The second finest country for golf courses

[Ran Morrissett]

England, no doubt about it.Tom MacWood's piece got me thinking about it and some of my favorite courses there and the diversity of properties: 1. Royal St. George's2. Westward Ho!3. Swinley Forest4. Lytham5. Walton Heath (Old)6. The Addington7. West Sussex8. Brancaster9. Woodhall Spa10. Hoylake11. Sunningdale Old12. Ganton13. St. George's Hill14. Royal Ashdown Forest15. St. Enodoc16. Royal Birkdale17. Saunton (East)18. Woking19. Hillside20. Burnham & BerrowSave for the last four, I would argue that the rest belong on any world top 100 list. Throw in Notts, Sunningdale New, Deal, and maybe Beau Desert or Huntercombe or Walton Heath (New) - which I haven't seen - and you have potentially 20 (!) courses that belong in the world top 100.Apart from the U.S., no other country  fields even 10 courses. It's either a pity - or a blessing   - that more folks don't head to England for their golf trips. I am sure that Brian S. would agree after his past summer - for sheer diversity of inland, heathland, and links courses, England is in a class all its own.Cheers,

[Tommy Williamsen]

I have to agree.  England may not have courses in the top twenty like Ireland and Scotland do but it has depth.  Thought I would resurrect this old thread.

[Ed Tilley]

England does not have the real out of this world courses that Scotland or Ireland have. However, on any ranking of courses in the British Isles that I've seen, England has around half of the top 100. The strength in depth of courses in England is amazing. Add to that the sheer variety of courses on offer - links, parkland, heathland, moorland, clifftop - and I have to agree with Ran.

Add to the 26 courses that Ran listed the likes of:

Formby, Silloth on Solway, Wentworth (W & E), Berkshire (R & B), Rye, Worplesdon, West Hill, Woburn, Hunstanton, Alwoodley, Hankley Common, Broadstone, Moortown, Saunton West, Perranporth..............

[RJ_Daley]

The second finest country for golf courses
« on: November 14, 2001, 07:00:00 pm »

Ran Morrissett
Administrator

...
I am sure that Brian S. would agree after his past summer - for sheer diversity of inland, heathland, and links courses, England is in a class all its own.Cheers,

Man, will you look at that date and that no one posted on this for nearly 6 years, and that Tommy W., dug it up!  

Brian is all grown up now, working for Doak... and Ran is in seclusion, playing golf, and nesting with the fam., often sitting in the den in his smoking jacket, puffing and reflecting on what he had started those many years ago.  

[Bill_McBride]

England does not have the real out of this world courses that Scotland or Ireland have. However, on any ranking of courses in the British Isles that I've seen, England has around half of the top 100. The strength in depth of courses in England is amazing. Add to that the sheer variety of courses on offer - links, parkland, heathland, moorland, clifftop - and I have to agree with Ran.

Add to the 26 courses that Ran listed the likes of:

Formby, Silloth on Solway, Wentworth (W & E), Berkshire (R & B), Rye, Worplesdon, West Hill, Woburn, Hunstanton, Alwoodley, Hankley Common, Broadstone, Moortown, Saunton West, Perranporth..............

Glad to see Alwoodley added, the boys are having fun there now.  And Wallasey last fall, great course nobody really talks about.

And what about Painswick?  

[Tim Pitner]

Scotland's not really a country in the political sense, so isn't the hands-down winner the United Kingdom of Great Britain and Northern Ireland?  NI kicks in a few greats as well.  It seems like it may even challenge for #1.  

[RJ_Daley]

What are the statistics for how many core golfers there are in GB or GB&I etc. compared to the U.S. and then what are the number of per capita highly regarded courses.  I'll bet the GB&I might almost go to #1 if that method is used.  But then again, on a per capita basis, perhaps individual States win.

[John Kavanaugh]

It is time to get out of 2001 and admit Japan is the new frontier.  Soon we may even want to get the lead out and head to China...Asia is where it is at.

[Bill_McBride]

It is time to get out of 2001 and admit Japan is the new frontier.  Soon we may even want to get the lead out and head to China...Asia is where it is at.

Maybe you should venture to the UK before making such judgments!

[Sean_A]

Scotland's not really a country in the political sense...  

Paging FBD! Paging FBD!

Bill

Hillside gets more accolades, but Wallasey is in the same class (in fact I prefer it).  It certainly gets my vote for top 100 in GB&I.  Sadly, I don't think Wallasey gets any mention for top 100.  I really don't understand why.

Ciao

[Tommy Williamsen]

I found it interesting that Ran included Beau Desert and Huntercomb.  I agree with that assessment but not too many would have six years ago because they were relatively unknow except to nuts like us.

[Marty Bonnar]

Scotland's not really a country in the political sense...  

Paging FBD! Paging FBD!

Bill

Hillside gets more accolades, but Wallasey is in the same class (in fact I prefer it).  It certainly gets my vote for top 100 in GB&I.  Sadly, I don't think Wallasey gets any mention for top 100.  I really don't understand why.

Ciao

Sean, I was going to let it slide. As we are currently STILL atop our Euro qualifying group, I am in a state of grace seldom experienced by the be-kilted ones. Why is there no 'Om' emoticon when one needs one?

http://www.uefa.com/competitions/euro/standings/index.html

F.

[Jack_Marr]

I'd say Scotland could be the finest country for golf, followed by England.

America should probably be compared to Europe, size-wise.

[Mark Pearce]

In the last two weeks I've had the pleasure of playing Silloth, Ganton and Alwoodley.  Each of these belongs on Ran's list of great English courses.  The question that immediately sprung to mind when I saw Ran's post was, if England is second, which of Ireland or Scotland is first?  Or are they competing for third?

[Tony Dear]

Ran's list is a fine one but room should be made for West Lancs and Formby, two of my favorites in England (can we fit 22 courses into a top 20? No? Okay, take out Ashdown Forest and Westward Ho!). And although Britain, or the UK, or the British Isles, is clearly the obvious choice as No. 2, I'm surprised no one mentioned Australia yet...or have they?

[Sean Walsh]

Mark,

I would have England ahead of Ireland on variety and also depth.  Australia probably suffers on both these factors compared to England also.

On what I have seen I wouldn't have Scotland all that far ahead of England on the finest country for golf measure.  

Now if that doesn't get me chased out of St Andrews nothing will

[Jack_Marr]

Mark,

I would have England ahead of Ireland on variety and also depth.  Australia probably suffers on both these factors compared to England also.

I think that's probably correct, but it may be slightly over-egged. Ireland's second tier suffers in this regard because probably 99% of visitors come to see our big draw courses. So visitors just don't know about courses like the Grange, the Curragh, Tramore, Little Island, Skerries, Lucan, Headfort Old...

[Ed Tilley]

Mark,

I would have England ahead of Ireland on variety and also depth.  Australia probably suffers on both these factors compared to England also.

I think that's probably correct, but it may be slightly over-egged. Ireland's second tier suffers in this regard because probably 99% of visitors come to see our big draw courses. So visitors just don't know about courses like the Grange, the Curragh, Tramore, Little Island, Skerries, Lucan, Headfort Old...

I've played Little Island - nice enough course but wouldn't even get a mention if it was in England. If that's included in the Irish second tier then I think the difference in depth is under-egged! However, I really liked Rosslare - that's a good second tier course.

[Jack_Marr]

Mark,

I would have England ahead of Ireland on variety and also depth.  Australia probably suffers on both these factors compared to England also.

I think that's probably correct, but it may be slightly over-egged. Ireland's second tier suffers in this regard because probably 99% of visitors come to see our big draw courses. So visitors just don't know about courses like the Grange, the Curragh, Tramore, Little Island, Skerries, Lucan, Headfort Old...

I've played Little Island - nice enough course but wouldn't even get a mention if it was in England. If that's included in the Irish second tier then I think the difference in depth is under-egged! However, I really liked Rosslare - that's a good second tier course.

I was really just listing courses off the top of my head that most visitors would not have played, and I mentioned Little Island one because McKenzie was involved. So I belive it would get a mention in England for that reason alone.

Personally, I don't like Rosslare that much. But there you go.

I have no desire to rank Ireland above or below anywhere, to be honest. I'm very happy with what we have regardless of what exists elsewhere. There are many many superb courses that visitors will never know about, and that's fine too.

[Paul_Turner]

What happened to the original replies to this thread in 01??