[Mark_Fine]

Tom,
As the thread progressed I did mention I tend to mostly think of eye candy as man made features.  But as Kalen said it’s a hard one to precisely define so I did want to see what others would say about it. 


I don’t really consider the surrounds eye candy and said as much but the course setting does/can play a huge role in how one feels about the golf course.  Some here agreed with this point and as you said it is a big part of what the architect was given to work with and you should maximize that.


At Banff, it is the setting that makes that golf course.  This can be said about many other courses as well.  That is not at all a knock on the course, it is just a fact.  But what was interesting to me about Banff is that Thompson felt the need to try to make the course equally dramatic as the site with the addition of 150 plus bunkers.  Ian commented in part why he did this. Most of those bunkers are indeed eye candy - man made features that are there mainly for visual stimulation and appeal.

[Dan_Callahan]

When I read the original post, the first thing that popped into my head is how "eye candy" ... in the sense of the dramatic physical features of a golf course ... can impact how I rate it. For example, in Ireland, a course like Carne or Enniscrone is the ultimate in eye candy. Massive dunes for as far as you can see. When I first played both courses, I absolutely loved them. I still think they are great for a play or two, but when I was thinking about where I would want to play every day, I moved Rosses Point to the top of the list. Not nearly the same wow factor (although not bland either, with the views over the ocean and to Benbulben). But Rosses Point has a subtlety and flow to it that I don't think I could ever get tired of. In my opinion, architecturally, it is a better, more thoughtful course that presents an enjoyable walk and the opportunity to play round after round and still feel challenged. And because of the less dramatic nature of the property, it isn't a lost ball factory.

[Mark_Fine]

Dan,
Good post.  What you say makes a lot of sense.  I have played those courses, loved them all, but not enough times to reach the same conclusions.  I did love Carne though.

[Jeff_Brauer]

I thought this topic might have limited discussion because eye candy can be extremely subjective..........  I recall playing Old Memorial Golf Course years ago in Tampa Florida.  I played with the superintendent.  All he talked about was how many bunkers were there that never had a footprint or saw a golf ball but he had to maintain.

Mark,


That probably equates with my view of eye candy, i.e., man made bunkers built just for looks that do not really function as strategic hazards.  There are a lot of reasons to use sand bunkers, but IMHO, the first was always to use them as hazards, and then, if they also served other purposes and looked good, so much the better.

[Ira Fishman]

I agree that settings/surrounds do not qualify as Eye Candy, but I do think a design choice can make too much non-strategic use of them. I am thinking of the overuse of infinity greens.

[Mark_Fine]

We agree Ira.  I also agree about overuse of features which would include infinity greens,... One feature that does get overused that we don't talk about is perimeter or flanking bunkers.  I can't think of a single architect that doesn't use them often and almost on every hole.  I do recall a discussion years ago with Gil Hanse where he told me he would one day like to build a course with mostly centerline hazards.  Great idea but probably hard to get an owner to allow it to happen.


So how important is eye candy getting back on topic?  Who knows the answer?  I don't. 

[Wayne_Kozun]

I do recall a discussion years ago with Gil Hanse where he told me he would one day like to build a course with mostly centerline hazards.  Great idea but probably hard to get an owner to allow it to happen.

I was thinking about this while watching the Women's Open on the weekend.  Has anyone built a hole like the 12th hole at the Old Course in recent years?  There aren't many holes where you are often trying to hit your drive into the left or right rough rather than the fairway.  The Old course does have several holes, like 9, 10 & 12 where the hazards are more on the central line than the periphery.

[Jim Hoak]

Can flowers on a golf course ever be anything but eye candy?  Rarely?

[Ira Fishman]

Jim,


Except for a flowering bush like heather or gorse, never. We have a couple of long time members of the Green Committee who insist on flowers in some locations that never come into play. It is just a pain in the rear for the staff.


Ira

[Phil Burr]

I think the back nine at Castle Pines was loaded with eye candy.  The rock wall fronting #16. I think there was another in front of #11.  Connecting the ponds on #15-16 was a cosmetic change much different from the days of the International.  I didn’t like the look of the back nine at all.


The flowers at #16 at Sentryworld are the epitome of eye candy.


Any artificial waterfall is eye candy.  Think Ted Robinson at countless Palm Springs courses.


Any course in North Scottsdale that has water in play can be termed as creating eye candy.  Troon North, Estancia, Mirabel, etc.  Just about every course at Desert Mountain has so much eye candy they should be off limits to diabetics.  I realize some are probably irrigation holding ponds but I don’t want to see them.


Any island greens built since #17 at Sawgrass are ripoffs and eye candy.


When I think of eye candy I think of Nicklaus & Fazio above everyone else.  But how do we know they’re being self-indulgent vs. complying with client orders?

[Patrick Collins]

We agree Ira.  I also agree about overuse of features which would include infinity greens,... One feature that does get overused that we don't talk about is perimeter or flanking bunkers.  I can't think of a single architect that doesn't use them often and almost on every hole.  I do recall a discussion years ago with Gil Hanse where he told me he would one day like to build a course with mostly centerline hazards.  Great idea but probably hard to get an owner to allow it to happen.


So how important is eye candy getting back on topic?  Who knows the answer?  I don't.

Cabot Citrus seemed to employ centerline hazards numerous times. 1, 4, 5, 6, 11, 17, 18

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