[Jim_Michaels]

Might be in the area over the holidays. To you Socalians, is this one worth a visit? I have heard it described as the "poor man's Pebble Beach."

[John_Conley]

Played it when I was 17.  What's the alternative?  Sure, I'll say it is worth it.  (I like to golf.)

[SteveTL]

Poor man's Pebble Beach...  No - well, maybe if you are a VERY poor man.

But, it is a WONDERFUL golf course - and a very nice walk in a GREAT environment.  Views of the ocean on most every hole, and the ocean comes into play on a few...  The weather is usually enjoyable this time of year!  

I've played it in varying condition - don't know what kind of shape you should expect it to be in...  But haven't been there in 3 or 4 years...

Enjoy,

Steve

[THuckaby2]

We've talked about Sandpiper several times before in here... do an archive search and maybe you'll find the prior discussions.

Basically, all agreed that it's a pretty darn good course, but the "poor man's Pebble Beach" description only holds true if the poor man can afford $100+ green fees, and if he really closes his eyes and imagines A LOT.

But John's right - in the immediate Santa Barbara area, there just plain aren't that many courses period.  Most prefer La Purisima to Sandpiper, but it's a ways up the road... Rancho San Marcos is decent enough, but absolutely unwalkable...

Put it this way, Sandpiper is worth visiting just for the holes that on the cliffs above the ocean, especially if one never gets to play oceanside golf.  Just don't go there expecting Pebble Beach or disappointment will be sure to occur.

TH

[Matt_Ward]

Jim M:

I've played the course a few times and I agree with Tom Doak's take in "Confidential Guide."

The course just doesn't use the property to full effect -- minus a few holes on the back nine.

I do really like the 10th because it's such a strategic hole. It's also a rare dynamic hole with the approach -- especially the pin is deep left or right. If you miss being a tad frisky it's adios to your ball.

The 11th through 13th is also quite good but the finish is really pedestrian stuff. The 18th green is big enough to more than handle a doubles match at Wimbledon and then some.

Sandpiper is a course of missed opportunities in my mind. Although the site and Goleta location are intoxicating. Too bad the golf doesn't have the same effect for me.

P.S. I'd much rather recommend making the 45 minute ride further up the coast to LaPurisma because you need to be what it's name means --- "the pure."

[rgkeller]

"I've played the course a few times and I agree with Tom Doak's take in "Confidential Guide."

Mr. Ward

Have you ever DISAGREED with Tom Doak's Guide.

[Matt_Ward]

rgkeller:

Plenty of times ... I don't mince words on any course I play. There are plenty of "new" courses that I have given a very favorable review that others may dissent.  I've also weighed in on number of "classic" courses that I see one way and others, Mr. Doak included, may see differently (i.e. Maidstone, Shoreacres, Skokie, the role of desert golf, etc, etc).

I don't bend or shape my opinions to curry favor with anyone. Simply put -- I call them as I see it.

When I agree with someone I say so -- when I don't I say it also and provide my reasons why under MY NAME. I've played Sandpiper a few times and the review he provided in his book is accurate in my mind. The course DOES have some holes of note, but it's disappointing because of what COULD HAVE been there instead.

[Patrick_Mucci]

Jim Michaels,

I've played the golf course, liked it, and suggest that you play it.  After you've played it, you can tell us what you think about the golf course.

Would you believe, after traveling 3,000 miles, that I met a foursome from my hometown in NJ in the pro shop ?

[Andy_Lipschultz]

If they still offer it, go out early and play the back 9 at a lower rate, since holes 10-14 are actually the only holes within view of the ocean (10, 11 and 13 are great holes). The rest is a snooze. Of course, 10 years ago when the course was much more inexpensive, my opinion of the course was higher--but bang for the buck is another thread.

Have a snack and drive up to LaP for 18 at a course that's twice as good for half the price.

[Thomas_Brown]

Concur w/ all of the above.

I was there about 2 years ago.
I talked to the pro who mentioned they were proposing a re-design.  The proposal was for the holes to out to the cliffs more rather than along the cliffs like they do now.  I'm unsure of the tradeoff.  I like #13 as a dramatic par 5.  I agree that several of the other holes lack something.  Not sure if the re-design ever gained traction.

Tom

[Jim_Michaels]

Thanks to all for your comments.

Mike, can we borrow your helicopter while we are out there?

[Mike Benham]

Thanks to all for your comments.

Mike, can we borrow your helicopter while we are out there?

Currently the Paparazzi have it leased for an undetermined time.  I think they are using it to watch Michael Jackson's "Never-ever-here" Ranch ...

[A_Clay_Man]

In terms of value, Sandpiper don't cut it. As recommended above the 45 mins. to Lompoc for La purisima is a must do.

The course used to be owned by a guy named Hunter. He sold it to that Japanese guy who botched the At&t claiming he was a 15 when he was a 1.5 hndcp in Japan. He screwed up cause he beat a bunch of pros, gross, during a wicked weather fest at Pebble.

Further up the coast in Paso Robles and this guys Hunter Ranch. He also owns La Purisima. It's all family run (was?) and theres a great story of how when he owned all three courses his son and his wife, on their anniversary, played all three in one day. Quite a feat, factoring in the distance.

[Bill_McBride]

Last I heard the course will be torn up and rebuilt from scratch, rerouted to take better advantage of the cliffs and terrain.  I did not learn who is doing the design work.

[Neal_Meagher]

Bill,

The group involved with the previous purchase of Sandpiper was Golf Trust and they are now defunct along with their Johnny Miller/Fred Bliss plans for redevelopment.

As I understand it, their goal was to re-orient the holes so that as many of the greens and tees as possible would go to and from the blufftops, thus affording more of an ocean experience than currently exists.

That is all I know, so I won't speculate any further, even though that takes half the fun out of it.

[Jeff Fortson]

This was one of my home courses when I was as SBCC and I happened to love the place.  At the time it had a very natural feel to it and I could go into a hole by hole description of it but I'll spare you the details.

It is definitely worth it to play it at least once.  I guess the greens fees have gone up a lot which is disappointing but I would still splurge once in a while if I had to.  

I agree that La Purisima up the road in Lompoc is the track I would suggest the most.  What a course.  Difficult and strategically challenging on a rolling hill layout.  There are a few real good courses from Santa Barbara to Monterey.


Jeff F.

[Forrest Richardson]

I have always enjoyed Rancho San Marcos just over the hill. It's a RTJ-2 design lead by Bruce Charlton. It has some unique holes. A few I do not care for. But overall, a very likable course in a nice setting.

[Tommy_Naccarato]

Forrest, I too enjoy Bruch's designs.

[Bill_McBride]

But Forrest, would you consider walking Rancho San Marcos?    

[Forrest Richardson]

I would consider walking ANY golf course. If I were born in 1904 and playing actively in 1934, I would be offended at the design for its walkability. But......I was born in 1959 and do not find myself in that position nor that era.

WOULD I walk it? Probably not.

[Bill_McBride]

I've only played Rancho San Marcos once, but my opinion would be much higher if not for the two half-mile unwalkable legs of the journey.  Forrest, you are an acknowledged expert in routings (I have your book which establishes this!  ) - did you see any alternatives to that routing?  There really wasn't any other way to get up on that nice mesa.  You could walk the course if not for those two treks.  I think the second trek was a lot less necessary than the first, but maybe the architects were thinking, once you've lost your virginity, you're never a virgin again!

[Forrest Richardson]

Having played Rancho San Marcos with Bobby (RTJ2), and also having discussed the project with Bruce Charlton, I understand there were considerable environmental obstacles — in addition to the elevational logistics which are quite obvious.

I forgive the connections between holes. The most obvious comes at the back nine on two occasions.

No, I did not work out in my mind any better solutions! It is what it is — a "cart course", beautifully set and with a few unique holes that will never be duplicated.

[Bill_McBride]

Well yes, it is a cart ball course, no doubt.  I wondered at the time if they couldn't have just avoided the upper level holes and worked their way around that elevated section.  The best hole up there was the 3 par across the canyon.  But I'll bet they could have found 18 holes without going up, and then it would be quite walkable.  The big treks are up to and away from the heights.

What a beautiful setting up there at the rancho!  Santa Barbara does have some spectacular golf terrain: Valley Club, La Cumbre, Rancho San Marcos, Sandpiper, up the road to La Purisma.  And of course weather to match.

[A_Clay_Man]

Found these: The first is the tenth hole. Certainly a butt puckerer if ever there was one.



The second pic is definitly a defining moment type of shot.


All these and more can be found here; http://www.golfcoursepics.com/index.html

[Matt_Ward]

Adam:

Great pictures -- here's a classic case of a layout that would benefit immensely in having a total makeover. I always liked Doak's comment from "Confidential Guide" -- the Torrey Pines of the North.

 

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