help re Bidermann near Wilmington

[mark chalfant]

  Ive recently seen some fine designs by Dick Wilson.


Is anyone familar with this Delaware course that he did ?

some details re terrain, routing, and strategic options would be appreciated.

Also,please mention the relative size and undulation present in the green complexes at this course

Thanks   !

[Scott_Burroughs]

Mark,

I've never played it, but drove by it a number of time in the
early 90's when I worked a few miles away.  I showed
Bidermann as Aerial of the Day #78 in early 2002.
Here's that thread (scroll down for Bidermann:  
http://www.golfclubatlas.com/forums2/index.php?board=1;action=display;threadid=4240 )
or here's just the plain aerial itself:



The new holes by the clubhouse were done by Gil Hanse  -
from above, the one with the fairway bunkers reminds me of
#7 at Inniscrone, a nearby Hanse course.

Tom Paul knows Bidermann and I hope he chimes in at some point.

[TEPaul]

Yes, I know Bidermann. Probably played it a half dozen or a dozen times over a number of years. If a form of informal reciprocity exists around here I'd say it would exist between GMGC, Sunnybrook and Bidermann. There's an annual tournament that exists between them over a weekend known as the Menage-a-Trois tournament. The team competition rotates between the three courses over the weekend.

Bidermann is a Dick Wilson golf course that was built and privately owned by the Dupont family. It's contiguous to the otherwordly beautiful Winterthur (sp?) estate that was the home of one of the Duponts and contains perhaps the world's finest collection of American furniture.

Bidermann is now a private club with unbelievably light rounds per year. I believe it's now connected to the so-called Vicmead Hunt club, a nearby hunt club. The clubhouse of Bidermann is extremely unique--it's a small and lovely little colonial farmhouse and the lockerrooms and pro shop are in old farm's barn.

The Dick Wilson course is on truly lovely rolling terrain, it's set in a general area that's almost as pretty as any in the country and it's a really fine golf course--that I believe has some real tee choice elasticity to it. I can go around the course and the routing in my head just fine but I may be a bit light on some of the real details (features) of the course.

Gil Hanse did redesign the old Dick Wilson #17 and #18 to make more room for a practice range and those holes have been somewhat controversial with the club. The reasons those holes were or are controversial certainly does involve a story that has two sides to the coin, so to speak, however.

I just thought of it this very minute and it is an odd coincidence but the respected head pro at Bidermann happens to be named Dick Wilson and he doubles in the winter as the head pro at the Everglades in Palm Beach Florida.

[Patrick_Mucci]

TEPaul,

Describe the hole in the top center of the photo, it appears to have a fairway wing.   Is that for lady golfers or does the hole have two pars 4/5 ?

[TEPaul]

Pat:

The hole you mention is one with a very interesting use of topography. It's a long par 4 and from the tee you have a choice of playing sort of uphill to the left section of the fairway which makes the approach much longer. Or for long hitters there's a choice of playing to the right fairway--that lobe you see! To play to that right lobe you have to hit the tee shot over a hill and as I recall that lobe is lower than the left fairway but much shorter into the green. I think that right lobe section is blind from the tee and the light brown area between the fairways is part of the hill the tee shot must carry over to the lower right lobe.

[Patrick_Mucci]

TEPaul,

Was that part of the original Dick Wilson design, or was it implemented afterward.

It is a most unusual feature, even for Wilson.

How do the members like it, and what do you guestimate are the usage figures on the option ?

[mark chalfant]

  Scott, Tom, and  Patrick, thanks for your help on this.


Wonder if anyone Phila. area folks maybe Mike, Adam, or Craig

know this course.....


Thanks for any info

Mark

th

[Adam_Messix]

Mark--

I personally think that Bidermann is Dick Wilson the designer's best work.  The course rolls very gently through the back end of Winterthur Gardens and can actually be seen from one of the tour roads that goes through the gardens.  The course was still under construction when Wilson passed away, and even though Joe Lee was Wilson's full partner at the time, he was not brought in to finish the course from what I have been told.  

Bidermann has a rather interesting start, a short, sharp-doglegged, drivable par 4 with a large and inviting green.  Most players, myself included, will play the 1st as a long iron or fairway wood and a pitch.  The 2nd is a relatively short par 5, with a narrow well protected green.  After 2, the cakewalk is pretty much over as the course gets tough.  The only easy hole, being the short par 5 sixth.  The holes that I really like are the long uphill 3rd, the short par 4 fifth hole that has a great with excellent internal contouring, the short par 4 7th that has a severely tilted green (the only green that reminds me of Deepdale), and the long 10th with a plateau green. The best stretch of holes though are from 14 through 16.  The 14th is the double-fairway hole mentioned earlier.  It handsomely rewards a well-played fading drive that hugs the tree line will gain an additional 40 yards of roll down a hill.  The 15th is a pretty downhill par 5 with trouble down the entire left side of the hole.  The 16th is a really long par 3 to a green that has a reasonable amount of back to front tilt.  

The last two holes were relocated in recent years by Gil Hanse to accomodate the enlargement of the practice tee.  They are two pretty good par 4 holes that have some nice character to them.  However, I loved the old, monster par 4 17th (468 yards I think) that went straight uphill seemingly forever.

The other thing that I really like about Bidermann is that it has a great low-key atmosphere that is hard to beat.  

[Jason Mandel]

Mark-
I don't know much about the course, although I can concur that the club is very low key, very private, can't recall the last time they've hosted a GAP event.  As TE Paul said, the club is very tightly associated with Sunnybrook and Gulph Mills.

the head pro at my club used to be an assistant there and I'd be happy to put you in touch with him if you'd like.

Jason Mandel