GolfClubAtlas.com > Golf Course Architecture Discussion Group
The Lido Course Profile Now Live!
Thomas Dai:
Match play and strokeplay and yee olde matchplay ‘play the man’ or ‘play the course’ debate.
Of course unless it’s gross matchplay it is necessary to establish a handicap beforehand and handicaps traditionally* are acquired via strokeplay.
Atb
* although maybe not necessarily these days given the new WHS.
Simon Barrington:
"Of course unless it’s gross matchplay it is necessary to establish a handicap beforehand and handicaps traditionally* are acquired via strokeplay.
Atb
* although maybe not necessarily these days given the new WHS."
One of the (possibly) unintended consequences of the WHS might actually be a resurgence in Matchplay (with the system spitting out approximations for handicapping regardless) we can only live in hope.
Architecture at the top end doesn't feel the strokeplay effect as much as where the majority of the game plays.
The pressure for homgeniety and ease of play is strong in memberships, especially those less informed in GCA.
I know a Club who were considering changes to the course to supposedly challenge the better players from the tee (an area they mistakenly thought was lacking) but then a small group of these better players pushed hard for the removal of the few hazards on the course proven (by a detailed survey of member play) to catch/challenge those same players! ::)
The ego of seeking lower handicaps can be a strong driver towards blandness in design/resdesign.
Tim_Cronin:
This is a tremendous profile. I have to drag myself up there.
Bob Montle:
I have two questions for Mr Doak.
Have you learned anything new from reproducing this course, that you might use on future courses you build?
Has your opinion of Macdonald changed from your thoughts before you worked on the Lido?
I would love to see your thoughts.
PS: I have only played your course at Dismal River - and would be happy if that was the only course I was allowed to play from now on.
Tom_Doak:
--- Quote from: Bob Montle on December 12, 2024, 11:54:08 AM ---I have two questions for Mr Doak.
Have you learned anything new from reproducing this course, that you might use on future courses you build?
Has your opinion of Macdonald changed from your thoughts before you worked on the Lido?
--- End quote ---
1. Yes, I definitely learned a lot about the new technical avenues available to build golf courses and to "sample" contours from one place for use in another. Whether one should do so will be a matter of great debate . . . C.B. Macdonald himself said it was impossible to re-create a great hole from another course in the same character, but it is much closer to reality now, and I do lean toward thinking that Macdonald would have availed himself of building a more exact replica of certain holes if he'd had the chance.
2. I was quite surprised at the level of detail in the fairway contours at Lido that were put into the plasticine model of the course and carried out faithfully by the contractors. SOMEONE spent a heck of a lot of time doodling ideas for contours to steer a tee shot or second shot around a certain bunker . . . I don't believe that much or any of those contours are random, but instead that they are the product of much more thought than I usually put into my own plans. I came away believing that C.B. Macdonald spent more time thinking about his design for Lido than anything after The National, and that's exactly why the reaction to the course has been so favorable. I have spent a lot of time at Chicago Golf Club over the years, and Chicago Golf is child's play in comparison to Lido.
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