[mike_malone]

Very good courses have many great things like greens, routing, challenge and more.


  Are there distinctive things that the very best courses have?


  Some ideas I have:


  Naming your favorite 3 holes ends in 10+ holes mentioned.


Can’t think of another course like it. It is unique in its specialness.


Interesting throughout the hole for almost all of the holes.

[Ira Fishman]

An interesting question.


The courses that I consider to be the best among those I have played:


Lahinch
CPC
North Berwick
Pinehurst 2


Common element: brilliant features across the course that are difficult to find anywhere else.


Next group:


Somerset Hills
Friar’s Head
Bandon Trails
Golspie


Common element: weaving together holes across different land forms.


Next group:


Ballyneal
Swinley Forest
St.George’s Hill
Pasatiempo


Common element: routing that flows like a great novel or musical composition.


Final group:


Primland
Yale
Blackwolf Run River
The Island Club


Common element: audacious use of land without going over the top.

[mike_malone]

Ira,


  Of your top tier I have played Lahinch and North Berwick multiple times and agree that they seem to be one of a kind.

[Tom_Doak]

I always marvel that Augusta, Pine Valley and St Andrews are the three courses that get the most support for being the best in the world, and it would be hard to name three others that were so different from one another.

[Thomas Dai]

I marvel at how some architects, James Braid in particular comes to mind, was able to lay out terrific courses on terrain ranging from pretty flat and essentially featureless to extremely hilly and frequently did so with very little budget available.
Atb

[mike_malone]

If we list your top three holes on the Old Course how many total holes would be mentioned?


I like 5, 11, 14.

[Ed Brzezowski]

If we list your top three holes on the Old Course how many total holes would be mentioned?


I like 5, 11, 14.

No love for 12?

[mike_malone]

I eagled it but I need to stick to three holes.

[Bill Gayne]

On TOC I could understand how people could make a case for 1, 5, 7, and 11 through 18 being included in their top three.


My top three 11, 16, and 17. At twilight on a Summer day the walk from 12 tee box to 18 green is one of the best walks in golf.

[mike_beene]

2, 17,18. The greens make the difference.

[mike_malone]

2, 17,18. The greens make the difference.

 Watching the Walker Cup I was stunned by the #2 green.

[V. Kmetz]

I always marvel that Augusta, Pine Valley and St Andrews are the three courses that get the most support for being the best in the world, and it would be hard to name three others that were so different from one another.

I think if you added Cypress Pt to that premium list, it would be four that remained so different from one another.

[mike_malone]

Are there similar architectural characteristics about those four courses that can be named to create a checklist for the greatest courses that distinguish them from the very good?


  I believe that naming the favorite three holes elicits at least 10 choices from a group of people. That seems to be one clear distinction.


How are the very best special in a way that the next tier falls short?

[Tom_Doak]

Are there similar architectural characteristics about those four courses that can be named to create a checklist for the greatest courses that distinguish them from the very good?

How are the very best special in a way that the next tier falls short?

There are no checklists - that's the checklist.  The very best courses are materially different, and don't worry about rules set by others.  An example:  The Old Course has only two par-3's.

[Sean_A]

Are there similar architectural characteristics about those four courses that can be named to create a checklist for the greatest courses that distinguish them from the very good?

How are the very best special in a way that the next tier falls short?

There are no checklists - that's the checklist.  The very best courses are materially different, and don't worry about rules set by others.  An example:  The Old Course has only two par-3's.

Even if there was a checklist, each item would weigh quite differently in the overall design. The terrain speaks as loud as anything else.

Ciao

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