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Ronald Montesano

  • Total Karma: -42
Travis Course Showdown 2025
« on: January 28, 2025, 08:38:45 PM »

I don't have a voting protocol set up, but in the era of March Madness copycats and lookalikes, here's a 16-course battle for all the marbles.

New England Bracket: Cape Arundel vs. Ekwanok


Central NY Bracket: Yahnundasis vs. CC Troy


Western NY Bracket: Stafford vs. Orchard Park


Ontario Bracket: Cherry Hill vs. Lookout Point


Long Island Bracket: Garden City CC vs. Garden City GC


Garden State Bracket 1: North Jersey vs. Hollywood


Garden State Bracket 2: White Beeches vs. Canoe Brook


Rogue Bracket: Round Hill vs. CC Scranton




Travis, like many other architects, deserved a longer laundry list of CTR (courses that remain.) Thanks to the work of the Bruce H, the Jaeger K, the Brian S, the Tom D, perhaps (cue Lorax misty eyes) unless will become indeed.
Coming in 2025
~Robert Moses Pitch 'n Putt
~~Sag Harbor
~~~Chenango Valley
~~~~Sleepy Hollow
~~~~~Montauk Downs
~~~~~~Sunken Meadow
~~~~~~~Some other, posh joints ;)

Dan_Callahan

  • Total Karma: 2
Re: Travis Course Showdown 2025
« Reply #1 on: January 28, 2025, 08:48:00 PM »
As luck would have it, the only two Travis courses I've played are both in your New England bracket. Ekwanok wins in a blowout.

Ronald Montesano

  • Total Karma: -42
Re: Travis Course Showdown 2025
« Reply #2 on: January 29, 2025, 11:20:43 AM »
I appreciate that perspective, Dan. I've yet to play either course ... go figure.

Anyway, we're taking this debate to the people. The Travis Society (@wjtsociety on Instagram) will have a Club Clash 2025, for fun bragging rights. Hope to see you here and there
Coming in 2025
~Robert Moses Pitch 'n Putt
~~Sag Harbor
~~~Chenango Valley
~~~~Sleepy Hollow
~~~~~Montauk Downs
~~~~~~Sunken Meadow
~~~~~~~Some other, posh joints ;)

Scott Senior

  • Total Karma: 0
Re: Travis Course Showdown 2025
« Reply #3 on: January 29, 2025, 12:59:20 PM »
Followed and voted on Instagram....


Best,
Scott

Ronald Montesano

  • Total Karma: -42
Re: Travis Course Showdown 2025
« Reply #4 on: Yesterday at 06:05:13 AM »
In what might be considered a mild upset, Cape Arundel took down Ekwanok in the first match of round one. The voting was 60% to 40%, in favor of the Maine institution.

Match two IS will go live around 9 am EST USA this day (Friday, 1/31.) Unlike Twitter/X, Instagram polls last 24 hours, with no ability to adjust time frames. Things don't drag out, especially fun things. Hope to see you at @wjtsociety on #TheGram.

Oh, my manners. We'll see Yahnundasis and Country Club of Troy off in match the second.
« Last Edit: Yesterday at 09:38:21 AM by Ronald Montesano »
Coming in 2025
~Robert Moses Pitch 'n Putt
~~Sag Harbor
~~~Chenango Valley
~~~~Sleepy Hollow
~~~~~Montauk Downs
~~~~~~Sunken Meadow
~~~~~~~Some other, posh joints ;)

Dan_Callahan

  • Total Karma: 2
Re: Travis Course Showdown 2025
« Reply #5 on: Yesterday at 10:20:00 AM »
That makes my brain hurt. I just don't see it. Having played both courses, if I was given 10 rounds, I would use all 10 at Ekwanok.

Brian Finn

  • Total Karma: 1
Re: Travis Course Showdown 2025
« Reply #6 on: Yesterday at 10:24:49 AM »
That makes my brain hurt. I just don't see it. Having played both courses, if I was given 10 rounds, I would use all 10 at Ekwanok.
My guess is far more people have played Cape Arundel than Ekwanok and voted for Cape Arundel on that basis.  I don't think Instagram checks to ensure voters have actually played both. 

I've never played Ekwanok, but 10-0 is a very strong view.  I am not sure I have played a single course that I would choose 10-0 over Cape Arundel. 
New for 2025: Cabarrus CC...

Dan_Callahan

  • Total Karma: 2
Re: Travis Course Showdown 2025
« Reply #7 on: Yesterday at 10:33:09 AM »

I've never played Ekwanok, but 10-0 is a very strong view.  I am not sure I have played a single course that I would choose 10-0 over Cape Arundel.


I only say that because I've played both courses. If I hadn't played Arundel, I would hesitate to make a choice that lopsided. But having played both, it's an easy decision for me. I absolutely loved everything about Ekwanok. I would go so far as to say Ekwanok might be the most underrated/underappreciated course in New England. Likely, as you say, because not many people have played it. To be honest, I didn't think Arundel was all that great. It definitely has some greens that were worth seeing, but that was the extent of what I liked (other than the putting green, which is in an amazing spot, perched above the water).

Brian Finn

  • Total Karma: 1
Re: Travis Course Showdown 2025
« Reply #8 on: Yesterday at 10:36:37 AM »

I've never played Ekwanok, but 10-0 is a very strong view.  I am not sure I have played a single course that I would choose 10-0 over Cape Arundel.

I only say that because I've played both courses. If I hadn't played Arundel, I would hesitate to make a choice that lopsided. But having played both, it's an easy decision for me. I absolutely loved everything about Ekwanok. I would go so far as to say Ekwanok might be the most underrated/underappreciated course in New England. Likely, as you say, because not many people have played it. To be honest, I didn't think Arundel was all that great. It definitely has some greens that were worth seeing, but that was the extent of what I liked (other than the putting green, which is in an amazing spot, perched above the water).
Of course.  That makes sense.  I have heard only wonderful things about Ekwanok.  The one member I knew (a person I worked for many years ago) suggested to me that the membership is ok being mostly unknown. 
New for 2025: Cabarrus CC...

Dan_Callahan

  • Total Karma: 2
Re: Travis Course Showdown 2025
« Reply #9 on: Yesterday at 10:39:59 AM »
I think that's right. I've played there a few times over the years, and at no time did I see more than 2 or 3 other groups on the course. And these were peak summer rounds when every other course in Vermont would have been slammed. It's just an incredible, understated place.

zachary_car

  • Total Karma: 1
Re: Travis Course Showdown 2025
« Reply #10 on: Yesterday at 11:34:27 AM »
Ekwanok vs Arundel is (was) an intriguing matchup, somewhat akin to a round of 64 #8 vs #9 seed game pitting a very solid albeit perhaps slightly flawed power 4 conference school vs a scrappy, cohesive smaller conference champ punching above its weight in the NIL (juiced ball/clubhead) era.


At Ekwanok, I especially enjoy the north-to-south or south-to-north running holes on the eastern half of the property; however, the six parallel routed ones, which unfold up-and-down the mountainside beneath the clubhouse, start to get a bit sloggy for my liking, especially the last three after an arduous walk to get around the fifteen prior. They're all perfectly fine holes, in and of themselves; but, taken as a collective unit, they bog the whole feel of the course. Now, granted, I did play there with a screaming left side of my upper body, from being run over in men's league hockey two days prior, so perhaps my evaluation of its sloggyness has something to do with this.


Arundel's is a livelier, more intimate experience, with more variety and a better set of greens. Its primary issue, really, is the current reality of golf technology; but since this is a 2025 bracket, said reality played a part in my evaluation of the matchup. Simply put, Ekwanok's architecture plays a little more honestly right now, ultimately shifting my vote in its favor. When the whiffle ball comes into play, then I'd probably vote for Arundel. 


Match play:
1. push (two very good openers)
2. CA 1 up
3. AS
4. CA 1 up
5. CA 2 up
6. CA 1 up
7. AS
8. push
9. Ek 1 Up
10. Ek 2 up
11. Ek 1 up
12. Ek 2 up
13. push (two excellent holes)
14. Ek 1 up
15. Ek 2 up
16. push
17. Ek 1 up
18. AS


Off to Ot....




« Last Edit: Yesterday at 11:59:56 AM by zachary_car »

Joe Bausch

  • Total Karma: 1
Re: Travis Course Showdown 2025
« Reply #11 on: Yesterday at 01:31:13 PM »
FWIW, I had a great time at the Travis Society gathering in Sept 2019 at Ekwanok. Loved the course. Easy to photograph, too:

http://www80.homepage.villanova.edu/joseph.bausch/images/albums/Ekwanok/index.html

I have not played Cape Arundel.

However, I did play Palmer House and Ekwanok in the same day, probably only one of two people in the world to have accomplished such a feat.

Palmer House (make your tee time now for when the snow melts):

http://www80.homepage.villanova.edu/joseph.bausch/images/albums/PalmerHouse/index.html
@jwbausch (for new photo albums)
The site for the Cobb's Creek project:  https://cobbscreek.org/
Nearly all Delaware Valley golf courses in photo albums: Bausch Collection

MCirba

  • Total Karma: 2
Re: Travis Course Showdown 2025
« Reply #12 on: Yesterday at 03:01:55 PM »
Palmer House is unique, that's for sure.


Anyone who thinks Pinehurst #2's greens are like playing to the hood of a car ain't seen nuthin' compared to The Palmer.
« Last Edit: Yesterday at 03:09:17 PM by MCirba »
"Persistence and determination alone are omnipotent" - Calvin Coolidge

https://cobbscreek.org/

Rob Marshall

  • Total Karma: -3
Re: Travis Course Showdown 2025
« Reply #13 on: Yesterday at 03:55:17 PM »
I love Stafford. I've played it many times in tournaments and just fun rounds. The 11th green is a great example of what was probably a great green when green speeds were 7. But at 10 you can really only use a few pins. It's a shame that great old greens become obsolete because of green speed.


Haven't seen the new bunker renovations.
If life gives you limes, make margaritas.” Jimmy Buffett

Andrew Carr

  • Total Karma: 1
Re: Travis Course Showdown 2025
« Reply #14 on: Yesterday at 11:31:24 PM »
For anyone who has not seen CC of Scranton, DM me and I would be happy to host.  We are happy to announce that Brian Schneider has been formally brought on to consult for us.

Ronald Montesano

  • Total Karma: -42
Re: Travis Course Showdown 2025
« Reply #15 on: Today at 09:07:19 AM »
Match two is in the books, and Country Club of Troy moves on to join Cape Arundel in the quarterfinals.

There's a reason they call it the "popular vote." Troy leveraged the power of social media, while Yahnny did not. The WJTS invites both clubs to collaborate with the post, to even the field. At the end of the vote, it's all for fun, with no prizes nor true ranking involved.

We may have a few surprises along the way, so enjoy the mid-winter fun.

Next up and live now: Stafford vs. Orchard Park
Coming in 2025
~Robert Moses Pitch 'n Putt
~~Sag Harbor
~~~Chenango Valley
~~~~Sleepy Hollow
~~~~~Montauk Downs
~~~~~~Sunken Meadow
~~~~~~~Some other, posh joints ;)

Joe Bausch

  • Total Karma: 1
Re: Travis Course Showdown 2025
« Reply #16 on: Today at 10:21:43 AM »
For anyone who has not seen CC of Scranton, DM me and I would be happy to host.  We are happy to announce that Brian Schneider has been formally brought on to consult for us.


This is fantastic news. CCofS is one of my favorite courses.
@jwbausch (for new photo albums)
The site for the Cobb's Creek project:  https://cobbscreek.org/
Nearly all Delaware Valley golf courses in photo albums: Bausch Collection

MCirba

  • Total Karma: 2
Re: Travis Course Showdown 2025
« Reply #17 on: Today at 10:37:13 AM »
For anyone who has not seen CC of Scranton, DM me and I would be happy to host.  We are happy to announce that Brian Schneider has been formally brought on to consult for us.


This is fantastic news. CCofS is one of my favorite courses.


Fantastic is right!   


Hoping he can make the bunkers more authentic to what Travis built....that old aerial looks compelling.
"Persistence and determination alone are omnipotent" - Calvin Coolidge

https://cobbscreek.org/

Andrew Carr

  • Total Karma: 1
Re: Travis Course Showdown 2025
« Reply #18 on: Today at 11:10:15 AM »

While I personally would love to see a restoration of the unique bunkering Travis built at CC of Scranton, I have serious doubts the membership would be on board.  My realistic hope is that Brian is able to find a spot or two where a pure restoration of that style will work and that the membership will accept it.


I'm sorry I cannot figure out how to post a picture here, so I'll post a link to where I've posted it on Twitter:

https://x.com/andrewjcarr29/status/1628710699571593218

For anyone who has not seen CC of Scranton, DM me and I would be happy to host.  We are happy to announce that Brian Schneider has been formally brought on to consult for us.


This is fantastic news. CCofS is one of my favorite courses.


Fantastic is right!   


Hoping he can make the bunkers more authentic to what Travis built....that old aerial looks compelling.

MCirba

  • Total Karma: 2
Re: Travis Course Showdown 2025
« Reply #19 on: Today at 12:52:51 PM »
Andrew,


They (friends and family) won't let me on Twitter and I quit Facebook in early November (the morning of Nov 6th to be precise) so GCA is the extent of my Social Media Presence these days (thankfully).   ;D


If you email me the pic I'm happy to post it for you.  I understand your caution but hoping Brian can convince folks they have something pretty unique, as he did at North Jersey.


Thanks!
"Persistence and determination alone are omnipotent" - Calvin Coolidge

https://cobbscreek.org/

MCirba

  • Total Karma: 2
Re: Travis Course Showdown 2025
« Reply #20 on: Today at 02:11:22 PM »
Here we go.   What's cool to me is that there are a wide variety of bunker types on this photo of CC of Scranton from the mid-1920s, I believe.


Some look to be deep pits, others are of a Principal's nose variety built into rising mounds...others may be inverse sandy mounds.   Their locations are almost inevitably within the fairways and not out in the rough areas.   Cool stuff.




"Persistence and determination alone are omnipotent" - Calvin Coolidge

https://cobbscreek.org/

mike_malone

  • Total Karma: -2
Re: Travis Course Showdown 2025
« Reply #21 on: Today at 02:19:01 PM »
That has that Hollywood look. Wasn’t Brian Schneider the lead there?
AKA Mayday

MCirba

  • Total Karma: 2
Re: Travis Course Showdown 2025
« Reply #22 on: Today at 02:42:29 PM »
That has that Hollywood look. Wasn’t Brian Schneider the lead there?


Mayday,


Yes, and yes.   



"Persistence and determination alone are omnipotent" - Calvin Coolidge

https://cobbscreek.org/

Andrew Carr

  • Total Karma: 1
Re: Travis Course Showdown 2025
« Reply #23 on: Today at 03:19:35 PM »

Brian is becoming the Travis whisperer!


If anyone hasn't seen the work he's done at North Jersey or Hollywood, drop everything and go!

That has that Hollywood look. Wasn’t Brian Schneider the lead there?


Mayday,


Yes, and yes.

MCirba

  • Total Karma: 2
Re: Travis Course Showdown 2025
« Reply #24 on: Today at 04:54:19 PM »

Brian is becoming the Travis whisperer!


If anyone hasn't seen the work he's done at North Jersey or Hollywood, drop everything and go!

That has that Hollywood look. Wasn’t Brian Schneider the lead there?


Mayday,


Yes, and yes.


Andrew,


Both courses have benefited greatly from Brian's involvement.
"Persistence and determination alone are omnipotent" - Calvin Coolidge

https://cobbscreek.org/