[John Kavanaugh]

We seem pretty familiar with the UK but how do we compare with let's say Japan, India or Sweden for instance.  Are we the slowest most borish golfers in the world...or do we travel well.  Are our courses more crowded, firmer, longer or greens faster....what differences do you find and where...

[Tony_Muldoon]

I've played more in France than in the US so I can't do direct comparisons, but there is a particularly French golf culture(based on playing courses during the summer holiday period).

Firstly it is very common for Husband and Wife to play golf together.  Pick up a copy of the Peugeot Guide and see how most clubs offer a disclunt rate for couples. Also in my experience it's not the man who's going to beat you.  Possibly as a result of the couples I've always found the clubs very wellcoming.

Secondly, overwatering is unbelievable. I've played at midday in 35 degree haet and haf the fairway still has standing water from the soaking it got the night before.


Everone seems to dress well for golf but if it's that hot, shirtails out are fine.

I like seeing women out on the course.

[RJ_Daley]

Well, I can't say from personal knowledge.  But some of my regular golf pals go to Japan, Philipines and Thailand every year and from what they describe about pace of play and superfluous ritual rigamorole, I'd think most GCA.com types would go nuts.

[John_Cullum]

How popular is the golf cart in these other countries?

[Sean_A]

John

I have played in Sweden, Japan, Spain, France and Italy.  With the exception of Italy (only one course mind you), all the games were slow.  Courses were overwatered (except a few in southern France) and the people were extremely engaging.  

Easily the best experience I have had outside of US, UK and Ireland was at Circolo Golf del Venezia.  The club is on the Lido in the small village of Alberoni, maybe 8  miles from St. Marks.  An easy boat and bus ride.  The course is quite old and built on a sandy bit by the sea and has several very good holes.  The club is extremely friendly and serves excellent food and wine at great prices.  I think we paid 70 Euros for golf and an excellent 2 hour meal.  The only strange thing is explaining why you are taking sticks to Venice.  Next time I go to Venice I will certainly bring my sticks.

Ciao

Sean

[Ulrich Mayring]

I hear that we in Germany have the highest percentage of women on courses world-wide, about 40% all in all. Pace of play is slow, rarely under 4 hours, but I don't mind much either way. Doesn't make much sense to get worked up over this too much. Rules of Golf are observed usually, no Jeans and T-shirts and a lot of vanity handicaps. Also, not a lot of really pretty courses here, but most are playable. My highlights are when I go on vacation in Spain, France or Italy, the UK, Sweden - there's some nice courses.

Ulrich

[John Kavanaugh]

Thank you Ulrich...You say there are not many pretty courses in Germany.  Most courses in the US that are considered beautiful are because of outside natural features.  What does Germany have going for it in that department...and why aren't there golf courses exploiting them.

[John Kavanaugh]

Looks like Ulrich bailed on me...Can anyone else explain why courses in Germany would not be as pretty as anywhere else.  Or in keeping with this thread...Which country has the most beautiful courses outside of the UK..

[Ulrich Mayring]

I'm here, I'm here, have patience ;-)

The issue in Germany is that it's a very crowded country. Imagine, we have 80 million people, that's about a third of the US population, and all of that in an area considerably smaller than California.

So there are not that many open spaces with beautiful natural features left. Of those that are left, most are environmentally protected and thus not available.

Also, until a decade or so ago Golf was a non-issue here, so a course here and there was sufficient. We do have a number of old courses, maybe 10 or so, which have the charm of in-grown parkland. But we do not have a Pete Dye course, nothing from Robert Trent Jones or Donald Ross, not even von Hagge

But France, Spain, even Italy have these courses.

Ulrich

[Michael Dugger]

Looks like Ulrich bailed on me...Can anyone else explain why courses in Germany would not be as pretty as anywhere else.  Or in keeping with this thread...Which country has the most beautiful courses outside of the UK..

Australia
New Zealand
Canada
Dom. Repub

You know this answer John

[Bill_McBride]

Ulrich, I played with two of my colleagues at the private club in Dusseldorf in maybe 1993.  We were told by the hotel that we would have no problem getting on but we had to talk our way in, which wasn't easy since no one spoke English and our German was worse!

I noticed once on the course with rented clubs (very good ones) that there was somewhat of a disconnect between how we play in the US and how they played in Dusseldorf.

For example, once we hit a ball more than 5 yards off the fairway, we were in thick knee high rough.  Playing with strange clubs, we hit a lot of off line shots and spent a lot of time searching.

The players on adjacent holes seemed a bit awkward about the game, as if they hadn't been playing too long.  I think is probably actually the case, right?

It was also disconcerting to play a 400 metre par 4 and realize that's 440 yards!

It got dark before we could finish, after 4 hrs on the course.  All in all an okay but odd experience.  But I'd love to go back!

[Steve Lang]

 

The USA is now populated by over 295 million folks ... so shouldn't there at least be some pro-rating in these comparisons?

[Jim Nugent]

Also, until a decade or so ago Golf was a non-issue here, so a course here and there was sufficient. We do have a number of old courses, maybe 10 or so, which have the charm of in-grown parkland. But we do not have a Pete Dye course, nothing from Robert Trent Jones or Donald Ross, not even von Hagge

That makes Langer even more of a phenom.  How did he become one of the world's top golfers, in a country with little golf?

[Eric Franzen]

Also, until a decade or so ago Golf was a non-issue here, so a course here and there was sufficient. We do have a number of old courses, maybe 10 or so, which have the charm of in-grown parkland. But we do not have a Pete Dye course, nothing from Robert Trent Jones or Donald Ross, not even von Hagge

Ulrich,

I would chose Falkenstein any day over the Robert Trent Jones courses that I have played so far.

[Eric Franzen]

Are we the slowest most borish golfers in the world...or do we travel well.  Are our courses more crowded, firmer, longer or greens faster....what differences do you find and where...

Slow play is very common in Sweden. Besides how some courses show their love for thick knee high rain forest rough I would say that the handicap system, which allow registration of social rounds, is to blame...

[Richard Muldoon]

The sense of humour of all golfers seems to be just as sad everywhere.
I played a round in Spain last year with 3 Germans.
On the 1st tee one of them knocked the ball off the tee  when taking his stance. At this point one of the others said 'Ein'.

[TomSteenstrup]

I've played a couple of courses in France and agree: The watering is - well you have to see it to believe it. Yikes. Best course I ever played was also the worst maintained: Coore's Golf du Medoc.

The courses in Denmark, where I'm at, are mostly more low-key than US courses and not too many are that well designed (unnecessary blind shots, boring greens, lack of interesting bunkering). Some courses have way too much unkept rough, but that has decreased in recent years.

Unless you play around Copenhagen, the prices are very reasonable, and you wouldn't have a problem hooking up with locals for a good round of relaxed golf. Slow play is common when the weather is nice - too many members, or in the case of Copenhagen: Too many golfers in general. Like Germany, we lack good land for good new courses. We have some nice coastal areas with dunes, but that land is completely off limits for golf courses.

I've heard many good things about the courses in Southern Sweden. Nice layouts, nice surroundings, good conditions.

Danish golfers: Just like anywhere else, they complain about the others being too slow and take too long on and around the greens. They do play by the rules though. I'd just wish that more would play match play.

[tonyt]

If I ever need reminding this is a US-centric site, I just wait until the next reference to some "non-existence" of the game of needing the ball to bounce twice instead of only once short of the green with a mid iron to prevent the ball going over the back.

My advice would be for Americans to stop falsely believing that what is normal in the US is normal everywhere.

[Brian Phillips]

John Kav.,

The courses in Germany have strict enviromental restrictions on the sites.  On many sites an architect will not be allowed to change the height the exisiting ground more than +/- 1m.

Here in Norway we have some similar restrictions but not that often.

The standard of golf in Norway is very, very poor and very slow...'in general'.  We do of course have exceptions to the rule but not many. A five hour round is not frowned upon.

The reason for this is that no one plays matchplay and it is all pencil and scorecard golf.

[Jack_Marr]

American golfers are always noticable over here because they are so well turned out. Half the players here have mud half way up their trousers, while the golfers from the U.S. are imaculate.

[Sean_A]

Jack

You are right.  Americans (including myself obviously) are spotted fairly easily.  They dress more in golf gear rather than a mix of golf/street gear.  This is changing though.  Loads of Brits/Irish are starting to emulate Americans and turn up with logos, chinos and ball caps.  

Ciao

Sean

[Ulrich Mayring]

For example, once we hit a ball more than 5 yards off the fairway, we were in thick knee high rough.  Playing with strange clubs, we hit a lot of off line shots and spent a lot of time searching.

True. Most American courses are geared towards getting the Golfers round the course quickly, over here they don't pay much attention to that. You'll find all sorts of quirky designs, for example my home course has a 210 yard Par 4 (although I haven't seen anyone reaching it so far).

That makes Langer even more of a phenom.  How did he become one of the world's top golfers, in a country with little golf?

He's a one-of-a-kind type of guy. He started as a caddie and worked his way up against all odds. Today we have a fairly good scene, one of our lads even won the last British Boys. But in Langer's time it must have been very hard coming up.

I would chose Falkenstein any day over the Robert Trent Jones courses that I have played so far.

Yeah, one of the ten or so. But if you're not a member in the right club, you can't get on

Anyway, I guess the largest difference is the 40% ladies and perhaps the fact that 99% of all Golfers have a handicap (you can't get on most courses without one). The average handicap, btw, is around 33 and it goes up to 54.

Ulrich

[Tiger_Bernhardt]

I like seeing attractive women playing golf and especially bending over almost anywhere. I played a number of rounds and courses in Belgium a few years ago. i did not notice any difference in style manner or pace of play over playing anywhere in UK.

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