that most of the great courses in the world are walkable.
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Rob-
Ano other special additions coming? Camo maybe?
CJ
CJ - We have LOTS of stuff up our sleeve for '12!
Workin' on something to align with a certain course opening - fingers crossed.
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Rob,
What do the boys from Swooshtown think about Trues? I know I would've worn Trues if they were around when I worked at Nike.
Where do you play in Portland? I used to play at Riverside (before they ruined things by shortening the 18th and building a new clubhouse). Also spent time at Forest Hills, Heron Lakes, Rose City, and C-E.
All of our friends there are very excited for us and some people are wearing our shoes when they tee it because they are so comfortable. It's easier not to wear the swoosh outside the burm. It has been great to see the support - the swoosh has a very innovative culture and I think they respect when people take product to another level.
I used to play at Witch and Ghost mostly. I had played Forest Hills, CECC, and a bunch of other courses in the area by the time I left. Portland has some good golf courses but I don't think there are any great golf courses. If you like tree lined golf that plays very targety most of the year then it is a great place to live. At a lot of courses the trees are simply overwhelming. It is good to hear that some courses are starting some serious thinning and/or remodel projects.
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What is the theory behind the sole pad under the ball of the foot in the Trues? It made me feel like I was back on my heels when I tried them on. A very weird feeling to me even though everyone swears by them.
Steve - Our theory around the TRUE tour was that we wanted to build a golf shoe that was designed around the human foot, not a dress shoe.
When people try them on for the first time some will rock back on their heels and say "these feel like slippers but I feel like I'm falling over backwards." That is what happens when you remove the heel wedge and midsole. We are working our shoes towards a zero drop which is the natural position of the body. Sam Snead talked about hitting barefoot and more recently Sean Foley did - it is the most natural position you can be in to swing a golf club.
In our opinion the optimal thing that you can do to improve your golf swing is put your body in a position to succeed - by removing the midsole, heel wedge, etc. and boiling the shoe down to its most natural elements you can significantly increase both proprioception (the communication between your very sensitive feet and your brain) while also improving traction by having a wider surface area which promotes more ground contact.
A lot of our customers say that they will not wear another pair of golf shoes again because they are so connected to the ground while also being protected from the elements. We are obviously ecstatic by this response.
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Rob,
Ryan Moore was getting some serious face time at the Open, in the interview room, but where were the logos? You need to add some hats or turtlenecks to the catalog! ;D
David, Ryan has a little tab on his hat and "TRUE linkswear" is written on the side that was facing away from the camera :)
We'll have some hats available soon and we are working on apparel (slowly and deliberately).
Yeah, we definitely are not the loudest company out there, we think the unique look of the shoes and their performance will end up doing a lot of talking for us. Of course, the staff bag we designed is pretty darn loud - we might end up offering them some day.
And if you know Ryan he tends to shy away from logos on his clothing - pretty much just the hat and bag.
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Rob,
A couple things. First - you know I love the shoes. They are now essential gear when it comes to my golf. You wouldn't believe how disappointed I was when I left Ballyneal for Dismal and realized I had forgotten them in my room! :'( I made do with a back up pair of Nike Airs, which are really great, but still - not the same thing.
So, how did you come up with the idea to put memory foam in the shoe? Do you know the weight density of your memory foam and is it made by a factory that produces sleep products? (Geek question I know, but I think maybe I told you last year that I'm selling a line of mf products?)
Do you travel through Shanghai or Honk Kong when you visit your manufactuer?
I look forward to crossing paths with you one of these days and wish you continued success in all of your endeavors.
Hi Eric,
Thanks for the props - I wish you the best of luck with your endeavors as well!
The memory foam idea came from an analysis of how to make the shoe as comfortable as possible while also being snug and supportive in key areas because the toe box was going to be much wider than normal. Our goal was to get your ankles really happy the first time you slipped on the shoe, and locked in, which in combination with our sockliner makes it easier for people with varying foot widths to really enjoy wearing the shoe. I'd have to check the CBD to find out if there is density - we pretty much just tested the product until it felt right. We figured adding a small amount of weight there was worth it because the rest of the shoe is so much lighter than anything else on tour.
I do most of my travel through Guangzhou but I've been up to Shenzen and through HK as well. Guangzhou is pretty much the footwear capital of the world - it's incredible how many factories they have there.
Let me know if you are ever heading over and we'll see if our calendars can align.
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Rob, I wear a size 14 but it looks like you stop at 13.
Any likelihood of partnering with Oddball Shoe, which you probably know is in Portland and exclusively services size 13 and higher?
Garland - I can't believe you guys said no - I was more than a little disappointed :)
JL - If you go to http://shop.truelinkswear.com/ you will see all the styles/colors/sizes we currently have available.
Our sizing goes from 6.5 to 15 so we should have you covered. We really need to 2.0 our website - it's on the list - the newsletter still shows 8 to 13 but that has been wrong for a LONG time. Sorry about that.
I have never heard of Oddball Shoe - very interesting - I'll have one of our sales guys look into it - Thanks!
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Rob:
Any progress in trying to put together your walking-only course in the Portland area?
You can take the Fifth Amendment on this if you want to, since you are a U.S. citizen.
He asked me and my buddy Carl Icahn to back him on that venture. But, we turned him down. The admin and sales costs were too high.
We are threatening a proxy fight.
If Icahn can pick up Mentor Graphics, then he could donate some of that campus farmland in Wilsonville to the cause. Purchase the adjacent 60 Acre former mobile home park and you'd be set. They made Langdon farms out of worse land than that.
Emile,
I don't think Carl is that interested in golf. He is interested in making money. ;D
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Emile - We found some good potential land aside from the "ideal" site we discovered.
Oregon has some very strict laws when it comes to converting farm land to anything which means you need a lot of influence and $$$ to make a project happen. "Dream Golf" was a fascinating read on many levels - the time it took for Mr. McKee and Mr. Keiser to navigate getting the green light for Bandon was daunting.
We were intentionally looking for a rather flat site where we could grow native grasses reminiscent of Heathland courses around London. We really believe that a site that drains well naturally, combined with likely sand capping, could play pretty firm and fast for most of the year and add a very interesting dynamic to golf in the Portland area.
The Walkers Course is one of the dreams I work towards every day at TRUE and with the current economy and the number of courses getting built if we have to wait a while I think we'll be okay.
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Unfortunately, the land owner was asking for more than the property was worth so he had to put it on ice.
I think you meant to say "the land owner was asking for more than we were willing to pay".
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Rob, more a comment than a question, though it could be both. I hope you run a marketing campaign, based on Jim's 155 hole golfathon for Ben. I think you could build Trues into a national (or international) brand with that.
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JL - If you go to http://shop.truelinkswear.com/ you will see all the styles/colors/sizes we currently have available.
Our sizing goes from 6.5 to 15 so we should have you covered. We really need to 2.0 our website - it's on the list - the newsletter still shows 8 to 13 but that has been wrong for a LONG time. Sorry about that.
I have never heard of Oddball Shoe - very interesting - I'll have one of our sales guys look into it - Thanks!
Will check out your link. Oddball can probably move your 14s and 15s for you. I use them a little less these days now that I found Zappos, but guys with big feet always know other guys with big feet.
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TRue Blue?
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Jim,
What Jim did for Ben and his family was beyond amazing.
We were very proud to support his efforts and look forward to supporting him as much as possible in the future - not quite sure but this is likely the tip of the iceberg. Very few people can act on their passion is such a compelling and selfless manner for the good of others.
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Emile - We found some good potential land aside from the "ideal" site we discovered.
Oregon has some very strict laws when it comes to converting farm land to anything which means you need a lot of influence and $$$ to make a project happen. "Dream Golf" was a fascinating read on many levels - the time it took for Mr. McKee and Mr. Keiser to navigate getting the green light for Bandon was daunting.
We were intentionally looking for a rather flat site where we could grow native grasses reminiscent of Heathland courses around London. We really believe that a site that drains well naturally, combined with likely sand capping, could play pretty firm and fast for most of the year and add a very interesting dynamic to golf in the Portland area.
The Walkers Course is one of the dreams I work towards every day at TRUE and with the current economy and the number of courses getting built if we have to wait a while I think we'll be okay.
I understand all to well. I can't even cut down a tree on my property without 2 arborist, a city planner and 90% my direct neighbors giving their approval. Keep up the great work, I love the shoes (especially your customer service when I had insole issues), I think the TWC WILL really be amazing WHEN it happens. Lets hook up sometime in PDX.
Cheers!
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What is the theory behind the sole pad under the ball of the foot in the Trues? It made me feel like I was back on my heels when I tried them on. A very weird feeling to me even though everyone swears by them.
Steve - Our theory around the TRUE tour was that we wanted to build a golf shoe that was designed around the human foot, not a dress shoe.
When people try them on for the first time some will rock back on their heels and say "these feel like slippers but I feel like I'm falling over backwards." That is what happens when you remove the heel wedge and midsole. We are working our shoes towards a zero drop which is the natural position of the body. Sam Snead talked about hitting barefoot and more recently Sean Foley did - it is the most natural position you can be in to swing a golf club.
In our opinion the optimal thing that you can do to improve your golf swing is put your body in a position to succeed - by removing the midsole, heel wedge, etc. and boiling the shoe down to its most natural elements you can significantly increase both proprioception (the communication between your very sensitive feet and your brain) while also improving traction by having a wider surface area which promotes more ground contact.
A lot of our customers say that they will not wear another pair of golf shoes again because they are so connected to the ground while also being protected from the elements. We are obviously ecstatic by this response.
Thanks Rob. Interesting that just the removal of the heel wedge and midsole causes that feeling. I have looked into VFFs and I guess a similar feeling would occur. And, you are right, everyone I know who pkays in your shoes swears by them.
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Thanks for playing, Rob!
Can you give us a little background on the genesis of TRUE? The original idea, the meeting with Sean, etc. You may want to start keeping a journal, if you aren't already. I really enjoy reading books written by successful entrepreneurs. I could write one on what not to do... :)
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Rob-
What do you rate Talking Stick North on the Doak scale? I thought it was a 6 with a few good holes, no great ones, and was pretty good for an extremely flat site. I also loved the smell when you walk into the resort/casino.
On a scale of 1-10 with 10 being shit your pants excited, how cool was it to get a picture of THE Jules Winnfield wearing Trues?
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Thanks for playing, Rob!
Can you give us a little background on the genesis of TRUE? The original idea, the meeting with Sean, etc. You may want to start keeping a journal, if you aren't already. I really enjoy reading books written by successful entrepreneurs. I could write one on what not to do... :)
Sure, I can give a quick summary of how TRUE happened.
As I mentioned earlier Sean Eidson, our co-founder and CEO, notice someone golfing in VFFs while he was playing in Dallas. He had read an interesting article in the NYT about the rise of barefoot running and how small companies were "wiggling their toes at the footwear giants." Since barefoot running was already becoming a trend he saw a great opportunity in golf - ie) if the barefoot guys got together with the walking golfers there could be a really cool product. Sean was a member of The Walking Golfers Society and we had communicated a couple times in the past after meeting randomly at Pacific Dunes. Sean knew I was working at a large footwear and apparel company and was a very passionate walking golfer who was always testing product. Sean had found a designer and started kicking around some ideas and drawings which he passed over. I provided him with my feedback and told him that I thought, if done properly, this product could absolutely kill it. What two surfaces to people enjoy walking on barefoot the most - grass and sand - through some water proofing around your foot and make a comfortable shoe and in our opinion you have the ultimate golf shoe - which can also be worn off the course.
I had been golfing for the most part in indoor soccer shoes and whenever I made recommendations for "comfort" improvement in product I had been testing for my employer they did not seem interested. Their concern was making product for the guys on tour - although it seemed strange to me that if you practice/play everyday wouldn't you want to be comfy? I was not involved in footwear at my employer, only footwear product testing.
So Sean and I had what we thought was a good idea - and as others saw what we were up to they were really impressed as well. The key for us was figuring out how to turn this into a business. We were fortunate on two levels - 1) being able to find interested investors early on and 2) having the opportunity to get our idea in front of Ryan Moore, his brother Jeremy and father Mike.
The Ryan story is interesting - Todd Rohrer of MacKenzie Golf Bags was down in Scottsdale the same time as Ari Techner from Scratch who was in town to do some work with Ryan. Sean and I put a power point deck together for Todd to give to Ryan. Long story short, Todd was able to hand it off to Jeremy Moore - Ryan's brother and manager. This was obviously very fortunate and it ended up being a serendipitous moment as Ryan was suffering through ankle problems with the shoes he was currently wearing and they were getting worse. Ryan was also frustrated by the weight and structure of golf shoes on the market and was really excited about a "barefoot" golf shoe that put you as close to the ground as possible. Ryan is obviously a unique pro golfer and we knew that his honest and "lone wolf" attitude would be beneficial for you TRUE. On top of that, Ryan is a really great guy who loves product - so we'd have a great product tester and partner who would validate our shoes on the PGA Tour.
We signed Ryan around The Colonial last May and he became our third co-founder. We have a great group of investors that helped us get up and running and Jeremy Moore, Ryan's brother, is an integral part of our company. Along the way we picked up Mike Wagner, who y'all should know from GCA, and a couple other young guns who were really passionate about what we are doing as a company.
The TRUE tour went on the market through our website for pre-sales in September 2010 and we began shipping the shoes out in October. We've been pretty much sold out since then as we get shipments in and they immediately go out to retail or customers. We absolutely killed it at the PGA Show and that added a lot of energy to 2011 which has continued. It has been an incredible ride thus far and we are continuing to get better in terms of product design, materials, quality, etc. We can't thank all of our TRUE friends for their support along the way - and there are a bunch of them on GCA - chapeau guys! We really appreciate it!
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Rob,
When's the last time you rode in a golf cart?
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Rob-
What do you rate Talking Stick North on the Doak scale? I thought it was a 6 with a few good holes, no great ones, and was pretty good for an extremely flat site. I also loved the smell when you walk into the resort/casino.
On a scale of 1-10 with 10 being shit your pants excited, how cool was it to get a picture of THE Jules Winnfield wearing Trues?
Hi Patrick,
I love TSN - it is such a fun course with really interesting GCA, especially for such a flat site. C&C used the washes, ob, and every bunker to create what I would consider a really pure minimalist layout. There is very little waste out there - every bunker has a reason for its existence and they strongly dictate strategy on what is a wide layout. A great design.
A few holes are kind of similar - I really like 2, 3, and 12 that run along the fence on the north side. The North is a fantastic course to walk - I've been carrying out there when it's 110 and I really don't mind it that much because the terrain is so easy to navigate. I think a Doak 6 is spot on. If you are in the area it is worth checking out. During the summer it's on $40 - a steal - I play out there whenever I can.
I also enjoyed playing Southern Dunes, probably my favorite public played thus far, and We Ko Pa Saguaro which I would also rate a 6. Desert Forest has been my favorite private thus far, a really cool classic track through the desert - a fantastic walk in a neighborhood where that is rarely a priority, or at times, even a consideration.
Getting the photo of Mr. Sammy L rockin' the TRUEs was definitely a 10 - how freakin' sick was that!!!! He is THE man. Total icon. Such a stud.
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Rob,
When's the last time you rode in a golf cart?
A couple weeks ago. When we have "business" golf and it's 105 to 115 there is little chance that anyone else will want to walk so I have to ride or at least get chauffered. One time we were like - "So we're walking right?" and the guys were like "Umm, no, are you crazy, it's 110, we're going to ride." It is what it is.
I also had to take a cart when we were up at Desert Mountain a while back - the course was not walkable.
When I have to ride I usually walk a few of the holes to try and get in a rhythm - I don't like it but sometimes you have to go with the flow. There are some great walking courses around PHX - ACC, Desert Forest, TS North and South, Saguaro - but a lot of others are a real challenge due to green to tee transfers. It's unfortunate.
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Rob
Do you still think Old Mac is a better course than Pac Dunes?
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Rob
Do you still think Old Mac is a better course than Pac Dunes?
I prefer Old Mac to Pacific - OM is probably my favorite course to play in the US rivaled only by Ballyneal (of the courses that I have played).
Both courses are amazing and every time I go to Bandon my "list" is open to change - however - Old Mac is a strong #1 at the resort for me, it's just so much fun and such a great walk. Just brilliant. When I get to the 14th tee at Pac I look over at the Road, Biarritz, Redan, etc. in the distance and want to go cross country.
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Robb,
Thanks for sharing in here.
Who would you say is your biggest potential competitor/threat at the moment in the industry?
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Robb,
Thanks for sharing in here.
Who would you say is your biggest potential competitor/threat at the moment in the industry?
Hi Kalen,
That's a great question.
We don't really have any direct competitors at this point but I'm sure that will change. It would seem like we are competing with the Ecco Street but their golf shoe is far from barefoot and the Ecco Biom is far from minimalist. I think that the TRUEs and Ecco Street are working together to expand the spikeless golf market because the shoes are much more comfortable than anything else available.
As a small company the biggest threat is always that a big player comes in and copies you and puts millions into marketing. Ashworth tried to copy the Ecco Street but it doesn't seem to have worked out which is good to see. Ecco have a lot of brand equity in the Street and another Street is just a rip off - consumers are getting smarter and seem to be sticking with the true innovators.
If a large player comes after us we have to hope that our TRUE friends stick with our product and brand because they believe in TRUE - a lot of small companies become big because people love the brand, the vision and the product, that is what we are striving to achieve.
We will never sit on our hands doing nothing - instead we'll continue pushing the envelope and trying to stay ahead of everyone else in the industry.
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We will never sit on our hands doing nothing - instead we'll continue pushing the envelope and trying to stay ahead of everyone else in the industry.
As long as you continually innovate you will be find. And, if you keep the start up mentality you innovate faster than the big guys and their multi-tiered organizations.
Thanks to this thread, and I know it wasn't the intent, I am buying a pair of Trues this morning. Rob's answer to my question and some history on the shoe's development convinced me.
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Rob,
Thanks for being candid. As a big guy who wears a size 13 wide, I'm certainly interested in trying out your product and seeing how it works out for me. I've never been comfortable in traditional golfing shoes and have been wearing merrills for years as a work around because even though they aren't a golf shoe per se they are very comfy.
Do you know where I can look in the Spokane area to try some out?
Thanks,
Kalen
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Rob,
Thanks for being candid. As a big guy who wears a size 13 wide, I'm certainly interested in trying out your product and seeing how it works out for me. I've never been comfortable in traditional golfing shoes and have been wearing merrills for years as a work around because even though they aren't a golf shoe per se they are very comfy.
Do you know where I can look in the Spokane area to try some out?
Thanks,
Kalen
Kalen,
I wear 13 4E and can promise you that the Trues are the most comfortable shoe I have ever worn. I have had trouble for years finding a golf shoe that fit and can't say enough good things about the True. Rob knows that it's gotten to the point where every course I go to I tell them about the Trues.
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Sam - Thanks for the support!
Steve - Thanks for giving them a try!
Kalen - I don't think we have a location in Spokane right now - but if you order a pair of TRUEs online and they do not fit we will either 1) exchange them for free and pay shipping both ways or 2) send you an RA number so you can return your TRUEs and we'll refund you purchase no questions asked.
If you normally wear a 13 then I'd start there - they tend to fit C to EEE - although some guys with B find they fit as well. We appreciate you checking them out.
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Robb,
Thanks for sharing in here.
Who would you say is your biggest potential competitor/threat at the moment in the industry?
Hi Kalen,
That's a great question.
We don't really have any direct competitors at this point but I'm sure that will change. It would seem like we are competing with the Ecco Street but their golf shoe is far from barefoot and the Ecco Biom is far from minimalist. I think that the TRUEs and Ecco Street are working together to expand the spikeless golf market because the shoes are much more comfortable than anything else available.
As a small company the biggest threat is always that a big player comes in and copies you and puts millions into marketing. Ashworth tried to copy the Ecco Street but it doesn't seem to have worked out which is good to see. Ecco have a lot of brand equity in the Street and another Street is just a rip off - consumers are getting smarter and seem to be sticking with the true innovators.
If a large player comes after us we have to hope that our TRUE friends stick with our product and brand because they believe in TRUE - a lot of small companies become big because people love the brand, the vision and the product, that is what we are striving to achieve.
We will never sit on our hands doing nothing - instead we'll continue pushing the envelope and trying to stay ahead of everyone else in the industry.
Do you think the Newton running shoes guys will poke around in the golf shoe market?
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Robb,
Thanks for sharing in here.
Who would you say is your biggest potential competitor/threat at the moment in the industry?
Hi Kalen,
That's a great question.
We don't really have any direct competitors at this point but I'm sure that will change. It would seem like we are competing with the Ecco Street but their golf shoe is far from barefoot and the Ecco Biom is far from minimalist. I think that the TRUEs and Ecco Street are working together to expand the spikeless golf market because the shoes are much more comfortable than anything else available.
As a small company the biggest threat is always that a big player comes in and copies you and puts millions into marketing. Ashworth tried to copy the Ecco Street but it doesn't seem to have worked out which is good to see. Ecco have a lot of brand equity in the Street and another Street is just a rip off - consumers are getting smarter and seem to be sticking with the true innovators.
If a large player comes after us we have to hope that our TRUE friends stick with our product and brand because they believe in TRUE - a lot of small companies become big because people love the brand, the vision and the product, that is what we are striving to achieve.
We will never sit on our hands doing nothing - instead we'll continue pushing the envelope and trying to stay ahead of everyone else in the industry.
Do you think the Newton running shoes guys will poke around in the golf shoe market?
David,
While I prefer the Ecco Biom in Yak skin I do have a set of these Five Finger shoes with a sole very similar to the Freddie Ecco's that I love. Of course I play against a group of fish on the hook and wear odd shoes to throw them off.
http://www.vibramfivefingers.com/products/Five-Fingers-KSO-Trek-Mens.htm
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Of course I play against a group of fish on the hook and wear odd shoes to throw them off.
That's Chris Johnston's ploy as well. Even resorts to using the gold toes to blind his opponents. (And yellow golf balls).
(http://i464.photobucket.com/albums/rr7/rednorman/GCA/0edba397.jpg?t=1311265617)
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I tried the 5 fingers shoes by Vibram ...didn't really like it. Everyone's toes are different lengths and lets just say two of toes didn't fit in the sleeve!! ;)
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I tried the 5 fingers shoes by Vibram ...didn't really like it. Everyone's toes are different lengths and lets just say two of toes didn't fit in the sleeve!! ;)
You got hammer toe written all over you. Did you buy the socks, you got to have the socks and trim those toe nails.
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Rob,
Did you forget to tell of your Sam Snead inspiration? ;)
Sam played a practice round at The Masters in his bare feet after prodding by the press, and brought the course to its knees.
Also, stimulated Gene Sarazen to get a local rule against playing barefoot there.
If you ever heard Sam had a severe dislike for The Squire, now you know why.
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Rob:
On the Doak Scale, what rating would you give the Hamilton College 9-holer? Did you get much golf in while on the hill and if so, where did you play?
Sven
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Garland - I mentioned the Snead-ster earlier - he's the man!
Sven - I played the 9 hole a bit at Ham Tech but not much. Usually waited until I got back to TO to kick off the golf season. Usually the snow was just melting (well not quite) when we left campus :)
Have you played Yanandonasis (or whatever it is called) - that is the "home course" of the Hamilton Golf Team and I heard it's a decent track?
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Rob,
Here are a couple of questions:
- Has it been difficult to get national retailers to carry your product? It seems that Golfsmith was reasonably quick to stock Trues, but I have yet to see anything from Golf Galaxy.
- You indicated on GolfWRX that there is still one more limited edition shoe coming out this year. Are there any additional details you can share? I have one pair now and am pondering a second pair.
- When looking at new versions/models of the shoes, how do you balance the wide toe box and other features of the shoe with trying to get them to look more "normal" and, perhaps, more attractive to more golfers?
Jeff
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Rob,
Here are a couple of questions:
- Has it been difficult to get national retailers to carry your product? It seems that Golfsmith was reasonably quick to stock Trues, but I have yet to see anything from Golf Galaxy.
- You indicated on GolfWRX that there is still one more limited edition shoe coming out this year. Are there any additional details you can share? I have one pair now and am pondering a second pair.
- When looking at new versions/models of the shoes, how do you balance the wide toe box and other features of the shoe with trying to get them to look more "normal" and, perhaps, more attractive to more golfers?
Jeff
Hi Jeff,
- We have been asked by every large retailer for our product but as we are constantly in short supply we knew that taking on Galaxy or Dicks was simply not feasible. Golfsmith, PGA Superstore, Edwin Watts, Golf Town in Canada, World Wide Golf Shops (Vans, Richard Dunn) are all on board and we are doing our best to keep them stocked.
- Our final LE will be a stealth and it is a color that Ryan has been wearing on tour this year but we have not offered.
- With the tour we embraced our uniqueness and accepted that people might call it a "clown shoe" because of the toe box. On the stealth we used the toe cap and clean classic design to tone down the toe box. Most people think it is narrower but the last is the same. We'll have a few more styles out next year that will probably be more "commercial". At the end of the day - however - the last is the last and the shape is the shape - We can't really hide it and most of our customers tell us that they "get used to it" after a couple of round or they forget about it immediately because of the comfort and performance. That being said, we recognize that our TRUEs are not for everyone and no product can fit every foot. It is going to be interesting to see what the response by women is to our offering - We've had tons and tons of emails from women requesting a TRUE, let's see if they do indeed buy the shoe because the toe box will obviously be quite a bit wider than any other golf shoe and women tend to focus on aesthetics in fashion more than men.
Great questions - Thanks
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Rob, if you're a reader and looking for a related book, you might want to pick up Born To Run by Christopher McDougall. For that matter, I'd contact him, I think he writes for magazines, too.
I walked 18 the other day and had problems with my shoes for the first time; I think it's the new softspikes that the pro shop at my friend's club installed. They are just too big. Can't blame them, they probably saw my swing and figured I needed help with stability... :)
Any other brushes with greatness besides Ryan Moore? Have you had a chance to golf with him? Seems like he'd be an interesting guy to tee it up with - he'd probably even play the Bandon event you asked about on the other thread.
Next time you're in Orlando, I can give you the contact info for a slew of bikini models that would make sure no one would even notice the wide toe box...
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Rob,
My 9 year old son, a men's 8 1/2 wants golf shoes for his birthday. He wasn't an 8 1/2 last year, and won't be next year. What variation on "yes" or "no, but" do you recommend?
Thanks, Dave
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I walked 18 the other day and had problems with my shoes for the first time; I think it's the new softspikes that the pro shop at my friend's club installed. They are just too big. Can't blame them, they probably saw my swing and figured I needed help with stability... :)
Actually, the TRUEs provide more stability that any softspike shoe out there because your feet are actually on the ground as opposed to 1/2 inch off of it. Most stability and balance I've had is while wearing TRUEs.
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I was in the Golfsmith Extreme in The Woodlands today and was very happy to see a large display of Trues!
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Rob, if you're a reader and looking for a related book, you might want to pick up Born To Run by Christopher McDougall. For that matter, I'd contact him, I think he writes for magazines, too.
I walked 18 the other day and had problems with my shoes for the first time; I think it's the new softspikes that the pro shop at my friend's club installed. They are just too big. Can't blame them, they probably saw my swing and figured I needed help with stability... :)
Any other brushes with greatness besides Ryan Moore? Have you had a chance to golf with him? Seems like he'd be an interesting guy to tee it up with - he'd probably even play the Bandon event you asked about on the other thread.
Next time you're in Orlando, I can give you the contact info for a slew of bikini models that would make sure no one would even notice the wide toe box...
Hi George,
Born to Run was one of the catalysts for us to give TRUE a go - it is a brilliant book and quite enlightening in terms of how logical minimalist footwear really is. Fascinating read with some really cool stories.
There are some other guys on TOUR with our shoes but we can't really talk about it . . . We have met some really amazing people - at the PGA Show this year and afterwards.
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Rob,
My 9 year old son, a men's 8 1/2 wants golf shoes for his birthday. He wasn't an 8 1/2 last year, and won't be next year. What variation on "yes" or "no, but" do you recommend?
Thanks, Dave
Hi Dave,
Not sure I understand - sorry. If your son is an 8.5 at 9 y/o then he obviously has a long way to grow!
I honestly believe that minimalist footwear is better for your body and your golf game so I am confident he will enjoy wearing TRUEs. We will have another style available next year that is less expensive but a great product. Could be a solid fit for a growing kid!
Cheers
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I was in the Golfsmith Extreme in The Woodlands today and was very happy to see a large display of Trues!
Hi Sam,
Dig it!!!! Golfsmith are doing great with the TRUEs - it's really exciting and great to see them go nation wide.
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Rob - At long last one of my too many pairs of golf shoes bit the dust. Just ordered my first pair of Trues from the web site tonight. I have two pair of Nike golf shoes and they are both 9.5. I have three pair of Footjoys and two of them are 9 and the other is 9.5.
I went 9.5 in the True. Did I pick right?
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Tim,
You should be fine. As Rob mentioned earlier the way they fit allows you to have a few sizes that will work. I tried on 3 sizes and could have worn any of the 3.
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Thanks Sean - I agree Tim, you should be good with 9.5.
We tend to advise purchasing 9.5 in TRUE if you wear a 9.5 in Adidas and Nike (so same size) and 9.5 in TRUE if you wear 9 in FJ (1/2 size larger in TRUE vs FJ).
I hope you enjoy the walk with your new TRUEs!
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love the product Rob and can't wait for your hats to come out as well.
quick ?-- both of my TRUEs pairs' sole has pretty much turned green after 15 or 20 rounds. Is there anything that can be done to prevent this?
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Mark - Do you have the white sole?
It is difficult to clean the soles back to white without some pretty serious chemicals so I would not recommend it. You can try to scrub down the soles to get the dirt off, but if they are green I wonder if there was some sort of reaction to chemicals used on your golf course?
If your black soles are turning green then please send me photos - that is bizarre!
If you want to send me pics at rob.rigg@truelinkswear.com I can take a look so we can figure this out.
Thanks
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Rob what are your thoughts on the shoes that Tiger wore today at the Bridgestone Invitational? I don't intend to be negative in anyway if it is perceived that way.
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Hi Joe,
Pretty interesting timing :)
Nike have had FREE technology since 2004 and they just decided to launch a golf shoe that incorporates it . . . I think they saw the writing on the wall with where the golf footwear industry is heading in terms of lightweight/comfort/spikeless/closer to the ground and decided to hop on board. Furthermore, Sean Foley has been promoting "practicing barefoot" for quite some time because of the many benefits and was frustrated that golfers had to "cast their foot" reducing "proprioception". Obviously Tiger has enough cred to call on Nike for whatever product he wants and they need to make it. Since more natural/minimalist shoes are easier on your body it makes sense that he has something like the FREE post injury.
For TRUE it is great - to have the largest footwear company in the world validate the direction that you have taken the golf shoe is spectacular. For over 30 years Nike have been promoting the benefits of motion control technology with the Air Bags and heavy use of EVA in the midsole and their golf shoes have all had metal shanks because "the stiffer the better". They just 180'd with this shoe! That's huge! The TRUEs are much closer to the ground than the Nike TW Proto which is where "proprioception" is derived - the lower the better. Our platform is also wider. Obviously it is a bit scary to have a company with a huge marketing budget put you on notice and enter your space but if they do end up selling the FREE TW Proto to the public then a lot more people will see what Tiger is wearing and start researching golf shoes that are less structured and closer to the ground, which is brilliant for TRUE linkswear.
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Just from the look, Tiger's shoe looked a lot like some of the Adidas models. And I am guessing they still feel like a golf shoe because they have soft spikes.
I bought a pair of Trues about a week ago and have played seven of the last 8 days. All rounds have been on hilly courses and one day included 36 holes at the Am qualifier. I wore my new Trues every round. What a fantastic shoe! The most comfortable shoe period I have ever worn. Not one slip either. You really feel low to the ground and my foot work and balance seems especially good right now. The best part is that on my hole course there are a lot of cross hill walks that would kill my feet in traditional golf shoes because my foot would role over the sole of the shoe. This does not happen in the Trues I think because they are so wide, so light and your foot is so close the ground. It really is like walking barefoot. I will never go back to traditional golf shoes
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Rob,
Hope this turns into the perfect storm for you....
Dan Patrick was talking Tiger's shoes on the radio, and apparently he's not the only one advancing that story line
Ryan's leading going into the weekend
If he can get some air time, will there ever be a better time for a crass, self-serving promo?
In all seriousness, I hope this turns out to be the bomb for you.
Love my Trues.
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David,
Thanks for the kind words - It looks like golf footwear is certainly trending in our direction.
Now we just have to stay ahead of the competition and make sure we are building a superior product.
Keep enjoying the walk in your TRUEs!
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I'm looking at getting a pair of the new TRUE tour shoes. Before doing so, I want to see if anyone has already played with them and has feedback to share. Specifically, how do they differ from the previous model? Thx.
http://www.truelinkswear.com/style/ (http://www.truelinkswear.com/style/)
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Howard,
I haven't played in them, but I have the 2012 tours and stealth. In my experience, they run 1/2 size bigger than last years (12 was perfect for me last year, 11 1/2 this year). I put last yrs vs this years stealth on either foot and the 2012's felt even closer to the ground. The tongue is noticeable different this year, the Jury is still out on how I feel about it. Ask me again in May when I can actually get on the course.
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Howard,
I have some of last year's Tours and a pair of this year's PHX. All are 11s. The tours are great, the PHX seem a little big.
I'm going to take a look at a store and try on some 10.5s and see how they are.
My advice would be to go to Golfsmith and try some on. I do love mine.
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I've got a pair of 2011 Tours and Stealths and 2012 PHX, I love all 3. I think the PHX run a little bigger. I love Trues though, in other shoes I go between 13 4E and 14 4E and Trues in a 13 are wonderful.
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Definitely try on the PHX model for size if possible before you buy! Size 13 in a Tour or Stealth model was a definite no-go, but my size 14s in the PHX are huge--I probably should have gotten a 13.
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Jim, Jeff, Sam, Mark -
Thanks for the insight on the new TRUEs. Look forward to heading over to Golfsmith to try on a few pairs.
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