[Tommy Williamsen]

The first time to play a hole and get to a split fairway off the tee you have a decision to make. The second time you might try an alternate route. The tenth time you play it there is no decision to make because you have your preferred route. On the par five fifteenth hole at Ballyhack I always hit to the “Front porch,” which gives me a shorter shot into the green. When you get to a par five where there is a split fairway on the second shot you have a decision to make because of where your tee shot lands. I think of 11 at TPC Sawgrass and 5 at Muirfield Village (especially pre-2021 redesign).

So, is there more merit to a spilt fairway on the second shot?

[Thomas Dai]

I’m fond of options so some kind of split in a fairway whether it’s bunkers, hollows, mounding, an occasional tree, even sometimes water is usually fine by. Play past it, play short of it, play left or right, where’s the wind direction, where’s pin position in relation to the green and the green complexes features, how nasty is the central feature, is there something else that’s nasty on one side or the other of the central feature.
Atb

[Dan_Callahan]

Assuming you don't try to fly your tee shot to the top of the hill, the second shot at Yale's 18th is hit to a split fairway. Not sure why anyone would use the fairway to the right. Not sure it improves the angle to the green. Only time I've been on it was by accident when I hit a weak slice for my second.

[Tom_Doak]

Assuming you don't try to fly your tee shot to the top of the hill, the second shot at Yale's 18th is hit to a split fairway. Not sure why anyone would use the fairway to the right. Not sure it improves the angle to the green. Only time I've been on it was by accident when I hit a weak slice for my second.

That might be a big part of the reason it's there!  But also in the 1920's it wasn't so easy to hit a high shot off the fairway.

[Anthony Gray]

The first time to play a hole and get to a split fairway off the tee you have a decision to make. The second time you might try an alternate route. The tenth time you play it there is no decision to make because you have your preferred route. On the par five fifteenth hole at Ballyhack I always hit to the “Front porch,” which gives me a shorter shot into the green. When you get to a par five where there is a split fairway on the second shot you have a decision to make because of where your tee shot lands. I think of 11 at TPC Sawgrass and 5 at Muirfield Village (especially pre-2021 redesign).

So, is there more merit to a spilt fairway on the second shot?

 Tommy




 11 at sawgrass is the hole I like the least. The lay up area has an extremely narrow. If you miss the fairway you are in the mounding full of rough with an extremely difficult shot to small green. I could never hit the fairway.


 I determined it was better to just challenge the green with a club that had no chance of holding the green. If I thinned it I was in the water. If I came up short I had a difficult bunker shot. If I hit the green I was in the water or had a very difficult bunker shot. It’s a hole I would usually just pocket my ball.

[Tom_Doak]

I'm less excited about true split fairways, and more excited about holes where the green and approach are offset from the rest of the fairway, so you have a choice of whether to take on the carry with the second shot or the third. 


I guess you could put the 11th at the TPC in that category, but the fairways are so far apart I'm not sure that counts.  I'm thinking more of NGLA where there must be a half dozen holes that fit this description:  3, 9, 10, etc.  We are going to try to create a few holes like that on the new project in New Zealand.


Of course, the down side of saving this strategy for the second shot is that the big boys are just going to fly it over everything we are talking about.

[Peter Pallotta]

Of course, the down side of saving this strategy for the second shot is that the big boys are just going to fly it over everything we are talking about.

But, if I'm picturing it right, I imagine that you'd find ways to use that offset to create various angles (and related green contours and surrounds), with the long hitters facing the most challenging and/or awkward angles when they choose to get there with their 2nd shots.

[Michael Felton]

I'm not sure if this is quite what you have in mind, but one of the things I like about the 4th hole at Bethpage Black is that the angle of your second shot could easily vary by 25-30* depending on whether you hit the fairway or not. If you're in the rough, then you have to play to the short bit of fairway to the left. If you're in the fairway, but the green is out of reach then you want to get as far as you can down the far right side. If you're in the fairway and you're lucky enough that the green is in reach, then you come back left again to hit it at the green. Then you get to try get it up and down from the front bunker or over the back


If you hit it in the bunker, then your best bet might be to leave it down the bottom and get as close as you can on the upslope before the huge bunker.

[Pete_Pittock]

16th at Sagebrush. Drive is partially blind over a sdesloping hill. If you bust one you have a chance to hit for the green with the ball chasing the last 75+ downhill. Or you can lay up on the continuation of the fairway and leave a short-mid iron for the approach   

[Tim Martin]

Assuming you don't try to fly your tee shot to the top of the hill, the second shot at Yale's 18th is hit to a split fairway. Not sure why anyone would use the fairway to the right. Not sure it improves the angle to the green. Only time I've been on it was by accident when I hit a weak slice for my second.

Dan-It’s a play that works if you tuck your tee shot up against the hill before the rise in the left corner. It’s very tough to get the second shot up quick enough to clear the hill and play to the upper fairway from there. If you take your second 45 degrees right and far enough to the lower fairway you get a good look at the green. Given my choice I like the upper fairway better as well as even if the second doesn’t get beyond the apex of the hill the shot into the green between 180 and 160 out is one of my favorites of the round.

[Tommy Williamsen]

I have been thinking of holes that have split fairways on the second shot and there just aren't many, which also speaks to the paucity of responses to this thread. I'd like to see more of them. TD is right that long hitters will just ignore them and go for the green, but few design holes primarily for them.

[Mike_Trenham]

Two that come to mind that work well in my limited experience:


Streamsong Black #4
Colorado Golf Club #16

[Brett Meyer]

The one that really stands out to me is the 8th on the River Course at Blackwolf Run. The fairways are separated by a ledge and just a few yards and the visibility of and angle to the green is so much worse from the lower left fairway than the upper right. But the upper right fairway is narrow with a forest along its entire right side, so it's very risky to play to it.

It's easily the best take on this concept that I've seen and also just one of the best holes.

[Tommy Williamsen]

Two that come to mind that work well in my limited experience:


Streamsong Black #4
Colorado Golf Club #16

I had forgotten those. Good call. They worked well for me.

[Tommy Williamsen]

The one that really stands out to me is the 8th on the River Course at Blackwolf Run. The fairways are separated by a ledge and just a few yards and the visibility of and angle to the green is so much worse from the lower left fairway than the upper right. But the upper right fairway is narrow with a forest along its entire right side, so it's very risky to play to it.

It's easily the best take on this concept that I've seen and also just one of the best holes.

I never was brave enough to hit it to the right fairway. I should have tried it though. It is tempting.

[Tommy Williamsen]

Number seven at Nicklaus' Colleton River course has essentially a split fairway for the second shot. About 140 yards short of the green sits a bunker with a beautiful Live Oak in the middle of it. Hit it left of the tree and you have to contend with water. Hitting to the right is safer but in order to get there you need to be left off the tee. It is a pretty good hole. Nicklaus likes to split the fairway like this on a bunch of his courses.

[Sven Nilsen]

The tenth time you play it there is no decision to make because you have your preferred route.

Not sure if I agree with this comment.  Seems to completely disregard the question of conditions on any given day.


The 3rd at Pac is split off the tee.  The left side is more narrow but gives a better angle to go for the green in 2.  The right side is wider and generally the safer shot.  If you're into the wind, the play is generally to the right side, although big hitters may still want to challenge the left.  Downwind the hole can be gettable for even modest hitters, and the left side becomes more of an option.

[Tommy Williamsen]

The tenth time you play it there is no decision to make because you have your preferred route.

Not sure if I agree with this comment.  Seems to completely disregard the question of conditions on any given day.


The 3rd at Pac is split off the tee.  The left side is more narrow but gives a better angle to go for the green in 2.  The right side is wider and generally the safer shot.  If you're into the wind, the play is generally to the right side, although big hitters may still want to challenge the left.  Downwind the hole can be gettable for even modest hitters, and the left side becomes more of an option.

Sven, I hear what you are saying. I am probably the only person on this site that has not been to Bandon yet. My point simply was that when there is a split fairway off the tee ball we generally know which option to pick. When the split fairway is on the second shot there is more to consider, depending on how well the tee ball was hit.

[Jon Claydon]

From the perspective of "fun factor," I really enjoy a split fairway on the second shot of a par 5 that provides additional options for angles and approaches.  Lots of folks up in Door County (wisconsin) dislike the 13th at Horseshoe Bay, but I've always been a fan.

Diagram is in this link:  https://horseshoebaygolfclub.net/Golf/Scorecards_Course_Tour


Couldn't figure out how to post a snapshot. 

[Ian Mackenzie]

1. Two holes come to mind here in Chicago:


1. 15th hole at Shoreacres falls into here for sure.


From the member tees, I think it's just under 500 yards with a ravine running down the left side then bisecting the FW at about the 300 yard mark. When I play member tees I hit 3 wood/hybrid to get on in two.


On the second shot, the player has two choices for the fairway and 95% will stay down the right side.


However, if I play the Black tees, the hole plays more like 550 and, after hitting a tee shot, the left side FW on the second shot is an option especially if the flag is on the right side of the green.


2. The additions on the 4th hole at Old Elm offer players the choice of left or right side FWs on the second shot and the green, as flat as it is, is more receptive from the right side FW which, to access, means the player must navigate an intimidating set of bunkers.


Just like Shoreacres, this is a short par 5 from the members tees at also just under 500 yards. but plays shorter The Black new tees make it much longer and the split FW ius more of an option from back tees.

[Mark Kiely]

No. 18 at Southern Highlands in Las Vegas comes to mind for me. Still wish I hadn't listened to my caddie's advice to try to stay up the left side on my second shot. Hitting across the penalty area to the right fairway seemed like an easier path, and sure enough I leaked my second into the creek that separates the two.

[Bernie Bell]

I think 18th at Worthington Manor fits the definition.  The green is offset so that the right option gives a much better angle on third shot, and is more forgiving on a short approach.  I suppose the left hand option is nominally shorter yardage for a bomber trying to reach in two, but it also has a nasty bunker short of a green that's elevated ~4 meters from the lower left route (the right option is even elevation on third shot).  I've only taken the left route by accident. 

[Michael Felton]

I forget which hole it is but the ridge at back brook in NJ has one. Must be around 11 or 12. I don’t much like it because neither side is really wide enough and it’s rock in between them so it’s really punitive.

[Garland Bayley]

16th at Sagebrush. Drive is partially blind over a sdesloping hill. If you bust one you have a chance to hit for the green with the ball chasing the last 75+ downhill. Or you can lay up on the continuation of the fairway and leave a short-mid iron for the approach

Or, if you bust a drive deep down the visible portion of the fairway, then your partner can fly a five iron onto the green, skipping the intermediate fairway altogether. All that is needed is a couple of retirement age high handicappers.

Pete wouldn't advise this approach as it brings a very big number into play with lost ball or horrendous lie and stance. The standard play is drive blind to wide fairway portion that effectively lengthens the hole.

[Garland Bayley]

Sometimes it can all be mown, and still virtually be split. The 17th fairway at Portsalon is divided in the middle by a steep slope that i believe a ball wouldn't stay on. The lower portion on the left is on the inside of the dogleg with no or low visibility. The higher portion on the right gives you visibility.

I played it once in a gale where driver reached a 140 yard green, and 9 iron reached a 190 yard green. So, I can't say much about normal play of the 17th. Jeff Warne would be the best source for that.

[Tags:]

Tags:

[Tags:]

Tags:

Call to undefined function theme_linktree()