Play All Day

[Tom_Doak]

One of the surprising aspects of Sweetens Cove was their "Play All Day" rate on the weekends.


I am sure that I have seen it at a few other clubs in the interim, but the only time I can remember utilizing an all-day rate was at Ballybunion in 1983, when you could play all day for 8 [yes, eight] Irish pounds.


As it happened, I arrived at Sweetens at about 3:00 in the afternoon, at which point paying $100 to play the rest of the day was not such a great deal.  I was still prepared to pay it to see the place, but the young man in the shop took mercy on me and discounted it to $50.  That's one drawback of such a rate, if you really operate like Sweetens where that is the ONLY rate on the weekend.


The other potential drawback is that if the course gets crowded, there is nowhere to go.  I was by myself, and I understand that "single golfers have no standing," but the twosome in front of me were the slowest two-ball I've seen in ages.  [They were playing like it was their 13th loop of the day.]  I tried playing two balls [one into each flag] to slow myself down a bit, but I'd have had to slither on my belly like I was doing a Marine obstacle course, not to wait on them.  When I stiffed an approach shot to the 2nd right after they cleared the green, and they slowly made their way off the next tee pretending not to notice, I gave up and skipped over to #7 . . . but with a half-dozen other groups around the course, including an eightsome playing a four-ball, there was no such thing as an open gap out there.  I suppose this is a drawback of all nine-hole courses if they get busy, but it's the first time I've ever encountered it.


I am curious whether others who have played at Sweetens Cove have run into this problem -- and whether you have visited other places that had a "play all day" model?

[Sean_A]

Tom


I think several GB&I clubs have all day rates.


Ciao

[Tommy Williamsen]

Years ago (1980s) Boyne had an all day rate. We'd go every year. Back then many courses had that kind of rate.

[Thomas Dai]

Two on the eastern side of the Atlantic that come to mind are St David’s City in West Wales, £20 all day and Mulranny in West Rep of Ireland at €40 all day (prices when I visited, likely more now).
Atb

[Joe_Tucholski]

Tom


I think several GB&I clubs have all day rates.


Ciao

I learned that the day ticket doesn't always mean a day ticket and is more a 36 hole day.  At Golspie I tried to check in for my third round I was told I couldn't.  At Brora they let me go out for the third but seemed hesitant (the site now explicitly says day ticket - 36 holes).  Dornoch had no problem with my 4 rounds on the day ticket.


That being said each of these places have single round rates unlike Sweetens.


I've had similar experiences as a single on clogged courses.  It surprises me when places don't pair up singles, but I guess at high end places people want their own experience and I've been told I couldn't join when asking.  In Korea I could only golf as a single if I paid for 3.  My first round at Pac Dunes I was a single stuck between groups and it really does dampen the experience.

[Tom_Doak]

In Korea I could only golf as a single if I paid for 3.

That could get expensive, quickly!

[Jim Sherma]

Growing up as a public course rat I never knew that there was anything other than an all day greens fee. I still bristle a little when asked to pay for a second round.


Must say that I would rather practice than play as a single on a crowded course. I'll play all day on an empty course by myself and enjoy it immensely. That's the real payback to private club membership in my opinion.

[jeffwarne]

Given the first world problem of a course being too crowded with an all day rate, I'd say it's working.
Their error may have lay in letting a single out,into an "all day rate" setting, particularly at a discount.
 


At Sag Harbor Golf Club,(9 holes) it is an all day rate, but good luck as it's a never ending cue, with zero consideration for golfers turning, so the course gradually gets fuller and fuller-often with 2 -3 groups per hole.
never seem to have that problem at The Goat, where the $15 ferry ride creates wonderful separation

[Mark Smolens]

If I were faced with Tom's situation, I'd probably play a worst ball scramble. Hit two shots, pick the worst (be honest), and then hit two more. Good practice, can do it alone, and will help keep you sane in Tom's scenario.


Used to do it regularly a long time ago in our second round at Cog #4 (before the greens fees were over $100) -- a buddy and I would go off after the permanent tee times, but before the twilight rate (which they stopped). By doing this, our twoball wouldn't catch up to the foursome in front until very late in the round, if at all. I once hit two pretty good drives on the 4th hole, leaving me with about 140 yards uphill to a left front pin. I jarred an 8 iron, and my buddy looked at me and said, with his Missouri cracker drawl, "do it again!"

[Phil Burr]

My family vacationed several times at Lake Tahoe when I was a kid.  My parents would drop us off at a 9-hole course called Old Brockaway while they went off to play at Incline Village.  I think we paid $5 for the day.  Old Brock is a fun course that claims to be the original home of the Crosby Clambake in 1934-5 before it moved to Rancho Santa Fe and later the Monterey Peninsula.  The Brockaway tournament wasn’t a pro-am but it was well attended by an impressive number of Bing’s friends who became staples of the regular tournament’s glory years.

[Ronald Montesano]

If we could check a ratio of locals to visitors at Sweeten's Cove (or any other course with the issues raised in the thread opener) we might get an answer. Its site does not indicate any sort of membership, so until that is identified, everything is on a pay-as-you-play basis. There is no local rate listed, either, so folks in the South Pittsburgh environs pay the same freight as the heeled sojourners.


No on-site accommodations means that folks come in, play, and leave. No food/beverage service, or yes? Bring a picnic basket/cooler instead?


Income derived from green and cart fees, plus souvenirs from The Shed.


Does Sweetens Cove have a ranger? If so, is she/he/they effective? Does SC clearly state PLAY QUICKLY or PLAY EFFICIENTLY?


These are the base questions I would ask, before giving an opinion on the matter.

[Pete_Pittock]

Silvies Ranch is a play all day facility. They wanted a different approach from Bandon. One drawback is they promote other experiences at the ranch, charging for them also, without discounting golf rate,

[Mike Nuzzo]

What is their record for number of all-day players? Do they limit the number so they sell out?
A bunch of guys drinking and playing all day long would fill up a course pretty quickly or easily.
I had always assumed the all-day pass was an option.
What do they do with beginners? Not on weekends?
Peace

[Richard Fisher]

The classic formulation at many British clubs was to quote a green fee ‘per round or day’, and I suspect this was a general convention until quite recently. Two rounds at (say) Brancaster with ‘nine after tea’ was always the accepted day out, and of course out-and-back layouts like RWNGC had numerous potential loops for that additional nine. My own PB in this context remains a blissful day at Luffness in March 1997, when we played 50 holes for the day rate, with 5-18 as the closing session. 36 holes at Muirfield next day, and then we drove six hours home to Cambridge after golf. Those were the days!

[Ryan Van Culin]

The only time I played Sweetens was almost 3 years ago, when it wasn't quite as popular. Even then, they had an all-day rate that you could pay, or you could pay for 9 or 18. I believe the way they do it now is to only sell a limited number of all-day passes, so that the course only has X number of golfers at any time. This may only apply to weekend and holidays, though, I'm not sure on that.


I have tried to book online and have seen it sold out. I do believe that they pretty much let the people who paid for the pass do whatever they please, so the 8-some doesn't shock me.


My other experiences with all-day rates are somewhat varied. I first saw it when I was a beginner, at around age 25. My brother and I paid $20 for all-day play, and gave up after 18 holes and well over 100 strokes, haha.


There is another course in East TN that is well-known for the unlimited play rate. They have 27 holes, so I have never had an issue with overcrowding there.


I think Sweetens is a unicorn in many ways, not the least of which being that it is an elite 9-hole course, which is very rare.

[John Emerson]

Isn’t there motto “slow players will be asked to leave?”

[Tom_Doak]

The classic formulation at many British clubs was to quote a green fee ‘per round or day’, and I suspect this was a general convention until quite recently. Two rounds at (say) Brancaster with ‘nine after tea’ was always the accepted day out, and of course out-and-back layouts like RWNGC had numerous potential loops for that additional nine. My own PB in this context remains a blissful day at Luffness in March 1997, when we played 50 holes for the day rate, with 5-18 as the closing session. 36 holes at Muirfield next day, and then we drove six hours home to Cambridge after golf. Those were the days!

I recently purchased a copy of Patric Dickinson's lovely golf book, and I just noticed that in the back of it there was an Appendix, with details of the various courses as of 1951.  Nearly all of the green fees are quoted per day.  For example, Ganton was 5 shillings a day weekdays, 10s. Saturday and one pound on Sundays and Bank Holidays.  Or you could pay £4 for a month! 


Posh places like Sunningdale and Walton Heath were also one pound for the day on the weekend.  St. Andrews, on the other hand, was 3s. 6d. for The Old Course, and 2s. for the New.

[David_Tepper]

"I think several GB&I clubs have all day rates."

Golspie, Brora & Tain certainly do.
 

[Daryl David]

This thread reminds me of my first trip to Lofoton Links. Since I was anxious to see the course, I headed out there around 2pm even though I had no tee time that day. The guy in the shop said no problem, they could get me out and rung up the all day rate on the till. When I gave him a quizzical look, he reminded me that the sun would be up pretty much the whole night and I was free to play as much as I wanted for the next 24 hours!  A true “all day” rate.

[Peter Flory]

Lawsonia has a play all day rate. 

[Jerry Kluger]

A bit of topic but an experience I had as a single was one of the worst experiences I have had in golf.  I was a member of TPC Avenel around 1993 and I was paired up with an unaccompanied threesome which had paid some exorbitant guest fee and they inquired with the starter if they could play as a threesome so the starter contacted the golf shop and was told that if they paid an additional unaccompanied guest fee they could play as a threesome which they did and I as a member was prevented from going out to play.  BTW: the PGA Tour owned TPC Avenel.

[Tom_Doak]

A bit of topic but an experience I had as a single was one of the worst experiences I have had in golf.  I was a member of TPC Avenel around 1993 and I was paired up with an unaccompanied threesome which had paid some exorbitant guest fee and they inquired with the starter if they could play as a threesome so the starter contacted the golf shop and was told that if they paid an additional unaccompanied guest fee they could play as a threesome which they did and I as a member was prevented from going out to play.  BTW: the PGA Tour owned TPC Avenel.

Ouch.  "Non Tour players have no standing."

[jeffwarne]

Given the curious absence of JK on this, I have to ask.


Which is the bigger affront?
having to pay an all day rate as an 18 (or in this case 9) hole hit and runner...?
or?
Having a green fee with cart included even if you intend to walk...
 

[Tim Martin]

I remember playing Lockwood Golf Links(NC) which opened in the late 1980’s with an All Day rate. You could only get one time and then hope you can get back out in the afternoon depending on how stacked the tee sheet is. If you got thirty six holes it was a sun up to sun down day with lunch in between.

[Kyle Harris]

Tom


I think several GB&I clubs have all day rates.


Ciao

They also, mercifully, still follow the old right-of-way rules which used to be codified in the RoG.


I miss those. It becomes clear if you understand them WHY single golfers have no place on the golf course and that there is a difference between a four-ball, a foursome, and a group of 4 singles.