[Nicolas Joakimides]

Hello everyone !


It seems that, on this planet, EIGCA ( European Institute of Golf Course Architect) is " the world's only professional qualification in golf course design " as they say on their website .


1) Do you know any other one ?


2) Does it means that no one is interested in becoming golf designer ?...
Or no one thinks this job has a future ? 


What are your thoughts on it ?


Nicolas J 

[Ally Mcintosh]

Hello everyone !


It seems that, on this planet, EIGCA ( European Institute of Golf Course Architect) is " the world's only professional qualification in golf course design " as they say on their website .


1) Do you know any other one ?


2) Does it means that no one is interested in becoming golf designer ?...
Or no one thinks this job has a future ? 


What are your thoughts on it ?


Nicolas J 

Nicolas,


When I went through the EIGCA Education programme, they took on about 10-15 people every two years. It was good. I didn’t always agree with everything that I was being taught but even when I didn’t, it opened opportunity for conversation and thought  processing with my peers.


Then came the 2008 crash and they closed up shop, only offering a scaled back course to a few people who were already attached or sponsored by an existing EIGCA architect / firm. Far less in-person time with your peer group.


In reference to your question, architects in professional societies are an insecure bunch. They have - in general - little interest in bringing on new architects just to compete and win business against them.

[Ian Andrew]

I deleted my post. Completely misunderstood the conversation.

[Ally Mcintosh]

Ian,


Nicolas is a pro golfer who has already designed courses:


https://golfclubatlas.com/feature-interview/feature-interview-with-nicolas-joakimides/


As for qualifications, you may not need them to practice (as with a multitude of other jobs that you can get someone to pay you for in the morning)… but there are qualifications.

[Garland Bayley]

An online search gives the information that Keiser University College of Golf says there are 15 new golf courses build each year. I assume this means in the USA. It would seem that is not enough jobs for any educational institution to set up a curriculum in golf course design.

I always assumed that the best way to get a golf design job would be to be adopted by an established golf course designer.

[Forrest Richardson]

Nicholas — Not sure what EIGCA means by that. I suppose, as Ally noted, that it relates to their old program. Besides EIGCA, the other professional organizations are ASGCA and SAGCA. Golf design is an art practiced in many ways, and by individuals of all sorts of backgrounds and experience. Pete Dye came from the insurance industry and was inspired by a love for the game and a visit to the UK.

Ally’s comment that “architects in professional societies are an insecure bunch. They have - in general - little interest in bringing on new architects just to compete and win business against them.” is not accurate, as least not in golf architecture today. All of the three professional organizations have programs and interest in bringing in new members.

[Ben Stephens]

Nicholas — Not sure what EIGCA means by that. I suppose, as Ally noted, that it relates to their old program. Besides EIGCA, the other professional organizations are ASGCA and SAGCA. Golf design is an art practiced in many ways, and by individuals of all sorts of backgrounds and experience. Pete Dye came from the insurance industry and was inspired by a love for the game and a visit to the UK.

Ally’s comment that “architects in professional societies are an insecure bunch. They have - in general - little interest in bringing on new architects just to compete and win business against them.” is not accurate, as least not in golf architecture today. All of the three professional organizations have programs and interest in bringing in new members.

Hi Forrest


in 15 years time most of the current crop of Golf Course Architects will be retired or in retirement age - there is not that many young GCA's that are coming into the sector so there is a potential experience gap.


I do think being a member of any of those organisations is valuable and gives accreditation - recently a public tender went out for a job in Troon for two public courses and one of the requirements was that it had to be a member of EIGCA. This was won by Pangaea Golf Architecture (Jeff Danner and Stuart Rennie)


The EIGCA education programme is improving and a number of candidates are on the course from all over the world. One day I hope to be a mentor to a student - we need to pass on the baton eventually.


Cheers
Ben

[Jeff_Brauer]

ASGCA has a number of initiatives that target young architects, including the World 100 trip to Scotland, 2-4 annual Wadsworth Scholars for those in the latter stages of their (usually landscape architecture) degrees.  Then we have the Tartan program for emerging architects, and that includes a special education session at the annual meeting.  That roster is about 20 each year, with some coming in, and others graduating to full membership.


In the last three years we have covered sales presentations, experience talks from some of our most successful members, and this year, a session on integrating your services/design with those of an irrigation designer (a topic requested by our Tartans).


We keep a list of young architects who may eventually be qualified for full membership, and the list is in the dozens.  I think there is the same desire to become an architect as in my generation, and probably more avenues to learn than I had, which was, as suggested, to bug an architect to take you on and succeeding. 

[Mark_Fine]

As Forrest and Jeff stated, I think the ASGCA is doing a much better job of recruiting new members.Once I became a member (it took 20 years to do so 😊) I realized how valuable the organization could have been to me back when I was just starting out.  Unfortunately, you had to have a ton of accomplishments (and still do today to be a full member) under your belt before you could get in.  While I am not yet ready to retire, I definitely would have learned a lot more much faster if I could have joined earlier in my career.  Now as Jeff and Forrest said, the ASGCA has many new programs to recruit younger less experienced architects and it seems to be thriving.  The baton does need to be passed as all courses “can” benefit from an architect, not just the brand new ones.

[Forrest Richardson]

“Retirement” is, today, >10 years higher than in 2000, especially in golf design. And, the new members today are younger than in any time in ASGCA history — Mark Fine excepted! It is a fact that many GCAs will leave the profession, but firms will be populated with new blood and many younger GCAs will simply hang their name independently.

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