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V. Kmetz

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OT - Top 10 of non majors winners 1935 - 2010?
« on: March 05, 2021, 06:51:40 PM »
Who is on the short list of best to never win a big one?


To qualify, you must have started after 1935 and have been playing as of 2010.


Is it simply the WGHoF minus major winners?
Or something else?



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"The tee shot must first be hit straight and long between a vast bunker on the left which whispers 'slice' in the player's ear, and a wilderness on the right which induces a hurried hook." -

JESII

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Re: OT - Top 10 of non majors winners 1935 - 2010?
« Reply #1 on: March 05, 2021, 07:05:25 PM »
Have to imagine Colin Montgomerie is at the top of this list. 7 consecutive OoM titles and great Ryder Cup presence.
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V. Kmetz

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Re: OT - Top 10 of non majors winners 1935 - 2010?
« Reply #2 on: March 05, 2021, 07:06:13 PM »
Yes, that makes sense...Monty...

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"The tee shot must first be hit straight and long between a vast bunker on the left which whispers 'slice' in the player's ear, and a wilderness on the right which induces a hurried hook." -

David_Tepper

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Re: OT - Top 10 of non majors winners 1935 - 2010?
« Reply #3 on: March 05, 2021, 07:06:39 PM »
From Europe, Lee Westwood & Colin Montgomerie.
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V. Kmetz

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Re: OT - Top 10 of non majors winners 1935 - 2010?
« Reply #4 on: March 05, 2021, 07:08:59 PM »
Def... Westwood too!
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"The tee shot must first be hit straight and long between a vast bunker on the left which whispers 'slice' in the player's ear, and a wilderness on the right which induces a hurried hook." -

David_Tepper

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Re: OT - Top 10 of non majors winners 1935 - 2010?
« Reply #5 on: March 05, 2021, 07:12:27 PM »
Going thru the list of the golfers with the most wins on the PGA Tour, it is hard to find anyone in the Top 50 (starting after 1935) who has not won a major.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_golfers_with_most_PGA_Tour_wins

From the list of Euro Tour winners, Sam Torrance and Miguel Angel Jimenez (with 21 wins each) merit consideration.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_golfers_with_most_European_Tour_wins






 
« Last Edit: March 05, 2021, 07:16:31 PM by David_Tepper »
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David_Tepper

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Re: OT - Top 10 of non majors winners 1935 - 2010?
« Reply #6 on: March 05, 2021, 07:28:15 PM »
Some others below the Top 50:

Mike Souchak - 15 wins
Dave Hill - 13 wins
Bruce Lietzke - 13 wins
Calvin Peete - 12 wins
Wayne Levi- 12 wins
John Cook - 11 wins
 
Gil Morgan won just 7 times, but he had 21 2nd place finishes and 21 3rd place finishes.
« Last Edit: March 05, 2021, 07:36:49 PM by David_Tepper »
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JMEvensky

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Re: OT - Top 10 of non majors winners 1935 - 2010?
« Reply #7 on: March 05, 2021, 07:43:32 PM »
Quote from: David_Tepper on March 05, 2021, 07:06:39 PM

From Europe, Lee Westwood & Colin Montgomerie.





My 2 also.
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Dónal Ó Ceallaigh

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Re: OT - Top 10 of non majors winners 1935 - 2010?
« Reply #8 on: March 05, 2021, 08:01:39 PM »
Dai Rees and Christy O'Connor Snr from the European side. I don't know the reasons why they never played in the 3 US majors (I suspect invites were the issue, but O'Connor once said he could not afford to travel to the Masters), but they were two of the top European players in the 1950-1970 period.
« Last Edit: March 05, 2021, 08:05:42 PM by Dónal Ó Ceallaigh »
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David_Tepper

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Re: OT - Top 10 of non majors winners 1935 - 2010?
« Reply #9 on: March 05, 2021, 08:09:28 PM »
Peter Oosterhius also merits consideration - 10 wins on the Euro Tour and was winner of the Order of Merit 4 years in a row (1971-74). Twice runner-up at the Open.


And don't forget Neil Coles!

Neil Chapman Coles, MBE (born 26 September 1934) is an English professional golfer. Coles had a successful career in European golf, winning 29 important tournaments between 1956 and 1982. After reaching 50, he won a further 14 important Seniors tournaments between 1985 and 2002, winning his final European Seniors Tour event at the age of 67. He also played in eight Ryder Cup matches between 1961 and 1977.[1]

 
« Last Edit: March 05, 2021, 08:28:58 PM by David_Tepper »
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jeffwarne

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Re: OT - Top 10 of non majors winners 1935 - 2010?
« Reply #10 on: March 05, 2021, 08:35:49 PM »
Lietzke a good choice-took summers off


Poulter-3 PGA Tour, including 2 WGCs
10 additional Euro wins



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Peter Pallotta

Re: OT - Top 10 of non majors winners 1935 - 2010?
« Reply #11 on: March 05, 2021, 08:44:30 PM »
We always forget Scott Hoch. We talk strength/depth of field when arguing about Nicklaus vs Woods, i.e. 'who'd they beat to win their majors'. Well, Scott Hoch won 11 times on the PGA Tour at a time when it featured a much deeper/stronger field than the Euro Tour did -- and when a very significant majority of the world's best golfers played in America week after week.

Bruce Lietzke is a good choice too; I saw Ben Crenshaw in an interview marveling and being envious of his sheer/natural talent.

« Last Edit: March 05, 2021, 08:50:40 PM by Peter Pallotta »
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David_Tepper

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Re: OT - Top 10 of non majors winners 1935 - 2010?
« Reply #12 on: March 05, 2021, 09:45:23 PM »
Peter P. -

Yes, Scott Hoch certainly merits consideration. Winning more than 10 times on the PGA Tour is a great accomplishment. But I am not sure it he would have had a whole lot more success on the Euro Tour of his time as he would have been competing against Faldo, Ballesteros, Langer, Woosnam, Lyle, Torrance, Jimenez, Mark James, etc. No easy pickings there! :)

DT
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Matthew Rose

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Re: OT - Top 10 of non majors winners 1935 - 2010?
« Reply #13 on: March 05, 2021, 11:11:43 PM »
I was thinking Steve Stricker and Kenny Perry might be in the conversation.

Are we counting people who won senior majors?



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V. Kmetz

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Re: OT - Top 10 of non majors winners 1935 - 2010?
« Reply #14 on: March 05, 2021, 11:48:37 PM »
So far, the compendium is (going roughly backwards in time)

  • Westwood
  • Poulter
  • Stricker
  • Monty
  • Jimenez
  • Perry
  • Hoch
  • Cook
  • Torrance
  • Morgan
  • Levi
  • Peete
  • Lietzke
  • Elder
  • Crampton
  • Oosterhuis
  • Sanders
  • Dave Hill
  • Souchak
  • O'Connor Sr.
  • Rees
  • Coles
  • Huggett
  • Allis
  • Hunt
You don't have to, but I'm starting to put this against the list of the best 25/75 ONE-time major winners in the time frame: (stopping PGA winners at 1958 Match/Stroke change)

These are not ranked yet, just numbered for my own clarity; but the list is expanded to 25 from just my own "best of one-time winners" to include input from others
  • Couples
  • Calcavechhia
  • Wadkins
  • Love III
  • January
  • Geiberger
  • Charles
  • Lehman
  • Furyk
  • Leonard
  • Weiskopf
  • Nagle
  • Garcia
  • Stadler
  • Mangrum
  • Littler
  • Toms
  • Rose
  • Brewer
  • Kite
  • DeVicenzo
  • A. Scott
  • Duval
  • Oousthuizen
  • Azinger
(Not making my list of 25 best one-time winners)

26. Nichols. 27. Aaron; 28. Mahaffey 29. Azinger, 30. Woosnam;
31 Duval, 32. Todd Hamilton 33. Curtis; 34. Lema; 35. Lawrie;
36; Lowry  37. Pate 38. Baker-Finch; 39. Rogers;  40. Oosteheizen
41. Bradley, 42. Micheel, 43. Willet, 44. Beem 45. Grady
46. Sluman 47. Marr. 48. J Barber. 49. Rosburg 50. Jy. Hebert
51. DeVicenzo; 52. Immelman, 53. Weir; 54. Archer 55. Wall;
56. Keiser; 57. Steve Jones; 58. Goalby 59. Harmon; 60. Coody; 
61. A. Scott; 62; McDowell; 63. Pavin; 64. S. Simpson; 65. Mayer
66. Furgol; 67; Fleck; 68. Worsham. 69. Dufner 70. Cink
71..B. Hamilton, 72. Ferrier, 73. Finsterwald 74. Venturi; 75. L. Graham;
76. Tway; 77. Elkington; 78. Sutton 79. Campbell
« Last Edit: March 07, 2021, 02:29:35 PM by V. Kmetz »
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"The tee shot must first be hit straight and long between a vast bunker on the left which whispers 'slice' in the player's ear, and a wilderness on the right which induces a hurried hook." -

Jeff Schley

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Re: OT - Top 10 of non majors winners 1935 - 2010?
« Reply #15 on: March 06, 2021, 12:56:55 AM »
When I come up with my list I get almost exclusively UK golfers.
1. Monty2. Westwood3. Hoch4. Casey5. Poulter6. Donald7. Stricker8. Leitzke9. Fowler10. Charlie Sifford - started in his 30's
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AJ_Foote

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Re: OT - Top 10 of non majors winners 1935 - 2010?
« Reply #16 on: March 06, 2021, 01:38:17 AM »
Jumbo Ozaki and Isao Aoki?


114 and 80 professional wins respectively.


Of course they didn't play much outside Japan, but would love to get an opinion from those who saw them up close - maybe Clayts or Pat Burke (or others).


Andrew
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V. Kmetz

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Re: OT - Top 10 of non majors winners 1935 - 2010?
« Reply #17 on: March 06, 2021, 01:43:50 AM »
Quote from: Jeff Schley on March 06, 2021, 12:56:55 AM
When I come up with my list I get almost exclusively UK golfers.
1. Monty2. Westwood3. Hoch4. Casey5. Poulter6. Donald7. Stricker8. Leitzke9. Fowler10. Charlie Sifford - started in his 30's


We all missed Donald... I didn't include Fowler because he wasn't playing as of 2010 (?) or am I wrong?


Sifford reminds me of the other African-American stalwarts, Elder and Jim Thorpe. I've mentioned in these pages before that one of the cool things in my golf life was watching Jim Thorpe hold court with the old-timers in the WF caddy yard, during the 1984 Open. That was as funny as a Carlin or Pryor or Eddie Murphy standup.
Quote from: AJ_Foote on March 06, 2021, 01:38:17 AM
Jumbo Ozaki and Isao Aoki?

114 and 80 professional wins respectively.

Of course they didn't play much outside Japan, but would love to get an opinion from those who saw them up close - maybe Clayts or Pat Burke (or others).

Andrew


I saw Aoki several times, holes up close as a fan, but only saw Jumbo at the range.


Aoki can go on the list, easily, he may not have played as much here, but his quality seems to belong
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"The tee shot must first be hit straight and long between a vast bunker on the left which whispers 'slice' in the player's ear, and a wilderness on the right which induces a hurried hook." -

AJ_Foote

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Re: OT - Top 10 of non majors winners 1935 - 2010?
« Reply #18 on: March 06, 2021, 01:50:53 AM »
VK, re your one-time winners list I reckon you've missed a current player who'd easily slot in at no. 2.  :)


Andrew
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V. Kmetz

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Re: OT - Top 10 of non majors winners 1935 - 2010?
« Reply #19 on: March 06, 2021, 03:19:53 AM »
Quote from: AJ_Foote on March 06, 2021, 01:50:53 AM
VK, re your one-time winners list I reckon you've missed a current player who'd easily slot in at no. 2.  :)

Andrew


Who?
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"The tee shot must first be hit straight and long between a vast bunker on the left which whispers 'slice' in the player's ear, and a wilderness on the right which induces a hurried hook." -

AJ_Foote

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Re: OT - Top 10 of non majors winners 1935 - 2010?
« Reply #20 on: March 06, 2021, 03:35:21 AM »
Scott, A.
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Kevin_Reilly

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Re: OT - Top 10 of non majors winners 1935 - 2010?
« Reply #21 on: March 06, 2021, 03:36:00 AM »
VK, your list seems to be missing Tom Kite.
« Last Edit: March 06, 2021, 03:37:34 AM by Kevin_Reilly »
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Ash Towe

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Re: OT - Top 10 of non majors winners 1935 - 2010?
« Reply #22 on: March 06, 2021, 03:43:54 AM »
Others to consider for Europe:
Bernard Hunt
Brian Huggett
Peter Alliss, easy to forget how good a player he was.
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Thomas Dai

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Re: OT - Top 10 of non majors winners 1935 - 2010?
« Reply #23 on: March 06, 2021, 04:14:33 AM »
Lots of names I’d nominate mentioned already.
Here are two more -
Graham Marsh
Eduardo Romero
Atb


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Brock Lynch

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Re: OT - Top 10 of non majors winners 1935 - 2010?
« Reply #24 on: March 06, 2021, 05:48:56 AM »
David Duval was the #1 player in the world while Tiger was playing. He should be in your top 16 of one-time winners.
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