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Eric Smith

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: 10 Course Bucket List
« Reply #25 on: March 26, 2021, 08:31:26 AM »
Cruden Bay
Dornoch
Shiskine
Dunaverty
Askernish
Harris
Muirfield
County Down
Ballybunion
St Enodoc
The Fields

Jeff Schley

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: 10 Course Bucket List
« Reply #26 on: March 26, 2021, 09:02:07 AM »

It's odd how some people's notes about the courses sound as if they've already been there and made up their minds about it!
Why is that odd?  I view it as excitement for what you are anticipating which would then generate a bucket list. Christmas is coming and you can't wait to unwrap the gifts you have imagined.

With drone footage, plethora of blogs/reviews, photos/videos over various media, networks of friends/acquaintances who give their own views including this very site, don't you think it is much easier to have views on courses you haven't actually visited yet? A lot has changed since your first Confidential Guide and rolls of film. ;)
"To give anything less than your best, is to sacrifice your gifts."
- Steve Prefontaine

Tim Martin

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: 10 Course Bucket List
« Reply #27 on: March 26, 2021, 09:07:40 AM »

It's odd how some people's notes about the courses sound as if they've already been there and made up their minds about it!
Why is that odd?  I view it as excitement for what you are anticipating which would then generate a bucket list. Christmas is coming and you can't wait to unwrap the gifts you have imagined.

With drone footage, plethora of blogs/reviews, photos/videos over various media, networks of friends/acquaintances who give their own views including this very site, don't you think it is much easier to have views on courses you haven't actually visited yet? A lot has changed since your first Confidential Guide and rolls of film. ;)


Jeff-You are certainly entitled to your own view but I wouldn’t be interested in anyone’s take that hasn’t played or at least walked all the holes on a specific course.

Jeff Schley

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: 10 Course Bucket List
« Reply #28 on: March 26, 2021, 09:28:13 AM »

It's odd how some people's notes about the courses sound as if they've already been there and made up their minds about it!
Why is that odd?  I view it as excitement for what you are anticipating which would then generate a bucket list. Christmas is coming and you can't wait to unwrap the gifts you have imagined.

With drone footage, plethora of blogs/reviews, photos/videos over various media, networks of friends/acquaintances who give their own views including this very site, don't you think it is much easier to have views on courses you haven't actually visited yet? A lot has changed since your first Confidential Guide and rolls of film. ;)


Jeff-You are certainly entitled to your own view but I wouldn’t be interested in anyone’s take that hasn’t played or at least walked all the holes on a specific course.
I'd love to have already have played every course, but my name isn't Paul Rudovsky.  :)
I see this and I can pretty well form an opinion.

https://www.golfdigest.com/story/pine-valley-golf-club-like-youve-never-seen-it-exclusive-drone-footage-of-all-18-holes
As fully as if I visited and played it? No, but when you generate a mental list of courses you want to see, why are they on your list to begin with? Something comes to mind.  To jot down a quick take of why you want to go somewhere isn't a recommendation to others, but a motivation for self.
"To give anything less than your best, is to sacrifice your gifts."
- Steve Prefontaine

Dan_Callahan

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: 10 Course Bucket List
« Reply #29 on: March 26, 2021, 09:29:03 AM »
My bucket list would be too long to list, with so many courses in the US and abroad I'd like to see. But at the very, very top is St. Patrick's. Hard to predict what this summer will hold, but I am very hopeful travel restrictions will be lifted by July and I can get to Ireland to play.

Sean_A

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: 10 Course Bucket List
« Reply #30 on: March 26, 2021, 09:31:28 AM »
A bit of a realistic list based on opportunity and location.

NGLA
Shoreacres
The Loop
Stoatin Brae
Crystal Downs
Morfontaine Valiere
Isle of Harris
Utrecht de Pan
Fraserburgh
Royal Hague

Ciao
New plays planned for 2024: Nothing

Paul Rudovsky

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: 10 Course Bucket List
« Reply #31 on: March 26, 2021, 09:32:49 AM »
Most important in my various bucket lists:


Trinity Forest (TX)
Sheep Ranch (OR)
Scottsdale Nat'l-TOC (OR)
Lanhai International (China)
Santapazienza (Brazil)
Woodlands (Australia)
Lofoten (Norway)
Astoria (OR)
Dumbarnie (Scotland)
Timquana (FL)


Return--all recent reno/retro:


Baltusrol-Lower (NJ)
Oakland Hills-South (MI)
Inverness (OH)
Southern Hills (OK)
Congressional-Blue (MD)


The above excludes new tracks that have yet to open such as Brambles, St Patrick, CapRock Ranch, etc.





Paul Rudovsky

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: 10 Course Bucket List
« Reply #32 on: March 26, 2021, 09:39:44 AM »

I'd love to have already have played every course, but my name isn't Paul Rudovsky.  :)

Jeff--


As per the post I just posted, no one can physically play every course...so with any imagination, bucket lists are always available!!  ;D ;D


Truth is, I have some 600-700 more courses I would like to play to finish more bucket lists (and this encompasses just currently existing, not the upcoming pipeline).  Something tells me that at the age of 76, that will not happen! 


Tom_Doak

  • Karma: +3/-1
Re: 10 Course Bucket List
« Reply #33 on: March 26, 2021, 10:12:53 AM »
A bit of a realistic list based on opportunity and location.

NGLA
Shoreacres
The Loop
Stoatin Brae
Crystal Downs
Morfontaine Valiere
Isle of Harris
Utrecht de Pan
Fraserburgh
Royal Hague



I can help you with at least four of those!

Tom_Doak

  • Karma: +3/-1
Re: 10 Course Bucket List
« Reply #34 on: March 26, 2021, 10:31:51 AM »

It's odd how some people's notes about the courses sound as if they've already been there and made up their minds about it!
Why is that odd?  I view it as excitement for what you are anticipating which would then generate a bucket list. Christmas is coming and you can't wait to unwrap the gifts you have imagined.

With drone footage, plethora of blogs/reviews, photos/videos over various media, networks of friends/acquaintances who give their own views including this very site, don't you think it is much easier to have views on courses you haven't actually visited yet? A lot has changed since your first Confidential Guide and rolls of film. ;)


Yes, Jeff, you were one of the people I was referring to.  :D


It IS much easier to have views on courses you haven't actually visited, and that's exactly the problem!  Obviously you've gotta have some intel on a course in order to put it on your bucket list to begin with, but saying "architect X did a terrific job here" based on someone else's review is pretty different than saying "I am curious to see architect X's work."  If your opinion of the course begins with the architect, and not the course, that's almost as disqualifying to me now as if it begins with what you shot.  ;)


JDutton

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: 10 Course Bucket List
« Reply #35 on: March 26, 2021, 10:36:38 AM »
In the bucket:


National
Chicago
Fishers
St.Louis
Shoreacres
Creek Club
Garden City
Maidstone
Piping Rock
Fairfield


Out of the bucket:


YHC
Camargo
Mountain Lake
Myopia
Huntercombe


Jeff Schley

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: 10 Course Bucket List
« Reply #36 on: March 26, 2021, 11:32:15 AM »
but saying "architect X did a terrific job here" based on someone else's review is pretty different than saying "I am curious to see architect X's work."  If your opinion of the course begins with the architect, and not the course, that's almost as disqualifying to me now as if it begins with what you shot.  ;)
Tom,
Jeepers your tough!  ;)

The one course I said something definitive out of the 20 you jump on?  Although, that is based on not just a simple photo in Golf Digest:
  • 2 friends who have played 95+ of the world top 100
  • An employee at the SNGC who also works in the summer at a club I'm at
  • The fairly voluminous before/after photos I have seen for what they did at SNGC (can't find it online now), but certainly we have the course profiled here as well
  • Why not give credit for the great work to the GCA that was responsible? The imagination was commendable IMO (albeit with a huge budget).
  • I find it easy to say good things about David Kahn. :)
Can those who haven't played ANGC/PV/CP/etc. not say a word pertaining to them? The good courses are fairly well documented at this stage are they not? Media and opinions from all sorts about.


How is anyone get inspiration for a bucket list anyway? I admit TCG turned me onto the Himalayan GC and when I saw the photos I thought, "I can't wait to play there." I could have said, "a setting like no other", based on the photos. Oh well, we love the details here. :D
"To give anything less than your best, is to sacrifice your gifts."
- Steve Prefontaine

Kurt Everett

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: 10 Course Bucket List
« Reply #37 on: March 26, 2021, 11:42:24 AM »
In the bucket:


National
Chicago
Fishers
St.Louis
Shoreacres
Creek Club
Garden City
Maidstone
Piping Rock
Fairfield


Out of the bucket:


YHC
Camargo
Mountain Lake
Myopia
Huntercombe


How was Camargo?  That one in my bucket (as well as YHC)

John Kavanaugh

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: 10 Course Bucket List
« Reply #38 on: March 26, 2021, 11:42:59 AM »
We could start by not mentioning the top ten courses we haven't played. I'm in the middle of developing an app where you contact other people who also haven't played your favorite courses. Everyone contributes $1 and the last person to never get an invite to play gets the pot.

Paul Rudovsky

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: 10 Course Bucket List
« Reply #39 on: March 26, 2021, 11:52:24 AM »
If your opinion of the course begins with the architect, and not the course, that's almost as disqualifying to me now as if it begins with what you shot.

Tom--

Beg to disagree.  IMO, it is very difficult to determine what is the chicken and what is the egg in thinking about the relationship between how much one likes a course...and how they play.  I can build just as strong as case that one player far better on courses that they like...I think it enlivens the "senses" of the player and had a huge impact on quality of play!

Paul

Sean_A

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: 10 Course Bucket List
« Reply #40 on: March 26, 2021, 11:53:02 AM »
A bit of a realistic list based on opportunity and location.

NGLA
Shoreacres
The Loop
Stoatin Brae
Crystal Downs
Morfontaine Valiere
Isle of Harris
Utrecht de Pan
Fraserburgh
Royal Hague


I can help you with at least four of those!

Very fine Tom. I will contact you should I ever make it back to Detroit  :'( . I think I am on the when the Wings are competitive schedule of return...jeepers.

Ciao
New plays planned for 2024: Nothing

PCCraig

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: 10 Course Bucket List
« Reply #41 on: March 26, 2021, 11:56:46 AM »
To PCCraig: my home course is in transition from overpriced desert golf in Scottsdale to nine-hole coastal layouts in Maine.  I can't be more excited!  What's yours?


My bucket list includes all the coastal nine-hole layouts in Maine.


My home course is White Bear Yacht Club.
H.P.S.

Tim Leahy

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: 10 Course Bucket List
« Reply #42 on: March 26, 2021, 12:07:13 PM »
Bucket list top 10:
Cypress Pt
Aug Nat
Pine Valley
SFCC
MPCC both
TPC Sawgrass
Rolling Hills PV
Preserve GC Carmel
LACC North New
Cal Club new


Top 10 played:
Olympic Club Lake
Pebble
Spyglass
LACC North old
Riviera
Kapalua Plantation
Cabo del Sol Ocean old
Diamante Dunes
Sherwood CC
Stone Eagle
I love golf, the fightin irish, and beautiful women depending on the season and availability.

JDutton

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: 10 Course Bucket List
« Reply #43 on: March 26, 2021, 12:16:10 PM »
In the bucket:


National
Chicago
Fishers
St.Louis
Shoreacres
Creek Club
Garden City
Maidstone
Piping Rock
Fairfield


Out of the bucket:


YHC
Camargo
Mountain Lake
Myopia
Huntercombe


How was Camargo?  That one in my bucket (as well as YHC)


Gorgeous, classy, low key and fun.
I named one of my cats after it....

Tommy Williamsen

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: 10 Course Bucket List
« Reply #44 on: March 26, 2021, 12:27:16 PM »
There are really only a couple of courses I am dying to play: Friar's Head and Lofoten. I'll get to Norway in 2022 and Friar's Head next spring.
Where there is no love, put love; there you will find love.
St. John of the Cross

"Deep within your soul-space is a magnificent cathedral where you are sweet beyond telling." Rumi

Tom_Doak

  • Karma: +3/-1
Re: 10 Course Bucket List
« Reply #45 on: March 26, 2021, 12:34:03 PM »
If your opinion of the course begins with the architect, and not the course, that's almost as disqualifying to me now as if it begins with what you shot.

Tom--

Beg to disagree.  IMO, it is very difficult to determine what is the chicken and what is the egg in thinking about the relationship between how much one likes a course...and how they play.  I can build just as strong as case that one player far better on courses that they like...I think it enlivens the "senses" of the player and had a huge impact on quality of play!



Paul:


I agree with that.  When I saw many of the famous courses for the first time in my early twenties, I found I would often play the famous, tough holes well, only to let down and make double on the most boring hole on the course.  People are predisposed to like a course or not like it for all kinds of reasons.


Nevertheless, if I asked you about a course you like, I suspect you would tell me about the holes that you loved first, instead of what you scored on them.  If you do the opposite, I'm going to doubt your opinion.  And if the first thing you tell me is that Architect X or Y did great work there, I may also assume that you know the architect or have some reason to favor them, and I will also be skeptical of the review. 


We have a certain mutual acquaintance who does this all the time . . . he does it with my courses even though he and I have never met.  I can only think that he is trying to signal to others that he agrees with their views on which architects' work should be promoted.  And, of course, there is also the other side of it.

Tom_Doak

  • Karma: +3/-1
Re: 10 Course Bucket List
« Reply #46 on: March 26, 2021, 12:49:22 PM »

Tom,
Jeepers your tough!  ;)

The one course I said something definitive out of the 20 you jump on? 




Jeff:


My comment wasn't meant to be specific to Scottsdale National or to you, really; I played it a couple of years ago myself, and I would personally recommend it to you.  Of course, I played with David Kahn, so that might bias me a bit, but as you say I am tougher than most.


But restaurant critics do not write up their reviews after sitting at the Chef's Table.  [Or before.]  There are many, many new courses where I am more skeptical of the reviews because so many of the reviewers gained access via the architect, and would therefore be even more hesitant than normal to say anything negative.


I have been on all sides of this equation, obviously.  I remember when I thought that Stonewall would be my big break and contend for a GOLF DIGEST Best New award, only to be told by Ron Whitten afterward that not a single panelist had seen it.  [That was one of the cases that made them to start assigning panelists to go see certain places.]  So, I can't blame architects for trying to get people to come and see their courses.  But some seem more determined to become the focus of the story than others!


P.S.  Apolgies; this should really be a whole separate topic, although one that's been covered extensively before, so I won't start a new one.  But I don't mean to thread-jack, so, everyone just move along!

Garland Bayley

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: 10 Course Bucket List
« Reply #47 on: March 26, 2021, 12:49:32 PM »
 
Unfortunately, part of the bottom of my bucket has rusted away.

 ;D

Or, as they say in acronym talk: LOL
"I enjoy a course where the challenges are contained WITHIN it, and recovery is part of the game  not a course where the challenge is to stay ON it." Jeff Warne

John Mayhugh

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: 10 Course Bucket List
« Reply #48 on: March 26, 2021, 01:19:03 PM »
A semi-realistic list, assuming travel is a possibility again:
Australia
Cape Wickham

Bermuda
Mid Ocean

England
Sunningdale (both)

Ireland
St. Patrick's

New Zealand
Tara Iti
Waverly

Scotland
Cruden Bay
Iona

US
Cape Arundel
Chicago


James Reader

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: 10 Course Bucket List
« Reply #49 on: March 26, 2021, 01:50:08 PM »
Keeping it to Europe (and excluding Muirfield and Lytham, which would be on there but I’m playing both in June):


Royal County Down
Portrush
Carne
Askernish
Ardfin
Brora
Mach Dunes
Morfontaine
Utrecht de Pan
Lofoten Links


Having only played once in the US and never in Australia or New Zealand, there’s just too many to mention and it would be all the obvious ones.


As an aside, Duncan Cheslett, JJ Shanley and I have a 3-ball booked at Muirfield on 1 June.  If anyone fancies making up a four, let me know.