Dawson again waits to report rules infraction

[Michael Moore]

Here's the latest

http://golfdigest.com/newsandtour/index.ssf?/newsandtour/gw20040206dawson.html

Marco's caddy is called Mike Moore.

[JohnV]

I read the article in Golf World last week and it seemed to me that Dawson was probably blameless in the Brandell Chamblee incident, but in the Toledo one he definitely seemed to have his doubts long before the cards were turned in and should have raised them just to make sure that all was ok.  In the Chamblee incident he didn't realize what had happened until his wife asked him after the round.

[A_Clay_Man]

The only way Dawson escapes scot-free from wrong doing is if he did these things because it is important to him to get "it" right. If he truely believes that than I am with him. Estabans arguement that Dawson said "ok" when informed about the drop to the right of the gur, seems like poor a justification as a response.

[Tony_Chapman]

I found this article quite interesting. And, my thoughts all along were that - especially on tour when you do this for a living - would be to get an official. They pay the officials for a reason, don't they? Don't you guys, through your work, double check something that is important to make sure you get it right.

Better yet, if you knew some one at your company was doing something wrong and you found out about it, would you at least feel the need to notify somebody. It appeared to me that Dawson - in the Chamblee incident - was just trying to get something clarified.

I question the Toledo situation, though. He claimed to have never seen the drop, so who knows what was going through his head. It did appear that he had doubts before the round was over, so he should have brought them up at that point.

[tonyt]

Apologies for threadjack. I've been meaning to ask a rules "quickie'.

If a player plays a provisional ball from the tee in case his first is lost, and finds the original ball but deems it unplayable, may he choose the play from original place option and play the already struck mprovisional ball? Or must he return to hit a third ball from the tee?

[JohnV]

Tony, a provisional ball is strictly played for a ball that might be out-of-bounds or lost outside a water hazard.  Once the original ball is found (within 5 minutes) the provisional must be abandoned.  Therefore, if you decide that the original is unplayable and choose to use option A under the unplayable rule, you must go back and play from where you last played (the tee in your example.)  The reason for this is that otherwise the player would have the option of choosing which ball's position he liked better.  The Rules are designed so that you don't get to pick and choose between balls like that.

[Jeff Goldman]

Tonyt:

   I believe this happened to Mickelson in a tourney playoff last year, where he hit his drive into a big forest/ravine of junk, hit a provisional, and asked people not to look for the original.  Someone found it within the 5 minutes, and Mickelson could not play the provisional.  He deemed the found ball unplayable, there was no where good to drop, and he went back and re-teed.

Jeff Goldman

[tonyt]

Too true. I knew the Phil scenario too, so I should have thought of it at the time.

Thank you gentlemen.

[A.G._Crockett]

As a HS golf coach, whose players play without the benefit of officials, I tell them to ALWAYS play a second ball if there is ANY question of a rule or a drop, because they are ALWAYS going to get it wrong in the heat of the moment.  The tour version of this would ALWAYS call an official.

I can forgive Dawson on the grounds that his focus on his round might be so complete, as might his trust of fellow competitors, that until later when he settles down, it just doesn't all compute.  It is unfortunate timing, and a LOT of coincidence, but I'm not sure I understand how he becomes the bad guy to the extent that he has.

[Dan Kelly]

... it seemed to me that Dawson was probably blameless in the Brandell Chamblee incident, but in the Toledo one he definitely seemed to have his doubts long before the cards were turned in and should have raised them just to make sure that all was ok.

I'm no expert, but JohnV is -- and I think he's nailed it here.

Chamblee has a lot of nerve, I think, suggesting that Dawson has an "agenda." What Dawson NEEDS is an agenda, beginning with: 1. Deal with all rules suspicions As Soon As Possible.

[JohnV]

AG, I don't know if you read the article, but it seems that in the case of Toledo, Dawson definitely had his doubts before the cards were turned in but said nothing.  That is the wrong thing to do.

I don't know if you've asked your local association, but I'm sure they be willing to help.  I know that we've tried to offer our support to High School golf, but the coaches around here turned us down because we insist they play by the rules and they seem to want to bend them for things like being late to the tee etc.

[A.G._Crockett]

JohnV
We have officials from the various junior tours (Southeastern, AJGA, etc.) at some of the bigger tournaments, and of course the host PGA pros are available at the conclusion of matches to clear up rules questions.  We play a nine-hole match almost every day in March and April, though, and the sheer volume would preclude getting officials at each event.

If being late to the tee was "bent" by the coaches, it may have to do with safety and liability concerns.  There is some pretty heavy case law about the liability of a school and/or coach if something happens to a player on the way to an off-campus athletic event, so we try to educate them that hurrying is a big no-no, even if it means that they are late.

[JohnV]

AG,
No, it usually has to do with the kid that is on the practice putting green BS'ing with his friends.  Then when he doesn't get there, the coach asks, "Can't you waive it just this one time?"

Actually, I'm not trying to disparage all coaches, but there are some who do this and then either they get upset and don't ask us back or we get tired of being asked to bend the rules and choose not to come back.

Evidently before I came to Western PA we used to help out at some leagues events but for reasons like this we aren't invited anymore.  We have said we'd love to help out, but we would insist on the rules being enforced.

PS, this has also happened at college events.  There is a coach who got his school disinvited from one event because of his actions.  We did appreciate the host school's coach doing that.