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Don Mahaffey

Design elements for a windy site
« on: March 24, 2025, 12:47:06 PM »
Like most here I've experienced UK links golf in the wind, albeit a lot less than many here. I've also played Bandon in the wind, and 100s of rounds at Wolf Point back when I cared for the course and it was in very sporty condition.


Some of my favorite design elements on a windy site:
- Short par 3s into the prevailing wind. I realize you have to design something that can be played in any wind, and that would seem to be an opening in front where the ball can be landed short and fed onto the green - into the wind you can over club and punch something in low, and downwind you can play short and bounce on. But what else? Deep green? Maybe a green angles R-L or L-R with shaping to allow players to use slopes to get close? Bunkers below the green surface that balls may feed into - probably offer a challenge but also helping keep players in the game on windy days?


-Down wind reachable par 5s with some "playable" trouble long?


- What elements do you see used best on crosswind holes where the best players may be able to hold a shot against the wind but the average guy has to just try and stop the wind from blowing his ball off the hole?


Ally Mcintosh

Re: Design elements for a windy site
« Reply #1 on: March 24, 2025, 02:24:23 PM »
I’ll come back to add a few later. But just to pick up on your first point, my favourite shot in golf is a gripped down, punched iron that goes medium height and arrow-straight in to the wind on a short, links par-3.

Matt Schoolfield

Re: Design elements for a windy site
« Reply #2 on: March 24, 2025, 02:50:58 PM »
One of my favorite extreme wind holes is 11 at Silverknowes where I played on the weekends when I lived in Edinburgh.



Here there are a few interesting design features. The obvious one is the way the fairway bends in the direction of the wind so that there is a bit of forgiveness when playing in high winds. At the same time, there are bunkers that do double duty. In the wind, they catch balls played straight down the fairway instead of with an adjustment, and when it's calm, they act as regular old dogleg corner bunkers to add a bit of risk/reward to cutting the corner.

The other feature here is that the tee box is tucked away behind the trees, whereas the previous tee box is effectively in the fairway. This allows players who were paying attention on the previous tee box an advantage, but you're sheltered from the wind and have no way of knowing how much adjustment to make on the tee itself.

Finally, for players that miss right, the penal elements aren't too harsh, because it shortens the hole, but it also leaves a bunker to carry, and the greenside bunkers are shifted into the standard right-handers standard miss zones (long-left and short-right).

Fun stuff.
« Last Edit: March 24, 2025, 02:55:52 PM by Matt Schoolfield »

Ben Sims

Re: Design elements for a windy site
« Reply #3 on: March 24, 2025, 03:09:31 PM »
For holes you’re pretty sure will be mostly downwind, I think the mid to short length par 4 with fronting features is terrific. Whether that’s a large swale or bunkers matters little. Green sloping away from the player. The 13th at Machrihanish a terrific example. Long is the miss but most players forget this.

Michael Felton

Re: Design elements for a windy site
« Reply #4 on: March 24, 2025, 03:24:06 PM »
I’ll come back to add a few later. But just to pick up on your first point, my favourite shot in golf is a gripped down, punched iron that goes medium height and arrow-straight in to the wind on a short, links par-3.


Can't argue - on the 4th at Deal, I've hit every club from 3 iron to PW. Hitting a long iron from 140 because you have to is so much fun (and deeply unforgiving).

Thomas Dai

Re: Design elements for a windy site
« Reply #5 on: March 24, 2025, 03:53:18 PM »

An aspect I'd add is how the shape of the land, and not necessarily tree related, around a hole/greensite can influence the way the wind affects ball flight.
I'm thinking here of eddy's and wind currents, downdrafts and updrafts and hidden calm areas.
'Camouflage in the sky'?
I guess a hole/greensite could be deliberately chosen or constructed to be influenced in such a manner. Some likely may have been.
atb

Kyle Harris

Re: Design elements for a windy site
« Reply #6 on: March 24, 2025, 05:29:40 PM »
Feeding features into small but nasty bunkers that are visually separated from targets. Once the wind forces play along the ground they get much louder. Short and left of the green, especially, as most punch shots are over-hooked.
http://kylewharris.com

Constantly blamed by 8-handicaps for their 7 missed 12-footers each round.

“Split fairways are for teenagers.”

-Tom Doak

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