Sutton's Mix

[John Emerson]

I just cannot wrap my head around why these courses are so stuck on using varieties of grass from 100+ years ago. The gap is light years apart on turfgrass quality and performance. I cannot think of any good agronomic, playability, environmental, or economic reason other than "because we can" or "that's what we've always done"
#groupthink

Well Royal Melbourne might be the best conditioned course in the world.  In the 1980s they were convinced to get with the times and they changed their greens to Penncross    but now they’ve changed them back for the better

Tom,


We are in agreeance that RM is about as good as it gets for playing surfaces. My point is, at what cost? Penncross is such a poor grass compared to newer varieties that it is only put into trials to show how awful it is compared to newer cultivars. That doesn't seem like an apples to apples comparison. To assume one cannot achieve the same turf quality results (with less inputs) with new cultivars is nonsense. If one wants a fine fescue monostand or an mix of Agrostis species and festuca species there are plenty of new cultivars for all species that could be chosen that require less.

[John Emerson]

I just cannot wrap my head around why these courses are so stuck on using varieties of grass from 100+ years ago. The gap is light years apart on turfgrass quality and performance. I cannot think of any good agronomic, playability, environmental, or economic reason other than "because we can" or "that's what we've always done"
#groupthink

John


I would be curious to hear what kind of schedule you would advocate for when it comes to regrassing greens in an effort to harness the newest cultivars?

Grant,
That is a bit of a loaded question. Site specificity will dictate what could/should be done. Nevertheless, at the rate of current cultivar development, especially with the bentgrasses, if your greens are 20 years old or more I would encourage a re-grassing. It is night and day difference from just 20 years ago much less 100 years ago... FWIW Penncross, and to a lesser extent, A-1 finished dead last on average across all locations in the last round of bentgrass NTEP trials. There is not a single scenario in which I would recommend either.


I have seen great success with inter-seeding with newer varieties as well. For example, during an aerification or verticutting event. But one also has to slowly change their mgmt practices as to encourage the proliferation of the new cultivar introduced. Too much for this post to elaborate, but you get the idea.

[Matthew Delahunty]

I just cannot wrap my head around why these courses are so stuck on using varieties of grass from 100+ years ago. The gap is light years apart on turfgrass quality and performance. I cannot think of any good agronomic, playability, environmental, or economic reason other than "because we can" or "that's what we've always done"
#groupthink

Well Royal Melbourne might be the best conditioned course in the world.  In the 1980s they were convinced to get with the times and they changed their greens to Penncross    but now they’ve changed them back for the better

Tom,


We are in agreeance that RM is about as good as it gets for playing surfaces. My point is, at what cost? Penncross is such a poor grass compared to newer varieties that it is only put into trials to show how awful it is compared to newer cultivars. That doesn't seem like an apples to apples comparison. To assume one cannot achieve the same turf quality results (with less inputs) with new cultivars is nonsense. If one wants a fine fescue monostand or an mix of Agrostis species and festuca species there are plenty of new cultivars for all species that could be chosen that require less.

I think it would be a fallacy to suggest that the turf surfaces at RM are 100+ years old.  The "Suttons Mix" greens today are not like the pre-1988 greens (which was when the short-lived transition to Penncross occurred) .  They are effectively a new cultivar or mix of cultivars of the better strains of the original turf.


RM may face a day of reckoning when the herbicides and fungicides that are currently permitted are outlawed by legislation but, until then, why would you want to change what are the best putting surfaces anywhere?


It would be good to see more research into developing new cultivars of browntop bents that are more traffic/wear resistant and disease resistant.  The research on creeping bents over the past 40 years is light years ahead of browntop bent development for turf surfaces. 


Progress is afoot on the Sandbelt. Many of the courses have transitioned to Pure Distinction and other new bent types.  At my club (Spring Valley) we are about to lay down Oakley bentgrass on our greens, ushering in the latest generation of bentgrasses.  However, as Mike Clayton says, there is a difference between perfect turf and turf that is perfect for golf.  That is why the greens at RM should stay as they are (until conditions/regulations change such that they wouldn't be able to maintain the surfaces in the same manner as they are presented at the moment).   Transitioning to a different cultivar would forever change the way the course plays.

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