Worst Hole, Best Backdrop

[Greg Gilson]

That hole in Idaho where you row to the green?

[Niall C]

The short par 3 at Pebble Beach (7th ?). Maybe not the absolute worst hole but take away the backdrop and it's not really good enough to be on such a highly tated course IMO.


Niall

[Will Spivey]

The two "Ocean holes" at Turtle Point, Kiawah Island (15 and 16?). Just jammed in there so they could say "ocean front."

[Ira Fishman]

Number 17 at Old Head.

[Ian Mackenzie]

OK, I'll say it....


the 18th at St. Andrews...;-)


For a finishing hole on one of the most iconic courses in the world, it's just a let-down as you take one of the all-time best walks in golf.

[Kalen Braley]

That hole in Idaho where you row to the green?

I've played it a few times and no rowing involved. Its a boat attached to some type of tether and winch system, so its nearly fool proof. But its certainly a viable candidate to win this category! 

I would also nominate Torrey Pines South #12

[Brad Tufts]

Number 17 at Old Head.

I thought 17 was fun...it was 15 and 16 I was    about.


I nominate the clifftop par three at Samoset with the trees still around the green somehow, and most of the holes at Arrowhead in CO.

[Matt Schoolfield]

I want to say #17 at Lincoln Park GC, in San Francisco. Backdrop is an amazing view of the Golden Gate Bridge, but it's technically to the left of the hole. This hole, however, is so actively terrible it makes me angry. It very much looks like they took an existing hole and then moved the tees because trees grew too high to see the bridge. There is what is obviously an old tee box further down the hill, which brings the bunkers into play, and puts a mid-to-long iron in peoples hands, instead of a driver or 3 wood.

[Tony_Muldoon]

OK, I'll say it....


the 18th at St. Andrews...;-)


For a finishing hole on one of the most iconic courses in the world, it's just a let-down as you take one of the all-time best walks in golf.

I like the 18th, its a cool second shot.


But the 9th!!!!!! Essentially the same view with no redeeming features.

[Sean_A]

OK, I'll say it....


the 18th at St. Andrews...;-)


For a finishing hole on one of the most iconic courses in the world, it's just a let-down as you take one of the all-time best walks in golf.

I like the 18th, its a cool second shot.


But the 9th!!!!!! Essentially the same view with no redeeming features.

The 9th doesn’t have the same view! There is a stinkin halfway house behind the green.


Ciao

[Adam Lawrence]

I think St Andrew’s eighteenth is a pretty fabulous hole, a really great example of the power of a single feature, the Valley of Sin. Pros and other very good golfers standing on the tee believe they should make three, and indeed lots do. But it is way less that might normally be expected, because of the influence of the Valley. Those who see it as a poor hole seem to me to believe that any hole averaging below par is weak.

[Ian Mackenzie]

I think St Andrew’s eighteenth is a pretty fabulous hole, a really great example of the power of a single feature, the Valley of Sin. Pros and other very good golfers standing on the tee believe they should make three, and indeed lots do. But it is way less that might normally be expected, because of the influence of the Valley. Those who see it as a poor hole seem to me to believe that any hole averaging below par is weak.

No, not at all and your assumptions are solely your own, Adam....
You are making a case based on the "pro game" (or low HDCP-er) and I see that as irrelevant.


I first played TOC in 1990 (when I was a 6) and my caddy just told me to take out a 3 iron, play it out to the left for an easy flip-wedge into the green.


Given the BACKDROP to this hole and the significance of the course, I stand by my offering that the 18th at TOC qualifies under the premises of THIS thread.


If the hole has ONE determining feature as you state, then 99% of mortal golfers need not worry about it and, to them, it's an easy effing hole of 350 yards with a 150 yd wide fairway, no bunkers, water not really in play (unless you top your tee shot) with an obligatory pause over the bridge for a photo.


Sure, it may be an exciting match play hole for the pros seeking to drive the green through the valley, but this hole has a spectacular backdrop to an otherwise mundane piece of architecture.


Name one other course in the "Top 200" that has such a milque-toast finisher?

[Kalen Braley]

I think St Andrew’s eighteenth is a pretty fabulous hole, a really great example of the power of a single feature, the Valley of Sin. Pros and other very good golfers standing on the tee believe they should make three, and indeed lots do. But it is way less that might normally be expected, because of the influence of the Valley. Those who see it as a poor hole seem to me to believe that any hole averaging below par is weak.

Name one other course in the "Top 200" that has such a milque-toast finisher?

Cypress Point?

[Tony_Muldoon]

I think St Andrew’s eighteenth is a pretty fabulous hole, a really great example of the power of a single feature, the Valley of Sin. Pros and other very good golfers standing on the tee believe they should make three, and indeed lots do. But it is way less that might normally be expected, because of the influence of the Valley. Those who see it as a poor hole seem to me to believe that any hole averaging below par is weak.

No, not at all and your assumptions are solely your own, Adam....
You are making a case based on the "pro game" (or low HDCP-er) and I see that as irrelevant.


I first played TOC in 1990 (when I was a 6) and my caddy just told me to take out a 3 iron, play it out to the left for an easy flip-wedge into the green.


Given the BACKDROP to this hole and the significance of the course, I stand by my offering that the 18th at TOC qualifies under the premises of THIS thread.


If the hole has ONE determining feature as you state, then 99% of mortal golfers need not worry about it and, to them, it's an easy effing hole of 350 yards with a 150 yd wide fairway, no bunkers, water not really in play (unless you top your tee shot) with an obligatory pause over the bridge for a photo.


Sure, it may be an exciting match play hole for the pros seeking to drive the green through the valley, but this hole has a spectacular backdrop to an otherwise mundane piece of architecture.


Name one other course in the "Top 200" that has such a milque-toast finisher?

People always say the 18th at North Berwick West Links is similar in many ways. I like that one too.

[Tim Martin]

I think St Andrew’s eighteenth is a pretty fabulous hole, a really great example of the power of a single feature, the Valley of Sin. Pros and other very good golfers standing on the tee believe they should make three, and indeed lots do. But it is way less that might normally be expected, because of the influence of the Valley. Those who see it as a poor hole seem to me to believe that any hole averaging below par is weak.

Name one other course in the "Top 200" that has such a milque-toast finisher?

Somerset Hills CC

[Mark Pearce]

There must be dozens of really awful holes in Spain (including the Canaries) which play towards the ocean or the mountains which would qualify?

[Kevin_Reilly]

The short par 3 at Pebble Beach (7th ?). Maybe not the absolute worst hole but take away the backdrop and it's not really good enough to be on such a highly tated course IMO.


Niall

I assume you haven't played there (hence your parenthetical question)...but it is a fun, terrific hole.

[Ira Fishman]

I think St Andrew’s eighteenth is a pretty fabulous hole, a really great example of the power of a single feature, the Valley of Sin. Pros and other very good golfers standing on the tee believe they should make three, and indeed lots do. But it is way less that might normally be expected, because of the influence of the Valley. Those who see it as a poor hole seem to me to believe that any hole averaging below par is weak.

Name one other course in the "Top 200" that has such a milque-toast finisher?

Somerset Hills CC

Maybe I am a sucker for short, quirky finishing holes, but number 18 at TOC, NB, CPC, Somerset Hills all struck me as the perfect codas for masterpieces. I would add Elie and Friar’s Head to the list. Are they great holes standing alone? No. But do they bring you back in the perfect spirit of the course? Yes.


Ira

[Tim Martin]

I think St Andrew’s eighteenth is a pretty fabulous hole, a really great example of the power of a single feature, the Valley of Sin. Pros and other very good golfers standing on the tee believe they should make three, and indeed lots do. But it is way less that might normally be expected, because of the influence of the Valley. Those who see it as a poor hole seem to me to believe that any hole averaging below par is weak.

Name one other course in the "Top 200" that has such a milque-toast finisher?

Somerset Hills CC

Maybe I am a sucker for short, quirky finishing holes, but number 18 at TOC, NB, CPC, Somerset Hills all struck me as the perfect codas for masterpieces. I would add Elie and Friar’s Head to the list. Are they great holes standing alone? No. But do they bring you back in the perfect spirit of the course? Yes.


Ira

Ira-It would fit in fine for me in a different slot other than 18.

[Ian Andrew]

Lot's of holes to choose from at Nefyn and District.
It has Pebble Beach's landscape.

In Canada it is Fox Harbour.
Canada's greatest miss.

[Niall C]

The short par 3 at Pebble Beach (7th ?). Maybe not the absolute worst hole but take away the backdrop and it's not really good enough to be on such a highly tated course IMO.


Niall

I assume you haven't played there (hence your parenthetical question)...but it is a fun, terrific hole.

Kevin


Sorry, a weakness of mine is remembering hole numbers. I have played it, but only once and perhaps I was expecting too much. I just think if you take the view away you are left with a bit of a drop shot with a short to mid iron to a fairly mundane green. Certainly the green complex now doesn't look anything like as magnificent as it does in the old black and white photos.


I also accept that on another day playing from the back tee and into a gusting wind that it would be a lot harder. I don't know that would make it any better though.


Niall 

[Peter Sayegh]

Pickens CC #12.

[cary lichtenstein]

Those of you saying the 18th at St. Andrews is terrible, you have to remember, it was designed in the 16th Century

[Matt Schoolfield]

Those of you saying the 18th at St. Andrews is terrible, you have to remember, it was designed in the 16th Century

Those of you saying the 18th at St. Andrews is terrible, maybe go play at a normal golf course every once in a while. The 18th at St. Andrews is perfectly serviceable golf hole where the main hazard is the wind.

Name one other course in the "Top 200" that has such a milque-toast finisher?

Match-play courses are suppose to have brutal 17ths and gettable 18ths.

[mike_beene]

18 at Pebble is a great looking average par 5 with housing on one side, rocks on the other and trees in the fairway.