Golf Club Atlas
GolfClubAtlas.com => Golf Course Architecture Discussion Group => Topic started by: John Goodman on January 17, 2006, 03:25:37 PM
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Those who know Teeth of the Dog better than I (I have played it a total of twice, both last week, and I thought it a fine course though not a Doak Gourmet choice): why is it that three of the seven ocean holes are par 3s? I don't have an opinion on the routing per se, just a suspicion - maybe Dye went for the low hanging fruit a little bit on the ocean holes? I liked Teeth a lot but I thought more than once as I was playing that it seemed to lack a little something. Teeth was beautiful and a fine test but it made me appreciate Pebble a little more . . .
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I am firmly in the camp of thinking less of Teeth of the Dog than Doak, Jim Coleman and a host of others. I played it three times and didn't find it all that compelling. The water holes were nice but not so outstanding as I would hope due to the lack of variety that you refer to. I haven't been there in years, and I don't plan on it either. It was nice but if I were to rank, it would be way down my list of favorites.
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Is the water on the same side for each of the par threes ?
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Wayne: You are also firmly on the side opposite of Pete Dye. The two of us can take you any day.
John: It's a matter of linear footage. No matter how much coastal frontage an architect is given, it's pretty common to include a number of par-3's on the coast, to try and maximize the number of oceanfront holes. Just to cite a couple of other examples: Cabo del Sol has the back-to-back 3's on the front (6 & 7) and the 17th on the back; Cypress Point, obviously; Pacific Dunes has 10 & 11, although I did also put two very long par-4's on the water.
Pebble Beach's stretch of great par-4's along the water is the exception, rather than the rule ... then again, none of us has had as much coastline to work with as Pebble Beach.
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This is probably partially why all the par threes at Whistling Straits are along the lake too.
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I read where Dye was asked to "build me a Ballybunion" at Whisting Straits. The par three variety and routing at Ballybunion puts the ones at WS to shame. WS are built for "resort" golf; get all the sizzle you can.
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Tom,
I may be on the opposite side of you and Pete Dye (which certainly figures), but that's alright as we don't have to agree all the time. I did not have a high regard for the course when I played it. I will admit that I last played it about 5 years ago and my appreciation for architecture has hopefully become more informed since then. However, I was underwhelmed by the course in a general sense and found crossing the airport runway a serious detraction and far short of quirky.
I may be wrong, but aren't all the seaside greens played parallel to the water? Are any of them perpendicular with the green by the sea? It didn't seem that way. I also didn't like the caddies constantly cheating by moving the balls out of traps and from behind trees and bushes, especially since they were my competition's shots that were improved. I take it the caddies cheat on behalf of their players so as to get a bigger tip. I was not amused.
Where do the two of you want to take me by the way? If it is golfing, I am at your command. If it is for knocking some sense into me, well I think I'll pass.