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Thomas Dai

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Blowing smoke up ……. : TV, ‘influencers’ etc
« on: August 29, 2024, 12:22:20 PM »
Seems like the quality of the commentary and the general involvement of the talking heads and voices within TV golf continues to diminish. Seems like there is ever more blowing smoke up ………
Bland, boring, obsequious, patronising, irrelevant statistics, even recently swearing!
And there seems to be ever more of them wondering the fairways, the range, the studios etc.
Thoughts?
Atb

David_Tepper

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Re: Blowing smoke up ……. : TV, ‘influencers’ etc
« Reply #1 on: August 29, 2024, 12:44:14 PM »
Kind of like some of the people who post here so often about how much better things were in "the good old days?" ;)   

jeffwarne

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Re: Blowing smoke up ……. : TV, ‘influencers’ etc
« Reply #2 on: August 29, 2024, 12:55:39 PM »
Seems like the quality of the commentary and the general involvement of the talking heads and voices within TV golf continues to diminish. Seems like there is ever more blowing smoke up ………
Bland, boring, obsequious, patronising, irrelevant statistics, even recently swearing!
And there seems to be ever more of them wondering the fairways, the range, the studios etc.
Thoughts?
Atb


Has anyone, besides a golf commentator of the last 10 years, ever used the word penultimate?
Absolute guaranteed use of that word, every-single-telecast.



"Let's slow the damned greens down a bit, not take the character out of them." Tom Doak
"Take their focus off the grass and put it squarely on interesting golf." Don Mahaffey

Matt Schoolfield

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Re: Blowing smoke up ……. : TV, ‘influencers’ etc
« Reply #3 on: August 29, 2024, 01:31:03 PM »
I suspect this has to do with the advent of inexpensive, digital a/v production. The democratization of film production and distribution is a double-edged sword.

On the one hand, we should expect the result to be extremely niche targeting of audience by producers. This leads to wonderful "content" (film production) by architecture nerds like Andy Johnson and the rest of the Fried Egg crew, or NLU guys, that would otherwise never be made because there aren't enough of us out there to justify the cost a few decades ago. This is fantastic, and I celebrate it. I would even suspect that a lot of the cool flyover interviews from Golf Digest wouldn't be made a while back just because of the productions costs.

On the other hand, there are just as many folks in other niches that we may not care for. Whether that's the party golfers, thirst traps, or even the potty mouths, there is an audience for each of these things.

Where this becomes challenging is back at the TV production level. Since the audience has gotten significantly more niche, there is less money in broad-audience broadcast production, simply because people are getting their golf-fix elsewhere. This means that production gets worse, and probably has to try to target specific broad-demographics rather than high quality production that targets all demographics. This is mirrored in television production. We used to have extremely well written shows like Cheers, M*A*S*H, etc., simply because there was enough money to hire enough writers to appeal to basically everyone, without offending anyone. Now we have a mix of reality television (because it's cheap), and procedural targeted at older folks (because they're mostly innocuous, and they generally aren't on the streaming sites as much).

If the broadcasts are getting crude and boring to you, it's probably because you're no longer the demo the broadcast is chasing. Generally speaking, if the commercials aren't relevant to you, you're not the audience.
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David_Tepper

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Re: Blowing smoke up ……. : TV, ‘influencers’ etc
« Reply #4 on: August 29, 2024, 01:43:56 PM »
"If the broadcasts are getting crude and boring to you, it's probably because you're no longer the demo the broadcast is chasing. Generally speaking, if the commercials aren't relevant to you, you're not the audience."
 
As they say (too often to me these days!), "if the music's too loud, you're too old."
 

Bernie Bell

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Steve_ Shaffer

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Re: Blowing smoke up ……. : TV, ‘influencers’ etc
« Reply #6 on: August 29, 2024, 03:46:45 PM »
Is every putt a birdie putt even if it's 90 feet away?  ;D
« Last Edit: August 29, 2024, 03:48:52 PM by Steve_ Shaffer »
"Some of us worship in churches, some in synagogues, some on golf courses ... "  Adlai Stevenson
Hyman Roth to Michael Corleone: "We're bigger than US Steel."
Ben Hogan “The most important shot in golf is the next one”

Charlie Goerges

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Re: Blowing smoke up ……. : TV, ‘influencers’ etc
« Reply #7 on: August 29, 2024, 04:41:42 PM »

https://golf.com/news/gary-mccord-peter-kostis-off-their-rockers-hot-mic/




I liked those guys, but I remember in the 90s the uproar over McCord's "bikini wax" comments at ANGC (and his general demeanor and style) and many saying good riddance when he was dropped from the Masters broadcast. I think it's the same now. We older dudes probably sound to the young'uns like those dudes did to us.
Severally on the occasion of everything that thou doest, pause and ask thyself, if death is a dreadful thing because it deprives thee of this. - Marcus Aurelius

Craig Sweet

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Re: Blowing smoke up ……. : TV, ‘influencers’ etc
« Reply #8 on: August 29, 2024, 04:53:24 PM »
TV sports commentators are ripe for mocking. A buddy and I figure we could do a podcast....two guys watching clips from the weekend sports and making fun of the stupid things being said.  "He came to win!"  "There's not another golfer with that much imagination!" (seriously? do they pay attention to BS shots their golf buddies pull off every weekend?)   This is an endless mine of material.
No one is above the law. LOCK HIM UP!!!

Joe_Tucholski

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: Blowing smoke up ……. : TV, ‘influencers’ etc
« Reply #9 on: August 29, 2024, 05:03:04 PM »
Has anyone, besides a golf commentator of the last 10 years, ever used the word penultimate?
Absolute guaranteed use of that word, every-single-telecast.


You're not a cycling fan I take it.


I figure it's really hard to stay fresh when basically the same thing happens every week. 


On the golf influencer side, the channels I used to watch I don't find as engaging and interesting as they once were.  I'm not sure if it's because once you start to monetize you have to please sponsors and almost stay within a script or if it's because watching videos on the same general themes or golf locations over and over is less interesting.

Matt MacIver

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: Blowing smoke up ……. : TV, ‘influencers’ etc
« Reply #10 on: August 29, 2024, 08:21:33 PM »
Just wait a few years for AI to ramp up in broadcasting.  There are a sufficient quantity of historical broadcasts to pull from, so when a player has 167y to a back left pin the database will quickly pull a relevant similar shot, change and add some dialogue and launch.  And as viewers we’ll be able to choose who we’re hearing this “new” content from - I’ll choose Dottie or maybe Zinger.

Cal Carlisle

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: Blowing smoke up ……. : TV, ‘influencers’ etc
« Reply #11 on: August 29, 2024, 10:06:09 PM »
Has anyone, besides a golf commentator of the last 10 years, ever used the word penultimate?
Absolute guaranteed use of that word, every-single-telecast.


You're not a cycling fan I take it.


I figure it's really hard to stay fresh when basically the same thing happens every week. 


On the golf influencer side, the channels I used to watch I don't find as engaging and interesting as they once were.  I'm not sure if it's because once you start to monetize you have to please sponsors and almost stay within a script or if it's because watching videos on the same general themes or golf locations over and over is less interesting.


The influencer side definitely hit differently during COVID. It's definitely gotten a bit formulaic - not all of it, but a lot of it.

Matthew Rose

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: Blowing smoke up ……. : TV, ‘influencers’ etc
« Reply #12 on: August 30, 2024, 12:01:24 AM »
Any chance we could have AI Peter Alliss?

Complete with tangents about kids who eat ice cream cones growing up to be overweight and unemployed.
American-Australian. Trackman Course Guy. Fatalistic sports fan. Drummer. Bass player. Father. Cat lover.

Jeff Schley

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: Blowing smoke up ……. : TV, ‘influencers’ etc
« Reply #13 on: August 30, 2024, 04:25:32 AM »
Any chance we could have AI Peter Alliss?

Complete with tangents about kids who eat ice cream cones growing up to be overweight and unemployed.
This is the kind of AI use I'd like to see Matthew. Alternate days of Renton Laidlaw and Peter Alliss would be grand. Why not some Johnny Miller criticism while we are at it.  The good ol days.
"To give anything less than your best, is to sacrifice your gifts."
- Steve Prefontaine

Adam Lawrence

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Re: Blowing smoke up ……. : TV, ‘influencers’ etc
« Reply #14 on: August 30, 2024, 08:22:51 AM »
Any chance we could have AI Peter Alliss?

Complete with tangents about kids who eat ice cream cones growing up to be overweight and unemployed.


God no. Hateful. Allis was never any better than a low-rent Henry Longhurst wannabe and late in life, he was that and completely inaccurate most of the time. Proof positive that you need more than 'colour' to be a decent commentator.
Adam Lawrence

Editor, Golf Course Architecture
www.golfcoursearchitecture.net

Principal, Oxford Golf Consulting
www.oxfordgolfconsulting.com

Author, 'More Enduring Than Brass: a biography of Harry Colt' (forthcoming).

Short words are best, and the old words, when short, are the best of all.

Charlie Goerges

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: Blowing smoke up ……. : TV, ‘influencers’ etc
« Reply #15 on: August 30, 2024, 09:26:59 AM »
Any chance we could have AI Peter Alliss?

Complete with tangents about kids who eat ice cream cones growing up to be overweight and unemployed.


God no. Hateful. Allis was never any better than a low-rent Henry Longhurst wannabe and late in life, he was that and completely inaccurate most of the time. Proof positive that you need more than 'colour' to be a decent commentator.




I always find it interesting who people like/dislike in terms of commentators. I have low standards myself... if they were high, I'd be nothing but disappointed!
Severally on the occasion of everything that thou doest, pause and ask thyself, if death is a dreadful thing because it deprives thee of this. - Marcus Aurelius

Niall C

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: Blowing smoke up ……. : TV, ‘influencers’ etc
« Reply #16 on: August 30, 2024, 10:16:03 AM »
I'm with Adam.


Allis was probably the first golf commentator to make me mute the sound. There always seems to be one which is not surprising when broadcasters generally have at least 3 commentators in the booth and another couple on the course at any point in time. Odds are at least one of them is going to annoy the hell out of you and the result is you switch off.


That's not to say there aren't some good commentators, it's just that to listen to the good you have to put up with the annoying and I'm afraid I've got to the point that I'm not willing to do that.


Niall 

Adam Lawrence

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: Blowing smoke up ……. : TV, ‘influencers’ etc
« Reply #17 on: August 30, 2024, 10:58:49 AM »
I really don't mind commentators that deal in off-topic colour, I just demand that they get their actual commentary right first. I'm too young to have experienced Longhurst live, but I've read a lot of his stuff and watched it on rerun, and he did.

For Brits and others who follow cricket, it is the difference between Brian Johnston and Henry Blofeld. Jonners was one of the best sports commentators that ever lived, he gave you all sorts of flowery stuff about what was going on around the ground, but he never missed a ball and he was always spot on. Blofeld, especially towards the end of his career, was all colour and no commentary, he'd be wittering on about the buses going down St John's Wood Road, missing two balls in the process, and he always got players mixed up or wrong -- I once heard him say that Chris Broad had fielded a ball. Chris is the father of Stuart, who was the actual fielder, and hadn't played for England in at least thirty years at the time.

Colour is fine, but do your job first.
Adam Lawrence

Editor, Golf Course Architecture
www.golfcoursearchitecture.net

Principal, Oxford Golf Consulting
www.oxfordgolfconsulting.com

Author, 'More Enduring Than Brass: a biography of Harry Colt' (forthcoming).

Short words are best, and the old words, when short, are the best of all.

Tim Martin

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: Blowing smoke up ……. : TV, ‘influencers’ etc
« Reply #18 on: August 30, 2024, 11:30:10 AM »
I’m probably in the minority here based on what I’ve seen posted on this site over the years but I always enjoyed Johnny Miller for has candid take seemingly not worried about offending anyone. It made no difference to me how many times he mentioned the Sunday 63 at Oakmont. :)

David Cronan

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: Blowing smoke up ……. : TV, ‘influencers’ etc
« Reply #19 on: August 30, 2024, 11:39:30 AM »
Perhaps because it’s the Friday before a long, holiday weekend….perhaps because its a beautiful day….perhaps because my son has been offered a terrific job with a great company at the beginning of his last semester at Purdue….perhaps because the mechanic just informed me that my boat only needs a small part and he waived his labor fee (took him out for breakfast)….I’m inclined to look on the bright side of things this morning. As such, I’m grateful that we no longer have the following foisted upon our golf watching/listening ears. In no particular order:


1. Maury Povich
2. Ahmad Rashad (Golf Channel host for approximately 3 minutes)
3. Chris Berman
4. Charlie Jones
5. Robert Wrenn
6. Azinger





Craig Sweet

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: Blowing smoke up ……. : TV, ‘influencers’ etc
« Reply #20 on: August 30, 2024, 01:42:13 PM »
"The Fed Ex Cup is a season long battle..."


The NFL just announced that the team with the best regular season record after the initial playoff games,  will start the Super Bowl with a 13 point advantage !
No one is above the law. LOCK HIM UP!!!

Erik J. Barzeski

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: Blowing smoke up ……. : TV, ‘influencers’ etc
« Reply #21 on: August 30, 2024, 04:59:12 PM »
I like how y'all can't even agree on what old announcers you like, while simultaneously complaining about the new content, creators, announcers, etc.


If it's not for you, fine. It's for someone, or they wouldn't be continuing. Just like spam: it continues to exist because people out there keep engaging with it. Millions and millions of people. More than watch PGA Tour broadcasts, or ever did most weekends (non-majors).
Erik J. Barzeski @iacas
Author, Lowest Score Wins, Instructor/Coach, and Lifetime Student of the Game.

I generally ignore Rob, Tim, Garland, and Chris.

Chris Hughes

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: Blowing smoke up ……. : TV, ‘influencers’ etc
« Reply #22 on: August 30, 2024, 05:37:42 PM »
I’m probably in the minority here based on what I’ve seen posted on this site over the years but I always enjoyed Johnny Miller for has candid take seemingly not worried about offending anyone. It made no difference to me how many times he mentioned the Sunday 63 at Oakmont. :)


I'm with you on Johnny.  Was sorry to see Azinger go as well.  I like Colt, Kiz too when he shows up.  Kaufman is useless.
"Is it the Chicken Salad or the golf course that attracts and retains members ?"

Thomas Dai

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: Blowing smoke up ……. : TV, ‘influencers’ etc
« Reply #23 on: August 31, 2024, 04:02:04 AM »
Amusing how a thread develops. Must go now, maybe to visit a Pro event and try to get in the background during an on-course or after round TV interview with a player or a players partner, mum, dad, grandparents or kids or perhaps attend a hyper-manicured, mega-length course with a massive clubhouse, fountains and flower beds. Bound to be an influencer possibly with a celeb producing a video-blog there! :):):)
atb

Matthew Rose

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Re: Blowing smoke up ……. : TV, ‘influencers’ etc
« Reply #24 on: August 31, 2024, 04:16:14 AM »
It's funny; I just assumed most people liked Alliss. I thought he could be unnecessarily blunt at times, but it was kind of refreshing and occasionally a little shocking for an American who is used to, to borrow the thread title, blowing smoke up every player's back sides.

Meanwhile I can't stand Azinger. I feel like his entire vocabulary is just cliches.

Oh well, diff strokes for diff folks, eh.

American-Australian. Trackman Course Guy. Fatalistic sports fan. Drummer. Bass player. Father. Cat lover.

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