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How important is the scorecard yardage?
Tom_Doak:
--- Quote from: Mark_Fine on January 22, 2025, 07:06:28 PM ---I modified the thread subject to be scorecard "yardage".
Holes can play very different from different yardages. What might be considered a slog from one yardage, might be extremely interesting from a different one. I could list dozens of examples of holes that are completely different holes from different angles and yardages. The ultimate target might be static, but how you approach/attack that target might be very different. Take one example, the 12th at Augusta National. From 80-100 yards, would most still play away from a right hole location vs from 145-150 yards? Temptation comes much more into play. Just one example to think about. I know many of my home course holes play very differently from different yardages. And of course a lot depends on the player.
--- End quote ---
Good post Mark!
A lot of people don't like Sebonack because they play it from too far back. I learned this because the two players I knew who liked it the most were both women -- one a good player, and the other not so good. But from their yardage it was entirely doable.
So, I took some friends from Australia and played a set of markers up from where I would normally play, and we all had a good time and they really liked the course.
Last I saw it they still put out tee markers all the time -- I'm surprised if "no markers" is regular policy there. Ballyneal is the only one of my courses that does this as far as I know. Childress Hall has talked about putting out a "daily" tee [like the old "boxes" in Scotland] for anyone who wants a setup, and changing that around a lot from one day to the next, but also letting people tee it up wherever they want if they don't want to compete from the daily tee.
MCirba:
Tom,
When I played Ballyneal I had a fabulous caddie who was there from inception (wish I could remember his name) and he shepherded me on both the 18 hole course and also took me through an 18 hole routing on the par three course where I played to the same green from different spots on a few holes. It was a glorious day and due to his tutelage I had one of the best scoring days and more importantly, most fun rounds of my life.
To the point of this thread, by the first hole he had already assessed my game and would lead me hole after hole to where he thought the hole would be interesting, challenging, yet attainable based on that assessment. He was unerring in that regard and part of my total enjoyment was that at no time did I think any hole played either too short or too long for my game.
Mark_Fine:
Joe,
I am not implying at all that you have to be a great player to appreciate a great golf course. I am talking more about what Tom and Mike just stated in that different tees outside of what is listed on the scorecard or where the daily markers are can make holes much more interesting or thought provoking. This might mean starting at shorter distances for some holes and longer for others or different angles if that option exists.
Some of the courses mentioned have that kind of design flexibility built in and it should be recognized and rewarded.
Carl Johnson:
Mark, you say: "Note: I have mentioned in previous threads the technology exists to calculate handicaps from any starting location. This will be become more common over the next few years."
I had not noticed those threads. I'm interested to know how that would work, given the nature of the data that goes into ratings and slopes as I experienced doing it about 12 years ago. (What I did not have and still do not -- it seems to be secret -- is the algorithm for converting that raw data into handicaps.)
Mark_Fine:
Carl,
If Forrest Richardson sees this thread maybe he will provide more detail to address your question. In the meantime are you familiar with the Arccos shot tracking system? It can track all your shots during a round using an app on your phone. The technology for calculating a course and slope rating for handicap purposes would do the same. If you playing at Sebonack for example and randomly selecting where you tee off on each hole, it would calculate a slope and course rating for your round that day. It is GPS based. Again Forrest or maybe someone else here could shed more light but I didn’t want this to get into a handicap thread. It is more about course evaluation and the idea of not worrying about a defined card yardage from say the yellow tee markers to decide how good the course is.
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