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Ben Sims

  • Karma: +1/-0
The Night They Drove Old Dixie Down
« on: February 11, 2024, 11:19:30 AM »
I’ve long thought this song by The Band was a classic. I never really understood the politicization and negativity towards it. I will say, as born southerner, there’s something a bit weird about four dudes from Ontario lamenting the hard times a poor southerner would soon experience at the end of the American Civil War. At least the fifth member of The Band, Arkansan Levon Helms, could add a touch of wailing authenticity.


But the glaringly foolish issue with that viewpoint is that Helms didn’t write the song! It was Toronto-native Robbie Robertson and he kind of nailed it. His experiences in his late teens with Ronnie Hawk and The Hawks plus his years with Bob Dylan lended him the proper chops to be a forefront voice in what became the American folk music of the 1960’s.


It reminds me of alot of the commentary around men’s professional golf at the moment. People that shouldn’t have a deep base of cultural knowledge are nailing the argument. The years of immersive golf fandom are giving people a voice.


I feel that this weekend has been somewhat of a watershed moment. The tournament in Phoenix is off the rails in more ways than one. The tournament in Las Vegas is also, for entirely different reasons, telling a story it perhaps doesn’t want to tell.


It seems to me that men’s professional golf is in hard times and non-traditional voices are trying hard to tell the story of what we are all very clearly seeing and experiencing. I hope someone is listening.

Bruce Katona

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: The Night They Drove Old Dixie Down
« Reply #1 on: February 11, 2024, 02:07:45 PM »
As far as versions of this song go, this one, along with "The Weight" are performed quite well by Jerry Garcia & The Grateful Dead - IMHO.

Niall C

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: The Night They Drove Old Dixie Down
« Reply #2 on: February 11, 2024, 02:47:30 PM »
Ben


I have to say that I really don't have a clue what or rather who you are referencing. I get you are trying to make an analogy between a song writer and his subject, and professional golf and certain people commenting on it, but I'm clueless as to who you are talking about and what they are saying. Is it a US media reference or should I know about it in the UK ?


Niall

Ronald Montesano

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: The Night They Drove Old Dixie Down
« Reply #3 on: February 11, 2024, 03:02:46 PM »
"People that shouldn’t have a deep base of cultural knowledge are nailing the argument."

Which people? Who are these people?
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Tommy Williamsen

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: The Night They Drove Old Dixie Down
« Reply #4 on: February 11, 2024, 03:05:59 PM »
Ben


I have to say that I really don't have a clue what or rather who you are referencing. I get you are trying to make an analogy between a song writer and his subject, and professional golf and certain people commenting on it, but I'm clueless as to who you are talking about and what they are saying. Is it a US media reference or should I know about it in the UK ?


Niall


I know the reference, although I like Joan Baez's version better. I'm not certain what he means. People outside of golf understand what is going on with pro golf?
Where there is no love, put love; there you will find love.
St. John of the Cross

"Deep within your soul-space is a magnificent cathedral where you are sweet beyond telling." Rumi

Ben Sims

  • Karma: +1/-0
Re: The Night They Drove Old Dixie Down
« Reply #5 on: February 11, 2024, 03:15:24 PM »
I guess I should be more specific. The non-traditional (social) media is being pretty pointed in their coverage of men’s professional golf. My thought is there is a swell of anger and embarrassment that will eventually reef and break. What that means? I’m not sure. But the sport I love, its professional side (at least on the men’s side) is becoming increasingly farcical by the week and people are noticing.
« Last Edit: February 11, 2024, 03:16:56 PM by Ben Sims »

Kevin_Reilly

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: The Night They Drove Old Dixie Down
« Reply #6 on: February 11, 2024, 03:54:37 PM »
I saw the Band open for the Dead at the SF Civic in 1982 or so, follow golf pretty closely...and yet I don't understand this thread topic.  Maybe Gib needs to reactivate his account to chime in.


If the topic is that "general reporters" for NYT and WSJ shouldn't be the word of record for modern day pro golf, then OK.
"GOLF COURSES SHOULD BE ENJOYED RATHER THAN RATED" - Tom Watson

Ben Sims

  • Karma: +1/-0
Re: The Night They Drove Old Dixie Down
« Reply #7 on: February 11, 2024, 04:04:21 PM »
Well this is seeming to be a big swing and a miss. I thought the analogy of a Canadian writing about a uniquely southern American experience and social media being the most reputable cultural commentator for men’s professional golf was an appropriate one. That this weekend felt like a watershed moment for the driving down of an institution or ideal was  the cherry on top of the idea. I guess even the best need editors. 😂
« Last Edit: February 11, 2024, 04:06:24 PM by Ben Sims »

Tommy Williamsen

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: The Night They Drove Old Dixie Down
« Reply #8 on: February 11, 2024, 05:09:34 PM »
My daughter does not follow golf. If she hears something, though, her ears will perk up. She and her non-golfing friends are asking, "What in the world is going on?" The TOUR has not done itself any favors with the payouts etc.
Where there is no love, put love; there you will find love.
St. John of the Cross

"Deep within your soul-space is a magnificent cathedral where you are sweet beyond telling." Rumi

Stewart Abramson

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: The Night They Drove Old Dixie Down
« Reply #9 on: February 11, 2024, 05:35:04 PM »
As far as versions of this song go, this one, along with "The Weight" are performed quite well by Jerry Garcia & The Grateful Dead - IMHO.


I saw Jerry do it live. I saw the Dead from1968 to 1995 70 times, so I'm a fan, but the Doak 10 version is from the Last Waltz with the Staples. When Mavis comes in it still brings tears of joy to my eyes

Stewart Abramson

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: The Night They Drove Old Dixie Down
« Reply #10 on: February 11, 2024, 05:37:35 PM »
I like Joan Baez's version better.


This is your first post in 10 years where my view differs from yours  8)

Jason Thurman

  • Karma: +1/-0
Re: The Night They Drove Old Dixie Down
« Reply #11 on: February 11, 2024, 06:56:07 PM »
It's a jam, and the basic premise of the thread is a good one. Golfers have never been known for their self awareness. Outside its own bubble, the game is subtly but steadily accumulating tarnish.
"There will always be haters. That’s just the way it is. Hating dudes marry hating women and have hating ass kids." - Evan Turner

Some of y'all have never been called out in bold green font and it really shows.

Sean_A

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: The Night They Drove Old Dixie Down
« Reply #12 on: February 11, 2024, 06:57:47 PM »
Well this is seeming to be a big swing and a miss. I thought the analogy of a Canadian writing about a uniquely southern American experience and social media being the most reputable cultural commentator for men’s professional golf was an appropriate one. That this weekend felt like a watershed moment for the driving down of an institution or ideal was  the cherry on top of the idea. I guess even the best need editors. 😂


Ben


I am not sure your assertion is correct. Social media jumped on the far too simplistic sports washing take without having a clue what they were talking about. Maybe some actually chose to read about the subject from a non-sport angle. SGS boys seemed to have toned down their rhetoric. I think in general the Saudi hysteria is dying down in golf. I don't worry much about the look of golf...its not really my business. I never really cared how the players were paid or where the money came from....and I don't believe the vast majority of golf fans REALLY care either. Its something to bitch about for a while...a kind of entertainment in itself. Truthfully, its pathethic all around.


Ciao
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Ben Sims

  • Karma: +1/-0
Re: The Night They Drove Old Dixie Down
« Reply #13 on: February 11, 2024, 07:51:26 PM »
Well this is seeming to be a big swing and a miss. I thought the analogy of a Canadian writing about a uniquely southern American experience and social media being the most reputable cultural commentator for men’s professional golf was an appropriate one. That this weekend felt like a watershed moment for the driving down of an institution or ideal was  the cherry on top of the idea. I guess even the best need editors. 😂


Ben


I am not sure your assertion is correct. Social media jumped on the far too simplistic sports washing take without having a clue what they were talking about. Maybe some actually chose to read about the subject from a non-sport angle. SGS boys seemed to have toned down their rhetoric. I think in general the Saudi hysteria is dying down in golf. I don't worry much about the look of golf...its not really my business. I never really cared how the players were paid or where the money came from....and I don't believe the vast majority of golf fans REALLY care either. Its something to bitch about for a while...a kind of entertainment in itself. Truthfully, its pathethic all around.


Ciao


Sean,


More than ever, I am not talking about the Saudis and/or golf bros and haven’t mentioned them at all in this thread. And though the LIV has its own issues, the PGA Tour has some of their own.


I’m genuinely confused about the future about non-major championship professional golf.  And I don’t think I’m the only one. Based on my anecdotal intake of golf media, the myriad issues aren’t going away and this isn’t a carnival barker scenario. Influential sources are turning sour on ALL of this.

JMEvensky

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: The Night They Drove Old Dixie Down
« Reply #14 on: February 11, 2024, 08:25:02 PM »

I saw the Band open for the Dead at the SF Civic in 1982 or so

[size=78%]  Maybe Gib needs to reactivate his account to chime in.[/size]





Envious about the first and +1 on the second.

Tim Gavrich

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: The Night They Drove Old Dixie Down
« Reply #15 on: February 12, 2024, 02:35:40 PM »
I think in general the Saudi hysteria is dying down in golf. I don't worry much about the look of golf...its not really my business. I never really cared how the players were paid or where the money came from....and I don't believe the vast majority of golf fans REALLY care either.
Sportswashing works, ex. 18,925,736.


Ben--


I've consumed a lot of takes from both traditional and non-traditional sources about golf lately. There's a lot of overlap...not quite groupthink, but it's partially inevitable that thinking about golf constantly is going to lead you to some similar thoughts to others, whether you're a trad or non-trad media member (keep in mind that many of these folks socialize together on and offline).


To your point about "The Night They..." being written by a non-Southerner, I try to pay particular attention to what non-golf-media people have to say about golf mostly because I still remember the first day of 8th grade English class, when my teacher wrote the word "egocentrism" on the board and we defined it as "the inability to think outside of one's own perspective." That concept is always in mind for me.
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Steve Lapper

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: The Night They Drove Old Dixie Down
« Reply #16 on: February 12, 2024, 03:36:08 PM »
As far as versions of this song go, this one, along with "The Weight" are performed quite well by Jerry Garcia & The Grateful Dead - IMHO.


+1
The conventional view serves to protect us from the painful job of thinking."--John Kenneth Galbraith

Bernie Bell

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: The Night They Drove Old Dixie Down
« Reply #17 on: February 12, 2024, 03:40:11 PM »
Technicality -- I think Jerry Garcia Band covered it often, but the Dead did not.  Could be wrong.

More importantly, nothing "problematic" about the song whatsoever. 

Carl Johnson

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: The Night They Drove Old Dixie Down
« Reply #18 on: February 13, 2024, 10:35:33 PM »

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