Zeon Zoysia

[Ira Fishman]

Playing characteristics of Zeon Zoysia? Can green approaches be fast and firm?


Thanks.

[Ben Hollerbach]

Zeon specifically? Not sure, but I just laid down a whole bunch in my back yard so I’ll report back in a few months. Zeon is suppose to be pretty drought resistant so it seems possible.


East Lake put down Zorro Zoysia in the fairways and Prism Zoysia for the approaches, probably still early but they seemed to play fairly firm last year.

[Mike H]

My club installed zeon zoysia 4 years ago.  From what i've seen the only time you will get firm and fast is when it's going dormant, it's a fantastic surface when dormant.  You can get firm conditions in the summer but the zoysia still has a little grab to it during the growing season. 

[ward peyronnin]

Biltmore Forest has zeon and I recall it is very playable around the greens. Much better than paspalum and can be moewd much tighter than regular zoysia. And it was so tight that green/surround margin was almost seamless.

[Tom_Doak]

When regular golfers who are not turf managers start talking here about name-brand cultivars of grass, it makes me want to cry.  It’s clearly a triumph of marketing.


There are a bunch of new zoysia grasses out there, and I know precious little about them.  They certainly have some advantages over Bermuda (stay greener longer, need less chemicals) but also at least one big disadvantage (slow growing so you have to sod them at $$$ upfront cost).


I have urged one of my clients to do comparison tests at our site, because I don’t think there is enough track record to make confident decisions about what species and cultivars are best for a given locale.  But it was to no avail, the salesmen are too strong.

[Ben Sims]

Preach.

I spent a great deal of my own money and the US governments money on advanced degree turf classes at Penn State and I can proudly state that I have no idea what cultivar of grass is on any of the places I play. Sure I can tell if it’s bluegrass, bent, or Bermuda. But that’s about it. And I’m not sure why anyone would care.

[Ira Fishman]

Ben,


I care and asked the question because I enjoy/rely on the ground game. One of our courses is thinking about switching to zeon zoysia, and it must my understanding from previous posts by superintendents and turf experts that some versions of zoysia can be quite “sticky”. Hence, my question because I do not pretend to be an expert.


Ira

[Ben Sims]

Ben,


I care and asked the question because I enjoy/rely on the ground game. One of our courses is thinking about switching to zeon zoysia, and it must my understanding from previous posts by superintendents and turf experts that some versions of zoysia can be quite “sticky”. Hence, my question because I do not pretend to be an expert.


Ira

Ira,


My style of writing has angered. Sorry, not the intent. My opinion is that cultivation and management practices—unless we’re talking sand soil with a fine fescue sward—is a larger determining factor than cultivar for ground-based shots.

[Don Mahaffey]

Like most fine turf grasses, Zeon can be fast, or slow. Thick or thin, glowing green or dull. Not trying to insult anyone here but...it's the turf manager stupid!


There was a time when it seemed like brown was going to be the new green and maybe we'd try to do more without needing every bell and whistle. That time, in my recent experience has passed. One sure way to be shut out in this business, as Mike Young has always said, is tell someone they don't need something. That is the kiss of death in this industry.

[Ira Fishman]

Ben,


I care and asked the question because I enjoy/rely on the ground game. One of our courses is thinking about switching to zeon zoysia, and it must my understanding from previous posts by superintendents and turf experts that some versions of zoysia can be quite “sticky”. Hence, my question because I do not pretend to be an expert.


Ira

Ira,


My style of writing has angered. Sorry, not the intent. My opinion is that cultivation and management practices—unless we’re talking sand soil with a fine fescue sward—is a larger determining factor than cultivar for ground-based shots.

Ben,


Not angry in the least but appreciate your post.

[John Emerson]

Traditional methods of turfgrass management, especially in regards to nutrient management (and water to a certain extent), are a sure fire way to make zoysiagrass, and any other species or cultivar of grass for that matter, poor for use under closer mowing heights. Is the cultivar important? Absolutely and emphatically yes! But, one can have the greatest cultivar of all time and if it isn't managed properly it will not provide the surface one was anticipating.

[archie_struthers]

 


The more it changes the more it stays the same. The year 1975 Eberhard Steiniger the superintendent at Pine Valley Golf Club in Clementon , NJ , a decorated and learned man was still messing around with "wonder grasses " of the zoysia genus. 


When the GOAT Dick Bator came and hated same, it took him years to eradicate the weed, so beware !

[Anthony_Nysse]

Playing characteristics of Zeon Zoysia? Can green approaches be fast and firm?


Thanks.

• Off the top of my head, these courses have it. We have all seen some of them play first, fast or slow & spongy.
• Valhalla Golf Club.
• Bellerive Country Club.
• Grove XXIII.
• Brambles Golf Club (California)
• Bluejack National
• The Olympic Course (Brazil)
• Trinity Forrest
• Cordilla Ranch
• Atlanta Athletic Club
• As with most turfgrasses, playability is not fully depended on grass type. More often than not, it's how the turf is maintained.
  [/size][/color]
  [/size]Contrary to TD's comment, they do require more chemicals than bermudagrass in the same region. They are prone to patch disease & leaf spot. [/color]

[archie_struthers]

 


Anthony, best of luck in your new job at Apogee. I was fortunate enough to visit last week and it's quite a project. Loved the firm and fast fairways and greens and the ability to play on the ground or the air.


As many here have already discussed it's the archer not the arrow when it comes to turfgrass maintenance. I'm just not sold on zoysia, given the history.

[Tom_Doak]

• [size=78%][/size]Contrary to TD's comment, they do require more chemicals than bermudagrass in the same region. They are prone to patch disease & leaf spot. [size=78%][/size][/size]

Thanks Anthony.  I shouldn’t have listened to the salesman!   

[Kyle Harris]

• [size=78%][/size]Contrary to TD's comment, they do require more chemicals than bermudagrass in the same region. They are prone to patch disease & leaf spot.

Thanks Anthony.  I shouldn’t have listened to the salesman!   

Was about to chime in here... the disease pressure seems to be higher.

In general, the farther the genetics move from the parent plant the more brittle the plant. We are about at Hapsburg level here with almost everything.

419 has been the stalwart for decades now. For good reason.

[Anthony_Nysse]

• [/size]Contrary to TD's comment, they do require more chemicals than bermudagrass in the same region. They are prone to patch disease & leaf spot. [size=78%]

Thanks Anthony.  I shouldn’t have listened to the salesman!   

Was about to chime in here... the disease pressure seems to be higher.

In general, the farther the genetics move from the parent plant the more brittle the plant. We are about at Hapsburg level here with almost everything.

419 has been the stalwart for decades now. For good reason.

If you can find the old 419, I'm still not sure the newer varies are infinitely better. I think Tiftuff is more of a modern 419.

[Kyle Harris]

• Contrary to TD's comment, they do require more chemicals than bermudagrass in the same region. They are prone to patch disease & leaf spot.

[size=78%]Thanks Anthony.  I shouldn’t have listened to the salesman!   
[/size]

[size=78%]

Was about to chime in here... the disease pressure seems to be higher.

In general, the farther the genetics move from the parent plant the more brittle the plant. We are about at Hapsburg level here with almost everything.

419 has been the stalwart for decades now. For good reason. [/size]

[size=78%]


If you can find the old 419, I'm still not sure the newer varies are infinitely better. I think Tiftuff is more of a modern 419.
[/size]

[size=78%]


You mispelled Bimini.  [/size]

[Anthony_Nysse]

• Contrary to TD's comment, they do require more chemicals than bermudagrass in the same region. They are prone to patch disease & leaf spot.

[size=78%]Thanks Anthony.  I shouldn’t have listened to the salesman!   
[/size]

[size=78%]

Was about to chime in here... the disease pressure seems to be higher.

In general, the farther the genetics move from the parent plant the more brittle the plant. We are about at Hapsburg level here with almost everything.

419 has been the stalwart for decades now. For good reason. [/size]

[size=78%]


If you can find the old 419, I'm still not sure the newer varies are infinitely better. I think Tiftuff is more of a modern 419.
[/size]

[size=78%]


You mispelled Bimini.  [/size]

Not a believer yet. Concern about segregation with a turftype found in a field vs one genetically modified in a lab.

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